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  1.    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    Funny that is one of my theories too, however I still find the 'God is a product of human imagination and search to explain the unexplanable' theory to be most logical..
    Hmmm. The unexplanable is only such without God.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim
    Depending on your frame of reference, they are not necessarily compatible. In a literal sense, Evolution asserts an earth age of -illions of years while the Bible places the age of the earth at <7000 years (unless you count the theological view that there is an unspecified amount of time in which life existed between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2)
    Mmm interesting.. it has been proven that the earth is more than 7000 years old (much much older) so would that mean the bible is wrong??
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  3.    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    I realize that, but the Bible isnt a perfect record by anyone's account so there could be errors. With modern dating techniques we hae proven the dates to be innacurate. Doesnt mean the intent is wrong though.
    Hence the thoughts about "the chair" Perhaps we have dated the "wood" but not necessarily "the chair."
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim
    Hmmm. The unexplanable is only such without God.
    I disagree, many things were unexplainable or god(s) was given as the reason while we now know the cause (lightning for example).

    But God is a good catch all for anything unexplaned... esp. in combo with the 'god moves in mysterious ways' clause..
    With those 2 you can explain anything without a thread of evidence..
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  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    I used to feel that way too, but I recently realized that God is not about logic. God is about faith and faith regularly defies logic. Logic is a construct of man used to help give order to things he cannot explain or rationalize. As is clearly evident with our small children, we do much better when we have a strict set of boundaries in which to operate. We feel safer if we know where the boundaries are. Logic is a boundary. Without it we feel like chaos is pending and we dont like it.

    Just look at how we must explain everythign that happens. No matter what there has to be someone or something to blame. Very logical that there is fault and blame to assign, but does it always make sense? If we beat at it long enough sure, but why. Like the old Bud commercials, why ask why? Because we feel inferior if we canat explain something down to the last little detail in terms we can touch and see.

    You have to let go of the logic to see and understand God. Think of Obi-wan instructing Luke the first time with the training ball and his lightsaber. "let go" he said and Luke argued he couldnt see with the blast shield down. Not logical but once he did let go of the logic he was able to "see" without it.

    Any of that makes sense?
    I hear what you are saying, but to me it sounds very scary and very sensitive for abuse.. ie do as the church says is right and dont question it..

    I find you should (be able to) question everything. It causes openness and hence less chance of abuse..
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  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    I disagree, many things were unexplainable or god(s) was given as the reason while we now know the cause (lightning for example).

    But God is a good catch all for anything unexplaned... esp. in combo with the 'god moves in mysterious ways' clause..
    With those 2 you can explain anything without a thread of evidence..
    Ye of little faith...
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    Mmm interesting.. it has been proven that the earth is more than 7000 years old (much much older) so would that mean the bible is wrong??
    Yes - if one could find this specific claim.
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  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    Ye of little faith...
    You make it sound like that is a bad thing
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  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by phurth
    Yes - if one could find this specific claim.
    shopharim is this written somewhere in the bible?
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    #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    shopharim is this written somewhere in the bible?
    Not Shopharim, but exactly what are you asking is in the Bible
  11. #31  
    shopharim is this written somewhere in the bible?
    Various dates have been inferred by looking at the geneologies, etc... The Bible is silent on the date of creation, however.
    Current: iPhone 3G
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  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by phurth
    Various dates have been inferred by looking at the geneologies, etc... The Bible is silent on the date of creation, however.
    It was a Sunday. I checked.

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  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskanDad
    It was a Sunday. I checked.

    wrong.. on sunday he rested.. tsk tsk tsk, you should know better
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  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by phurth
    Various dates have been inferred by looking at the geneologies, etc... The Bible is silent on the date of creation, however.
    Ok thanks..
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  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    wrong.. on sunday he rested.. tsk tsk tsk, you should know better
    Wrong, it was on Sunday. Sunday is the first day of the week and it was on the 7th day he rested, which is Saturday. That's why the Jewish Sabbath is Saturday.
    Last edited by StrangeReaction; 10/11/2005 at 01:19 PM. Reason: Spelling
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    wrong.. on sunday he rested.. tsk tsk tsk, you should know better
    hahaha

    Maybe I do know better...
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  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskanDad
    hahaha

    Maybe I do know better...
    Phew I was worried for a sec you lost your bible
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  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    Phew I was worried for a sec you lost your bible
    Couldn't do that... I wouldn't know what to eat for breakfast, which pants to wear, or any think-for-myself things without it!!!! (as he lathers the stereotypes upon himself...)

    Recognizing that I volunteered...
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim
    Depending on your frame of reference, they are not necessarily compatible. In a literal sense, Evolution asserts an earth age of -illions of years while the Bible places the age of the earth at <7000 years (unless you count the theological view that there is an unspecified amount of time in which life existed between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2)
    I agree with Woof, I find that the concept of the earth being 7000 years old and 4.6 billion years old simultaneously quite compatible. Time is not a constant, time, as we know it, is relative to where, and to a lesser extent when (for lack of a better term), you are. A day on Earth is a completely different measurement of time than a day on Jupiter, which is completely different than a day on a rock a million light years from here.

    When God created the Heavens and Earth, it is said it took him 6 days to complete the task, and he rested on the 7th. Did it say it took Him 24 hours to create man, no, just that it took a day. Well, considering this was before the current concept of a "day", exactly how long was that? And if He truly created all that is known, which planet's day was it? Maybe He wasn't actually here when He created Earth, He was on the other side of the universe, where the "days" are measured in "millenniums". There truly is no way to reconcile exactly what a day means in Genesis.

    In addition, if you are truly all-powerful, omniscient, The Creator, without beginning or end, are we really naive enough to think He measures His time by the Gregorian (which again, wasn't even a concept in Genesis) calendar? Doesn't it say something in the Bible to the extent of "1000 years is a day to God"? If you truly are without beginning or end, do you bother to mark something as simple as days? Couldn't a day be 1000 years, or 1 million years? Couldn't the dinosaurs have lived and died all within 1 day?

    And what if we're still on "the 7th day, when God rested"? Would that possibility satisfy those who are asking why He hasn't shown himself?
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  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmill72x
    When God created the Heavens and Earth, it is said it took him 6 days to complete the task, and he rested on the 7th. Did it say it took Him 24 hours to create man, no, just that it took a day. Well, considering this was before the current concept of a "day", exactly how long was that? And if He truly created all that is known, which planet's day was it? Maybe He wasn't actually here when He created Earth, He was on the other side of the universe, where the "days" are measured in "millenniums". There truly is no way to reconcile exactly what a day means in Genesis.

    In addition, if you are truly all-powerful, omniscient, The Creator, without beginning or end, are we really naive enough to think He measures His time by the Gregorian (which again, wasn't even a concept in Genesis) calendar?
    Moses is the one who wrote the book of Genesis, so he would understand if it was a 24 hr day or an unkown period of time.

    Genesis 1:4-5 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. God called the light day, and the darkness He called night. So the evening and the morning were the first day.

    The evening and the morning would make up a 24 hour period.

    Moses talks about it being a 24 hour day

    Exodus 20:8-11 Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: You, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servent, nor your female servent, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore, the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

    Lastly, the Jews didn't use the Gregorian calander. They used the Jewish calander. You'll have to look it up if you want to know the differences, because I'm not going to spend the time explaining it. Time to get down from the
    Last edited by StrangeReaction; 10/11/2005 at 06:25 PM. Reason: Quote didn't work right.
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