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  1. #21  
    Dear treobk214,

    you continue to amuse as well as surprise me....
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    there is simply no denying the hard truth, clulup that your company...
    So now it is MY company? You know, Switzerland may be small, but it's not that we are all related or so...
    ...no matter how small or private you claim it to be, was still involved in the worst scandal in human history!!!
    Worst scandal in human history... well, if you say so...
    I don't care how cute you try to be here, dear clulup, its just a FACT now! the abhorrent behavior you have so regularly claimed is characteristic of the americans
    Since it seems to be a regular thing, could you please show me a quote where I said anything of that sort? If you seriously believe I claimed that abhorrent behaviour is characteristic of the Americans, I seriously worry about the way you perceive reality... so please, quote me!
    has very interesting shown itself within the practices of your very own country, which up until this point, you'd have us all believe was completely innocent...
    I made you believe or even claimed Switzerland was completely innocent? I never said nor believe this, so please, please, quote me where I claimed anything of that sort...
    well, from what I gather from your previous threads, you clearly find $ 9 billion to be a particularly offensive amount to have mismanaged. well, then, what have we here then now that we find that the UN has not only matched that number in corruption
    I never said that either. I simply pointed out the fact that the UN is not the only organisation who mismanages money. If you care to read my first post in that thread, you will find in the fist line: "For those of you who are quick to complain about UN mismanagement (Rightly so, I think it's good to complain about mismanagement and act against it, but one should try to keep perspective)". I did not criticize the US in that post/thread. Feel free to look it up, you will not find anything...
    why do I emphasize this as I do? well, you see, when I hear others consistently berating and criticizing the US for alleged corruption in tones that would have you believe they themselves are incapable of such egregrious errors, you tend to hold them to the standard from which they criticize the US.
    I really get the impression that you are fantasizing about things I have never written, not even insinuated... where did I accuse the US of corruption?

    You know, there are few things where I didn't and don't agree with the Bush administration. For instance, I never bought the WMD story (see some of my posts from the beginning of the war), I don't think it is ok or wise to violate the human rights of the prisoners in Guantanamo, and a few other things. I think all of the things I mentioned in this respect are related to what the Bush administration does. I don't think I ever generalized and said anything about "the Americans" being this or doing that... you could try to note the difference.

    Ok, time's up... if I don't reply to your ramblings any more, please don't assume it's because I don't have any arguments, or that I think you are right, it just means that I don't see the point of arguing with you and dealing with your rather pointless (in my view) accusations.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup


    I never said that either. I simply pointed out the fact that the UN is not the only organisation who mismanages money. If you care to read my first post in that thread, you will find in the fist line: "For those of you who are quick to complain about UN mismanagement (Rightly so, I think it's good to complain about mismanagement and act against it, but one should try to keep perspective)". I did not criticize the US in that post/thread. Feel free to look it up, you will not find anything...
    It wasn't mismangement. That is actually the wrong term. It was total and complete curruption on a massive scale on the part of the UN. In effect the whole system was flawed and corruption flowed from the top to the bottum. You could argue "mismanagement" regarding the 9 billion the US can't account for in it's rebuilding effort in Iraq, but not the same scale of coruption as found in the UN oil for food program. Secondly the two issues are very different. The former is about stealing money from the Iraq's by Saddam and the corrupt world community and UN. The latter is about the lack of aco****ing of American peoples' tax money for the rebuilding of Iraq...
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  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic
    You could argue "mismanagement" regarding the 9 billion the US can't account for in it's rebuilding effort in Iraq, but not the same scale of coruption as found in the UN oil for food program. Secondly the two issues are very different. The former is about stealing money from the Iraq's by Saddam and the corrupt world community and UN. The latter is about the lack of aco****ing of American peoples' tax money for the rebuilding of Iraq...
    Personally, I am more concerned about our own money lost, than I am about someone else's dealings with someone else's money.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic
    It wasn't mismangement. That is actually the wrong term. It was total and complete curruption on a massive scale on the part of the UN. In effect the whole system was flawed and corruption flowed from the top to the bottum. You could argue "mismanagement" regarding the 9 billion the US can't account for in it's rebuilding effort in Iraq, but not the same scale of coruption as found in the UN oil for food program. Secondly the two issues are very different. The former is about stealing money from the Iraq's by Saddam and the corrupt world community and UN. The latter is about the lack of aco****ing of American peoples' tax money for the rebuilding of Iraq...
    I agree with you that there is a difference between the Oil for Food case and the US rebuilding Iraq case. The former seems to include corruption, while in the latter nobody has claimed corruption was involved. However, corruption is also a form of mismanagement: lack of checks and balances, and somebody taking advantage of it. I leave it to you to decide whether there were enough checks and balances in the case of Haliburton and how those contracts were awarded.

    I also agree with the notion that Saddam was stealing money from his people, and investing it into luxury while his people lived in relative poverty. However, in this respect I think Saddam is not too different from the Saudi royal family. They live in extreme luxury, and take away enormous resources from their people. Quite a bit of those riches were used to sponsor Al Qaida terrorism, after all, Osama Bin Laden is a multi-millionaire and comes from a very rich Saudi family. Of course the Bush administration will never criticise how the Saudi royals live and rule, how they sponsor extreme religious intolerance and a totally fundamentalisic, anti-Shiite Islam - too much Bush/oil money and financial influence is at stake.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  5. NRG
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    #25  
    Thought I would add this to the disscussion. Why can't we have pols like this in the US. This by the way is George Galloway. http://www.edwardsdavid.com/BushVide...q_050517-01.rm
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