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  1. #221  
    even though these are jokes, I wish you'd post links to things unless you are the author of them...
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  2. #222  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    But in terms of affecting legistlation, controling rule making and the creation of laws, the enforcement of laws, the interpretation of disputed laws, and appointing the people who will make the rulings that determine who would be elected to the most powerful office in the world --

    ya, the dems have been the choirboys !!
    I still disagree. There may be different or additional responsibilities the majority party may hold, but both are subject to the same appication of the law and need to be held to the same standard of breaking the law.

    Do you think the following examples do not hurt the American people they represent? Does attempting to work out a deal with the Oil for Food scandal hurt the US equally whether you are the majority or the minority party? Does profiting over $6 million dollars from pork barrel spending for his state hurt the member of that state whether or not he is in the majority or the minority party? Does committing fraud against your opponent in an election take away the opportunity from the voters of both parties to be able to participate in an honest election whether they are in the majority or the minority party? The first one is almost like the the Jack scandal but in reverse....

    Milberg Weiss gave top Democrats funding
    Mon May 22, 2006 9:46pm ET

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Milberg Weiss Bershad & Schulman LLP, the securities class action law firm indicted last week on fraud charges stemming from corporate lawsuits it filed, made large political contributions almost exclusively to Democrats since 1999, records show.

    The firm and individuals there made $2.78 million in campaign donations to Democrats since 1999 compared to about $22,000 to Republicans, according to the Center for Responsive Politics, which tracks money in politics.

    Among the recipients were New York Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, who is a possible 2008 presidential candidate, senior New York Senator Charles Schumer and Sen. John Kerry, the Democratic presidential candidate in 2004.

    On top of the $2.78 million, lawyers in the firm made contributions to New York Attorney General Eliot Spitzer, who is the Democratic candidate for governor. Spitzer's office said on Monday that he plans to return $124,455 in contributions.

    ------------------

    The Democratic National Committee was one of the primary beneficiaries, receiving almost half the money, $1.28 million. Most of that was from the firm itself and included $500,000 for the DNC's new headquarters.

    -------------------

    Milberg Weiss and two partners, David Bershad and Steven Schulman, were indicted last week on 20 counts of perjury, bribery and obstruction of justice. They were accused of illegally paying clients to act as plaintiffs in lawsuits against corporations.

    ------------------

    Hillary Rodham Clinton and her political action committee received almost $24,000 in contributions from individuals at Milberg Weiss since 1999, according to the data.

    "We will not be taking any action at this stage," Clinton's spokeswoman Ann Lewis said in an e-mail.

    Schumer received $57,750 from individuals at the firm. His spokesman did not respond to requests for comment.
    The House and Senate Democratic campaign committees received $440,365 and $350,650 respectively from the firm and individuals there since 1999, the data showed.

    ---------------

    President Bush received $2,000 during the 2004 campaign in individual donations within the firm but his Democratic rival, Sen. Kerry, received $54,900 in individual contributions, the Center found.

    FULL STORY: http://today.reuters.com/news/newsAr...POLITICS-1.xml
    Jefferson, however, is just the latest member of his party to face questions about corrupt or unethical behavior, all but shredding the Dems' "culture of corruption" case against the GOP. Other cases include:

    Democrat Rep. Alan B. Mollohan of West Virginia, who is being investigated by the FBI for getting millions of dollars in pork barrel spending for his state, and profiting from it. Mollohan's personal wealth has reportedly grown from $565,000 to $6.3 million in just four years.

    Former Sen. Robert Torricelli of New Jersey, who is being investigated by the Senate for meeting with Iraq's U.N. ambassador, Hizar Hamdoun, in the late 1990s and seeking oil-for-food contracts for a Torricelli campaign donor, businessman David Chang.

    A handful of Democrats who've been ensnared in the Jack Abramoff scandal, though you likely didn't read about it. They include Michigan Sens. Carl Levin and Debbie Stabenow, and Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid. Just weeks ago, the media were full of stories about how this scandal would sink the GOP. Now, Democrats and their media friends have grown strangely quiet.

    An aide to New York Sen. Chuck Schumer at the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, who pleaded guilty to fraud after stealing personal data on Maryland Lt. Gov. Michael Steele, a Republican, including his credit report. Schumer heads the DSCC, which helps Democrats run against Republicans nationwide.

    FULL STORY: http://www.investors.com/editorial/I...issue=20060522
  3. #223  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    I still disagree. There may be different or additional responsibilities the majority party may hold, but both are subject to the same appication of the law and need to be held to the same standard of breaking the law...
    just a quick response:
    what guides the depth of my outrage is proportionality.

    Should we get as angry at a $500,000 salmon farming experiment earmarked by a democratic congressman, as at the $400 million bridge to nowhere demanded by a powerful repug leader ??

    Is the crime of a choirboy the same as his priest ??

    Taking absolute power comes with accepting absolute responsibility.

    That was one of the lessons of yesterday's Enron verdict.
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  4. #224  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    Should we get as angry at a $500,000 salmon farming experiment earmarked by a democratic congressman, as at the $400 million bridge to nowhere demanded by a powerful repug leader ??
    Both. Again NRG's argument that "since that guy did a lot more bad than I did, just ignore my illegal acts" does not hold any water. All need to be held accountable.

    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    Is the crime of a choirboy the same as his priest ??

    Taking absolute power comes with accepting absolute responsibility.

    That was one of the lessons of yesterday's Enron verdict.
    Again the choir boy analogy does not apply in any way as I already answered in post # . No matter how many times you try to say it is a no-power-vs-all-power issue, it still does not make it true. Congress and Senate members do have power. Just because one has more than the other does not excuse any of them. If they hold a public office they are not NOT held accountable to the public because the guy across the aisle has more power than he does. THAT IS AN ABSURD EXCUSE TO POINT THE FINGER AT THE REP AND IGNORE THE DEMS DOING THE SAME THING TO MORE OR LESSER DEGREES. (okay, now using my inside voice )

    Again using the ruling that a CEO should have an idea of what is going on in his company is in no way comparable to holding the Majority Rep accountable for the Dem illegal acts, which is what your parallel would have to equate to to hold any resemblance.



    Again....Barye......It is simple. You hate Rep. You want all them in jail for anything possible. You like Dems. They deserve a second chance for doing the same things the Rep are doing. You simply are arguing for a double standard about breaking the law, committing illegal acts, and the identical actions of corrupt politicians.
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 05/26/2006 at 11:12 PM.
  5. #225  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    Both. Again NRG's argument that "since that guy did a lot more bad than I did, just ignore my illegal acts" does not hold any water. All need to be held accountable...Just because one has more than the other does not excuse any of them. If they hold a public office they are not NOT held accountable to the public because the guy across the aisle has more power than he does.
    for the record I am against political corruption.

    I'm also against plagiarism, white bread, and acne.

    If that nothing congressman Jefferson took and froze 100K (and lets hypothetically assume its true) then yes he's a scumbag, and yes he ought be criminally pursued.

    But how can you compare what a Delay could do with millions of bribes, favors, donations, and winks -- using the stupendous power he had -- being in absolute power, being in total control of his "majority" -- with what a Jefferson would have been able to do ???

    When the meter maid gets a bribe to overlook that parking ticket its not the same as when the police chief takes money to ignore the mafia's illegal gambling casino.

    Again using the ruling that a CEO should have an idea of what is going on in his company is in no way comparable to holding the Majority Rep accountable for the Dem illegal acts, which is what your parallel would have to equate to to hold any resemblance.
    Kenny Boy Lay pretended that he didn't know about the doings of his staff -- and that he was therefore innocent of the crimes for which he was accused.

    The jury decided that his responsibility was not the same as an Enron cleaning lady -- that he had to know, or was in any case responsible for knowing, what was done in his name. Being in charge yields stratospheric rewards -- but potentially commensurate responsibilities.


    Again....Barye......It is simple. You hate Rep. You want all them in jail for anything possible... You simply are arguing for a double standard about breaking the law, committing illegal acts, and the identical actions of corrupt politicians.
    again (though yes, admittedly I hate repugs) what I am arguing for is proportionality -- the priest and the choirboy are by their nature different and they must be judged differently -- if we are to be both fair and wise.
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  6. NRG
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       #226  
    More.

    Source: Chicago Tribune

    Note to Republicans: The party's over
    by Garrison Keillor

    People who live in mud huts should not throw mud, especially if it comes from their own roofs. As Scripture says, don't point to the speck in your neighbor's eye when you have a piece of kindling in your own.

    I see by the papers that the Republicans want to make an issue of House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) in the congressional races this fall: Would you want a San Francisco woman to be speaker of the House? Will the lectern be repainted in lavender stripes with a disco ball overhead? Will she be borne into the chamber by male dancers with glistening torsos and wearing pink tutus? After all, in the unique worldview of old elephants, San Francisco is a code word for g-a-y, and after assembling a record of government lies, incompetence and disaster, the party in power hopes that the fear of g-a-y-s will pull it through in November.

    ...

    People who want to take a swing at San Francisco should think twice. Yes, the Irish coffee at Fisherman's Wharf is overpriced, and the bus tour of Haight-Ashbury is disappointing (Where are the hippies?), but the Bay Area is the cradle of the computer and software industry, which continues to create jobs for our children. The iPod was not developed by Baptists in Waco, Texas. There may be a reason for this. Creative people thrive in a climate of openness and tolerance, since some great ideas start out sounding ridiculous. Creativity is a key to economic progress. Authoritarianism is stifling. I don't believe that Mr. Hewlett and Mr. Packard were gay, but what's important is: In San Francisco, it doesn't matter so much.

    ...

    It is painful to look at your father and realize the old man should not be allowed to manage his own money anymore. This is the discovery the country has made about the party in power. They are inept. The checkbook needs to be taken away. They will rant, they will screech, they will wave their canes at you and call you all sorts of names, but you have to do what you have to do.

    -snip-
  7. #227  
    That Mr. Keillor is not a fan of the Republican party is by no means news.
  8. #228  
    I will tell you what.....if the "Culture of Corruption" campaign is going to pushed forward during the coming elections by either side....it is going to be one of biggest mud slinging fights that I can recall. Both sides have more than enough ammo.

    Heard a quip of this on Sat Radio today on one of the Big 3 news channels:

    Bin Laden family gave $1 million to Carter
    Ex-president reportedly met with terror leader's brothers in 2000

    Former President Jimmy Carter's center in Atlanta received more than $1 million from the family of Osama bin Laden, according to an investigative report.

    A brother of the al-Qaida terrorist leader, Bakr M. bin Laden, funneled the money to the Carter Center in Atlanta through the Saudi Bin Laden Group, according to Melanie Morgan, chairman of a group opposing the Georgia Democrat called the Censure Carter Committee.

    Morgan, a WorldNetDaily columnist, based her claim on papers she acquired from the Carter Center.

    She points to a report showing Carter met with 10 of Osama bin Laden's brothers early in 2000. The former president and his wife, Rosalyn, followed up the meeting with a breakfast with Bakr bin Laden in September 2000 and secured the first $200,000 towards the more than $1 million that has gone to the Carter Center.

    Morgan says the connection between Carter and the bin Laden family is exactly the kind of charge leveled by Michael Moore against President Bush in the film "Fahrenheit 9/11."

    ----------------------

    The Carters hosted Moore in the presidential viewing box at the 2004 Democratic National Convention while former President Bill Clinton addressed the delegates.

    Gibson said the Carter Center declined the opportunity to respond to the charges.

    --------------------------

    Carter was linked with a key figure in the U.N.'s oil-for-food scandal, Samir Vincent, who pleaded guilty to participating in numerous illegal activities.

    Vincent admitted to receiving allocations for more than 9 million barrels of oil between 1996 and 2003 in return for serving as an agent of Saddam Hussein's regime. He worked at Hussein's direction, lobbying U.S. and U.N. officials to end sanctions and to instead implement the oil-for-food scam.

    The first documented contact between Carter and Vincent was in September 1999. Vincent had organized a tour of Iraqi religious leaders to meet with individuals in the United States who might be persuaded to speak out against the sanctions against Iraq. The trip also included discussions of ways to oppose U.S. and British air strikes against Iraqi missile batteries in southern Iraq, which had fired on American and British aircraft engaged in enforcing the southern "No Fly Zone."

    FULL STORY: http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=50468
  9. #229  
    The Prob Is Bush, He Is Out Of Touch.....
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
  10. #230  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    I will tell you what.....if the "Culture of Corruption" campaign is going to pushed forward during the coming elections by either side....it is going to be one of biggest mud slinging fights that I can recall. Both sides have more than enough ammo.

    Heard a quip of this on Sat Radio today on one of the Big 3 news channels:

    Bin Laden family gave $1 million to Carter
    Ex-president reportedly met with terror leader's brothers in 2000
    Wow! Your referenced sources are usually a lot more sane than that.
  11. #231  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Wow! Your referenced sources are usually a lot more sane than that.
    I thought you were against shooting the messenger.
  12. #232  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    ...Bin Laden family gave $1 million to Carter
    Ex-president reportedly met with terror leader's brothers in 2000
    hobbes hobbes hobbes ---

    jeez man -- you need to turn off faux news and break open the Britanica more often.

    Mr. James Carter has not been an elected official in the United States of America since January 1981. (25 years !!!)

    You may want to look up a Mr. George Herbert Walker Bush -- he's real real friendly with the Bin Ladens. And his son is supposed to be the president of somethin'...
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  13. #233  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    hobbes hobbes hobbes ---

    jeez man -- you need to turn off faux news and break open the Britanica more often.

    Mr. James Carter has not been an elected official in the United States of America since January 1981. (25 years !!!)
    Barye...Barye...Barye ---

    Uhm....ya...former Pres generally do not hold any further public office....but the implications are interesting none the less if proven to be true due to the the situations he puts himself into.

    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    he's real real friendly with the Bin Ladens
    And please cite your reference above, unless this is another one of your baseless hate motivated political agenda driven claims.
  14. NRG
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       #234  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    I will tell you what.....if the "Culture of Corruption" campaign is going to pushed forward during the coming elections by either side....it is going to be one of biggest mud slinging fights that I can recall. Both sides have more than enough ammo.

    Heard a quip of this on Sat Radio today on one of the Big 3 news channels:

    Bin Laden family gave $1 million to Carter
    Ex-president reportedly met with terror leader's brothers in 2000
    Oh, boy! I hope they aren't going to bark up that tree.
  15. #235  
    No...I don't think it is an election issue. Just interesting at the moment, as it is currently only allegations.
  16. NRG
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       #236  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal

    And please cite your reference above, unless this is another one of your baseless hate motivated political agenda driven claims.
    One of the Bin Laden's were meeting w/ GHWB on 9/11. I think it was a Carlye Group meeting. I will find a source. Just being lazy, sorry.
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