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  1. NRG
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    #281  
    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyaki
    Please pass this along to anyone who may be able to use it:

    Here is some more info to help folx:

    I just received this email about help Texas is giving to refugees.

    Do you know anyone in Texas as an evacuee from any of the three states

    Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama? If so, the Texas Department of Health and

    Human Services will give them 2 months of Food Stamps with no questions

    asked. All they need to show is a drivers license. This agency will also

    give you information and locations where they can receive FREE GAS. Also,

    if you are housing anyone from one of these states you can call FEMA at

    (800) 621-3362 file a claim and receive assistance for your help. This is

    valid information directly from TDHHS.

    http://www.hhsc.state.tx.us/

    __________________

    Also Tom Joyner is going to be taking collections for folx who have taken in those who had to evacuate. He is planning on verifying their need through the local churches. You can probably find more information on www.blackamericaweb.com .
    Outstanding!! And forwarded.
  2. #282  
    Jmill, have you ever been to New Orleans or know anything about it or it's economic makeup? NO has a very high crime rate and a high poverty rate. It would be nice for people to act like they've got some sense or even decently in thier present situation, but it ain't happening with some folks! Some criminals are going to seize the opportunity as unbelievable as that is right now. Let's try and not lump these thugs with everyone else, most of the people there are suffering and looking for legitimate help!

    I'm amazed at some of the things I see in the world too, in which I will not go into, cuz that doesn't change what it is. It is what it is! Let's put the energy into helping people and not harping on the lower elements in the community.
    Last edited by GeekyMom; 09/01/2005 at 09:51 AM.
    "Everyday is a Gift, A Blessing, An Opportunity!" - GM

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  3. #283  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    Car-jacking gets you a car to drive away, looting gets you goods you would have to pay for otherwise. Both are an advantage for those who do it, even if it is a criminal advantage.
    Clarify this for me then. I mean, obviously it is advantageous to the looter, but are you justifying the actions? I can see the person taking food for their kids. But how do you justify TV sets??
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    Shooting at rescue helicopters does not bring any advantage to anybody. Criminals and thugs follow their own advantage, but since there is none in this case, I don't understand why anybody would do such a thing.
    Thugs, as someone else put it. Although I'm not sure its been confirmed the the Helo was being fired on. I know shots were fired, but it could be thugs just shooting guns in the air.

    Anyone know for sure that the Helo was indeed a target?
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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  4. #284  
    Quote Originally Posted by GeekyMom
    Jmill, have you ever been to New Orleans or know anything about it or it's economic makeup? NO has a very high crime rate and a high poverty rate. It would be nice for people to act like they've got some sense or even decently in thier present situation, but it ain't happening! Some folks are going to seize the opportunity as unbelievable as that is right now.

    I'm amazed at some of the things I see in the world too, in which I will not going into, but that doesn't change what it is. It is what it is! Let's put the energy into helping people and not harping on the lower elements in the community.
    You're obviously missing the point. People ARE trying to put energy into helping the people and the community, and these "lower elements" are preventing this from happening! I just told you ambulances and helicopters are being shot at and supply trucks and hospitals are being looted. Do you think that's helping or hurting the efforts in LA and MS?

    I don't buy that "it is what it is" comment. That's just a convenient way of saying "let the looters do what they want, there are other things to worry about". And I believe that to a very small extent. I feel sorry for those people stuck there, I really do. And I'd turn my head the other way if supermarkets are broken into while people look for bread or water. But when there are gangs of gun-toting idiots roaming the streets taking advantage of a terrible situation (which is EXACTLY what the idiots who are looting jewelry and electronics stores are doing, like there's a need for a free TV or gold chain right now), I have a real problem with that and I'm not willing to cut them any slack, no matter what their home looks like.

    No, I haven't been to NO, but to use it's crime rate, poverty rate, or economic makeup as a possible excuse for this type of behavior is just wrong. What difference does that make? NO isn't the only impoverished city to have been hit with a massive natural disaster (parts of Dade Country destroyed by Andrew were just as bad off, if not worse), and I don't remember anyone down here firing at the National Guard when they were passing out water.
    I'm back!
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    #285  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    Clarify this for me then. I mean, obviously it is advantageous to the looter, but are you justifying the actions? I can see the person taking food for their kids. But how do you justify TV sets??
    Thugs, as someone else put it. Although I'm not sure its been confirmed the the Helo was being fired on. I know shots were fired, but it could be thugs just shooting guns in the air.

    Anyone know for sure that the Helo was indeed a target?
    New Orleans police have confirmed that a National Guardsman on board a helicopter was shot. No information on his injuries at this point.
  6. #286  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    I can see the person taking food for their kids. But how do you justify TV sets??
    Exactly right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    Anyone know for sure that the Helo was indeed a target?
    I guess it depends on who you ask. From the article I cited:
    The evacuation of the Superdome was temporarily disrupted Thursday after shots were reported fired at a military helicopter and arson fires broke out outside the arena. No injuries were immediately reported.
    ...
    ``At the Superdome, we have a report that one shot was fired at a Chinook helicopter,'' Schneider said, adding that the Chinook is ``an extremely large aircraft.''

    Laura Brown, a Federal Aviation Administration spokeswoman in Washington, said she had no such report.

    ``We're controlling every single aircraft in that airspace and none of them reported being fired on,'' she said, adding that the FAA was in contact with the military as well as civilian aircraft.
    I'm back!
  7. #287  
    Losing NO will be be much more expensive than most people realize for the country as a whole.

    Other places around the world: Amerstdam, Venice -- have done or are doing what needed to be done to protect culturally and economically vital places. It is not cheap. (Except in comparison to the alternative).


    Economic fallout will be massive
    By David J. Lynch, USA TODAY



    ...91% of crude oil production from
    gulf rigs has been halted; 83% of the region's natural-gas production is down. Before that can change, an extensive list of problems require attention: from refineries to pipelines, barge traffic, the shutdown of ports and roads for trucking fuel
    . The national impact of this localized disaster will be "significant and protracted," says Red Cavaney, president of the American Petroleum Institute.


    Todd Hornbeck will be at the center of the urgent efforts to restore order - and production - to the gulf's devastated oil and gas sector. On Tuesday, Hornbeck, CEO of Hornbeck Offshore Services, began moving his fleet of barges, tugs and deep-water supply vessels back into parts of the gulf hardest hit by the storm, surveying the damage and providing supplies required to restart offshore production.


    "It's going to be a long, long-term recovery, and we haven't seen the worst yet from a human standpoint," Hornbeck said. "Anywhere in the supply chain that you have a bottleneck, it shuts the (rest of the) chain down. Even if we are, as an industry, able to get rigs up and running - and put product into the pipeline - that doesn't mean the pipelines are secure enough to get product through. And even if we can get it into the pipelines, it doesn't mean we have enough pumping stations to get it to the refineries. And, then, even at the refineries, there may not be adequate electricity or feed-stock ... this situation will bring to light how fragile this system is."


    Midwest refiners who depend on gulf supplies could soon start feeling a pinch. "The longer this goes on and the more difficult this is to unwind, you will see other elements in the (economic) landscape affected," he says.

    Port bottlenecks

    It's not just the energy business that's been caught by Katrina's catastrophe. More than 6,000 vessels annually transit New Orleans on their way up or down the Mississippi River. The gulf ports are major gateways for exports of wheat and soybean and imports of steel, rubber and coffee.

    New Orleans is especially vital to U.S. agricultural manufacturers who ship large quantities of grain and soybeans to Mexico, the Caribbean and South America. So far this year, 59% of the 29.7 million metric tons of U.S. raw grain exports traveled through gulf ports...
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  8. #288  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    Clarify this for me then. I mean, obviously it is advantageous to the looter, but are you justifying the actions? I can see the person taking food for their kids. But how do you justify TV sets??
    What do you think my answer is? You didn't honestly think I condone looting of TV sets?
    Anyone know for sure that the Helo was indeed a target?
    That's what I doubt, because shooting at a helicopter does not make sense even for a thug.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  9. #289  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmill72x
    I don't see how this is beside the point. I think if you're willing to shoot at a Coast Guard helicopter trying to snatch someone off their roof, or at a military helicopter trying to get people out of the Superdome to someplace safe, your community has already suffered a severe breakdown of human decency.
    But what I was referring to was someone putting a gun in their emergency kit to shoot people who try to get his water, and then complain of other people's unneighborly activity. This had nothing to do with shooting at helicopters.
  10. #290  
    Jmill,

    Excuse me, I'm watching the news, I KNOW what is going on so don't try that stuff with me. I know that the efforts are and it is an awesome task!

    You can take my comments anyway you want to, you seem to be the one fixated on what's going wrong and not what is being accomplished! Yes, people are being shot at and there is no excuse for that, and I'm appauled like everyone else but these workers not gonna stop until the job done. I respect them for their risk and thier sacrafice!

    And since you are so concerned, why don't you step away from the computer, drive to NO (which you've never been before) roll up your sleeves and freaking HELP! Or get out your credit card if you haven't already.

    I'm just tired of folks like you on the media and now on the web with your superiority attitude like you live in a bubble or your stuff don't stink! Get over it, or lend a hand to help.
    "Everyday is a Gift, A Blessing, An Opportunity!" - GM

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  11. #291  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    What do you think my answer is? You didn't honestly think I condone looting of TV sets?
    If I knew the answer, I wouldn't have asked. That's why I wanted clarification.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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  12. #292  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    Losing NO will be be much more expensive than most people realize for the country as a whole.

    Other places around the world: Amerstdam, Venice -- have done or are doing what needed to be done to protect culturally and economically vital places. It is not cheap. (Except in comparison to the alternative).
    That's the main point I don't get. How is it possible that there was no plan and a backup in place for filling breaches in the levees? It doesn't come as a surprise that they break, and it is also to be expected that they break because of a hurricane, meaning under conditions of general disorder.

    Even though it was a well known risk, people responsible seemed to be at a totall loss about what to do, without getting any useful work done in two days, until the lake was level with the flood in N.O.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  13. #293  
    Quote Originally Posted by GeekyMom
    Jmill,

    Excuse me, I'm watching the news, I KNOW what is going on so don't try that stuff with me. I know that the efforts are and it is an awesome task!

    You can take my comments anyway you want to, you seem to be the one fixated on what's going wrong and not what is being accomplished! Yes, people are being shot at and there is no excuse for that, and I'm appauled like everyone else but these workers not gonna stop until the job done. I respect them for their risk and thier sacrafice!

    And since you are so concerned, why don't you step away from the computer, drive to NO (which you've never been before) roll up your sleeves and freaking HELP! Or get out your credit card if you haven't already.

    I'm just tired of folks like you on the media and now on the web with your superiority attitude like you live in a bubble or your stuff don't stink! Get over it, or lend a hand to help.
    Oh, you're watching THE news. I get it now. What the rest of us are watching and reading about are lies the media's telling so that we'll stop giving and contributing to the relief efforts. I cited the article which I was referring to, which came from an AP feed. Tell us what channel you're watching so that we can get the real scoop, not the lies that are being told down here in SoFla.

    Since you've been to NO before, why don't you lead the way so that we can all follow you to help out, since that seems to make a difference in your eyes, that you've "been there" and obviously understand more than the rest of us. Are you heading over there now, or are you typing out another excuse for the looters? Let me know if your opinion changes when your car full of supplies gets jacked by thugs on I-10 on the way over there.

    Who said I don't respect the job that those volunteers and Guardsmen are doing right now? I never said that. I don't believe they need the extra danger of out of control idiots shooting at them or hijacking their trucks. Maybe you feel differently, since "it is what it is".

    I've already contributed money to the Red Cross and the United Way and to my company's private employee assistance fund, as we have many employees who will be severely impacted by this for a long time, so don't tell me that I'm living in a bubble and don't see the big picture. I'm sure last year I went through more hurricanes than you have in your whole life, so if anyone's living in a bubble, it's you.
    I'm back!
  14. #294  
    Right, you tell yourself anything you need to. I'm bored with you!
    Last edited by GeekyMom; 09/01/2005 at 10:34 AM.
    "Everyday is a Gift, A Blessing, An Opportunity!" - GM

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  15. #295  
    STFU!!!!!!

    Sorry for the outburst, but this isn't the time or place for bickering.
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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  16. #296  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    Believe it. This is what some uneducated people do.
    This is what happens when civilization breaks down. It is called anarchy and chaos. It is driven by fear and ignorance; not so much lack of education as lack of current information, not so much starvation as not knowing where or when your next meal is coming. (Think no Internet, no TV, no newspapers, and no telephone, not to mention no lights or working plumbing. There was not even public address in the Superdome.) Count your blessings and think "There, but for the grace of God, go I." You can be reduced to savagery a lot faster than you would like to think.
  17. #297  
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertion
    STFU!!!!!!

    Sorry for the outburst, but this isn't the time or place for bickering.
    Point well taken, but STOP SHOUTING and cussing in code, it's not necessary, at least not for me.
    "Everyday is a Gift, A Blessing, An Opportunity!" - GM

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  18. #298  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    That's the main point I don't get. How is it possible that there was no plan and a backup in place for filling breaches in the levees? It doesn't come as a surprise that they break, and it is also to be expected that they break because of a hurricane, meaning under conditions of general disorder.

    Even though it was a well known risk, people responsible seemed to be at a totall loss about what to do, without getting any useful work done in two days, until the lake was level with the flood in N.O.

    for several days NO was expected to be targetted with a Category 5 storm -- for several days NO was expected to get a direct hit from the largest storm ever to hit a large american city.

    They feared the storm so much that they urged anyone who could to evacuate.

    The storm's direct impact is away from New Orleans. 12 hours passes before levees begin to fail from the excessive rain and flooding.

    yet as 1911sforever has said we were "at least 36 hours behind where this effort could have been."

    I'm glad none of us are trapped in what could be fairly described as an apocolyptic nightmare.

    If we don't try to understand everything about this tragedy, all this suffering can again happen.
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  19. #299  
    I was in Los Angeles for the riots in '92 (US Army) and it amazes me how mobs take on different social norms than in "peace time". Even a pre-Katrina thug is thinking differently today.

    As a side note, I wonder just how much benefit there will be to the looting. Even if you pick up five TV's, you'll have to take them somewhere. Martial law is coming VERY soon and the order has already been given to completely evacuate the city. No one will be able to take their "booty" with them. I can't see how they'll be able to take advantage of their ill-gotten goods.
    Recognizing that I volunteered...
  20. #300  
    Quote Originally Posted by GeekyMom
    Point well taken, but STOP SHOUTING and cussing in code, it's not necessary, at least not for me.
    I'm not too good with subtleties

    I try to but it usually end up like
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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