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  1. NRG
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    #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by Hizd4Life
    "one nation under god" It does not specify what god one nation is under. Most religion has a particular god. So not being able to recite what the nation(US) was built on is a bunch of crap. I will stand and say it proudly because I am an American!!!


    I pledge Allegiance to the flag
    of the United States of America
    and to the Republic for which it stands,
    one nation under God, indivisible,
    with Liberty and Justice for all.


    Amen... May god bless us all!
    You didn't read that article I posted, did you? Here is the original Pledge:

    Source: Some Damn Site

    'I pledge allegiance to my Flag and (to*) the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.'
    "Under God" was not added to it till the 50's.
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    As the way I see it, it (In God We Trust) was added during the 50's around the whole "religious revival" time, same time as the pledge admen. So the way I look at it, is this guy Newdow is just trying to return America to her original state and out of the grips of religion, mainly "Christian".


    It was added to paper currency. It was already there on coins.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by AlaskanDad
    I have to ask the question (in all earnestness)...

    ... on this forum, is there a positive correlation between former Catholic School attendees and present atheists?

    I just think I see a pattern with no value judgements one way or the other.
    I never attended a Catholic school, but I am still an atheist.

    My uncle was a Catholic priest (Benedictine monch) and was also a teacher in a (very good) Catholic school. We always got along very well. Maybe I have to add that he had a Ph.D. in chemistry and never doubted evolution for the fraction of a second.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  4. santas's Avatar
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    #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by naivete
    Okay. Then how about not saying a thing when "under god" is being said?
    I'm not an athiest. I wasn't when I was a kid. But I felt very un-comfortable saying the "under god", so I did exactly what you're suggesting. I felt like everyone was looking at me when I did (of course in retrospect I doubt anyone noticed). It made me feel like an outcast, and exteremely self concious.

    The pledge is fine. There's no need for the "under God"
    Less than 400 posts to get my own little treo icon!
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    #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    Im a HUGE fan of the pledge. But I recognize the argument and how people of non-faith would be offended being required to recite it.
    I'll buy that. That's why I think it would be a big service to the country to take the phrase out. That way everyone can recite it w/o issue.
    Less than 400 posts to get my own little treo icon!
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by santa
    I'll buy that. That's why I think it would be a big service to the country to take the phrase out. That way everyone can recite it w/o issue.
    Some would still take issue with it, probably under some jingoistic reasoning.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    Im a HUGE fan of the pledge. But I recognize the argument and how people of non-faith would be offended being required to recite it.
    It's not just a non-faith issue. Many religions have several gods or none, such as some forms of Buddhism.

    Maybe (if you insist on the modernist god part) you could say "one nation under gods" since not everybody believes in the same god or gods?
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    That is right, it is not the task of the gov or schools to enforce religion or religious slogans onto kids..

    What would you do if they replaced 'god' with 'satan' would you still think that judge was a wrong?
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  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    jingoistic ...
    ...
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  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by DrDoom
    ...
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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  11. #71  
    Interesting Question:

    By the way, the pledge as it stands IS "constitutional." How do I know this?

    Because the legislation that established it was passed by Congress, Signed by the President and allowed to stand by the Supreme Court.

    That is the consitutional process. Is it not?

    And, in the interest of precedent, shouldn't it be left alone?
    Last edited by shopharim; 09/15/2005 at 09:43 AM. Reason: added the smiley
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim
    Interesting Question:

    By the way, the pledge as it stands IS "constitutional." How do I know this?

    Because the legislation that established it was passed by Congress, Signed by the President and allowed to stand by the Supreme Court.

    That is the consitutional process. Is it not?

    And, in the interest of precedent, shouldn't it be left alone?
    ......
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  13. #73  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    jingoistic<-------- reasoning.
    Go here if you're tired of being .
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  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by DrDoom
    jingoistic
    adj : fanatically patriotic
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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  15. naivete's Avatar
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    #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    How bout being an originalist and returning the pledge to it's original state (i.e. w/o "one nation under god")? Got to love using the right's own verbage againist them.
    What do you expect from Frances Bellamy? We have to improve the pledge to make it less socialistic.
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    jingoistic
    adj : fanatically patriotic
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  17. cardio's Avatar
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    #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Again this has been debated here already and I will not go through the exact same debate with the same person when this was hashed down to it's very core.
    ???Not sure who you had this debate with in the past, but I can guarentee you it was not I. I understand you not wanting to debate it again though which in turn means if you are not willing to discuss then you should not bring it up in the first place.
    Last edited by cardio; 09/15/2005 at 10:00 AM.
  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardio
    ???Not sure who you had this debate with in the past, but I can guarentee you it was not I. I understand you not wanting to debate it again though which in turn means if you are not willing to discuss then you should not bring it up in the first place.
    ...
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  19. cardio's Avatar
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    #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by DrDoom
    ...
  20. naivete's Avatar
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    #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by santa
    I'm not an athiest. I wasn't when I was a kid. But I felt very un-comfortable saying the "under god", so I did exactly what you're suggesting. I felt like everyone was looking at me when I did (of course in retrospect I doubt anyone noticed). It made me feel like an outcast, and exteremely self concious.

    The pledge is fine. There's no need for the "under God"
    Try closing your eyes and picture yourself on a beach with two bottles of gatorade.

    EDIT: I have to rephrase. Kids are not allowed to drink Corona.
    Last edited by naivete; 09/15/2005 at 10:25 AM.
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