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  1. Rob
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       #1  
    http://www.palmstation.com/view_arti...97&flat_mode=1

    Not the best pictures (or the best conditions for comparison), but it's more info than we had before.
  2. pjs
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    #2  
    These pictures are interesting (mostly because they exist at all), but the photographer's use of flash makes the comparison meaningless. The light output level of even the crappiest flash is enough to wash out a Prism/IIIc's screen while at the same time providing an unrealistic amount of ambient light for the 505's display to reflect.

    The outdoor/no shade shots will make Prism/IIIc owners jealous though.
  3. #3  
    The pics do show that in outdoor scenario's you'll be able to see better than IIIc or Prism. A major reason I don't have a Prism any longer.

    The flash used in those pics does skew the inside pics but I'm still comfortable in my order of a M505. And if I'm not happy initially it will go back to Palm under their 30 day policy.
    Moose Man
    Welcome my son, welcome to the machine.
    iPhone 3G, Treo 750, 680, 650, 600 and T5, T3, T, M515, M505, Vx, V, Prizm, Visor, IIIc, IIIe, Palm Pilot Professional, Palm Pilot (ok boys and girls a whopping 128k of memory - those were the days) and former Palm Beta tester.
  4. #4  
    I'll stay with my VDX until resolution equals the PPC.
  5. Ash
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    #5  
    My main concern is the black grid you can see on the IIIc and the Prism. That grid is the main reason I don't have a Prism right now. I'd really like to see a picture close enough to see if the grid exists on the m505.
  6. Rob
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       #6  
    Originally posted by Ash
    My main concern is the black grid you can see on the IIIc and the Prism. That grid is the main reason I don't have a Prism right now. I'd really like to see a picture close enough to see if the grid exists on the m505.
    What black grid? Do you mean being able to see individual pixels? At the distance I usually hold my Prism, I don't really notice it (if you look closely you can see them, but then again, if you stick your nose up to your desktop monitor, you can see the pixels on that, too). I think the Prism has about 1/2 the pixels per sq. in. as my monitor though...(at 320x320, the new Sony Clie has almost twice the pixels per sq. in. as my monitor!)
  7. Ash
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    #8  
    Yep, it's the space between pixels that bothers me. I've tried out a Prism and a IIIc at Best Buy and I didn't like either because of the space between pixels. It seemed it would really bother me.

    I haven't been able to see any space in the pictures. This one: http://www.pdatimes.co.kr/svc1/m500/screen3.jpg seems to show no grid, but I'm worried that it just isn't showing up in the picture. This one: http://www.norpilot.no/gfx/pilotbild...ure_800pix.jpg also makes it look like there isn't nearly as large a space between pixels, or at least it isn't nearly as noticable.
  8. #9  
    I think that any screen with a 160x160 resolution will have those annoying grid-lines. That's one of the reasons that I am not investing in a color PDA. The only color PDA's that does not have the grid-lines are the PPC's and the new Sony Clie PEG-N700C, because they have higher resolutions. The Sony is what I have my eyes on, I only hope that they will start sale in the US soon, or Handspring releasing a color Visor with 320x320 resolution.

    I saw the NorPilot site, the screen was described as a "a disappointingly bad screen", which cautions against pre-ordering the Palm m505 now.
    Fat's
  9. #10  
    Check out these comments on the M505 ...

    http://www.mapalad.org/review_m505.htm

    He likes the screen, but does admit that they still show a grid. (They aren't as noticable though.)

    -Eric
  10. Ash
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    #11  
    I think that any screen with a 160x160 resolution will have those annoying grid-lines.
    It seems to me that it should be possible to create a 160x160 screen where there aren't huge spaces between the pixels. If a 320x320 screen can have smaller spaces between pixels, why can't a 160x160 screen? Maybe I just don't know enough about the limitations of creating an LCD screen and the larger the pixel, the more empty space required around it.

    If I look really closely at my Visor Deluxe I can see the space between pixels, but I don't notice it in normal use. When I just glance at a IIIc or Prism, I see the spaces.
  11. Rob
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       #12  
    Originally posted by Ash
    It seems to me that it should be possible to create a 160x160 screen where there aren't huge spaces between the pixels. If a 320x320 screen can have smaller spaces between pixels, why can't a 160x160 screen? Maybe I just don't know enough about the limitations of creating an LCD screen and the larger the pixel, the more empty space required around it..
    Well, you could go the Palm m10x route and just shrink the screen. That would reduce the spacing between pixels and give you a better resolution (in terms of pixels per square inch) but also a smaller size (would you rather read high-resolution tiny font or low-resolution large font?).
  12. pjs
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    #13  
    My opinion:

    The IIIc/Prism black matrix is only noticable when you concentrate on it. Like when you go into CompUSA and contemplate handing over $450 for a VPR. When I did this, I was holding the display model less than a foot from my eyes. It was how I always held my Pilot 1000, and I wanted to really check out the product that I was thinking of buying. At that distance the black lines were very noticable.

    But they weren't enough to prevent me from buying so...

    Now that I've owned a Prism for a few months, I never notice the lines anymore, and I think I know why. I hold it at a comfortable arms' distance, like a paperback book. At this distance, the lines dissolve. The brightness and contrast (especially the contrast) of the screen makes this very natural. With a poorer contrast LCD (like the P1000) it always helped to hold the unit closer. No need to do this anymore.

    Folks with poor vision might have a problem discerning the characters on a screen held that far away. If you can read a typeset text at 20", I doubt the lines will bother you much, if at all.

    Now, the lack of visibility in heavy ambient light is another matter entirely. That one sucks for real.
    Last edited by pjs; 03/26/2001 at 07:07 PM.
  13. Ash
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    #14  
    Interesting. I usually keep my Visor at maybe 2/3 of my full arm reach. It's perfectly readable at full arm extension. I'd been worried that maybe the reason I have such a problem with the grid is that my vision is too good. If I had worse vision, maybe I wouldn't notice it as much.

    I'll have to try out a IIIc or Prism again something this week to see if it's as significant as I remember.
  14. Ash
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    #15  
    Here are a couple more pictures, with a fairly positive review of the screen:

    http://www.geekvortex.f2s.com/articles/m505.html

    Anyone know when we might see some real reviews from the press of the m50x series? (or when amazon will finally list the m505 so I can put it on my wishlist?)
  15. Rob
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       #16  
    Originally posted by Ash
    I'd been worried that maybe the reason I have such a problem with the grid is that my vision is too good.
    Boy, I wish I had your problem! (as I fumble around feeling for my glasses...)
  16. Ash
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    #17  
    It was once 20/16. Maybe 20/20 now. It'll probably keep getting worse the older I get.

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