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  1.    #1  
    The Supreme Court is considering whether sick people in 11 states with medical marijuana laws can get around a federal ban on pot.
    Any opinion on the matter?
    Article
    Article 2
    Last edited by Dee Zaster; 11/29/2004 at 01:58 PM.
  2. #2  
    Why do you need permission? Just smoke it anyway, if you can't find it just plant some bird seed and wait
    Animo et Fide
  3. #3  
    http://www.target.com/gp/detail.html...sin=0823916839

    I think it should be legal. There are many prescription drugs that are far more addictive and harmful when abused. Hell, marijuana is less harmful than cigarettes or alcohol. Ban those (and we know how well banning alcohol worked in the past) or legalize pot altogether.

    I don't know enough about the specific laws to have any idea what the Supreme Court will decide.
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  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by metsfan
    marijuana is less harmful than cigarettes or alcohol.
    I don't believe that, but would entertain the idea if evidence is presented.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by KRamsauer
    I don't believe that, but would entertain the idea if evidence is presented.
    I'll look for numbers on this later, but: Alcohol kills brain cells and harms your liver; marijuana does not. Cigarettes cause mouth and lung cancer; marijuana does not. Google might be helpful in confirming (or denying, I could be wrong, but as far as I know this is correct) these statements. As far as I know, marijuana is also not physically addictive, whereas alcohol and cigarettes are.

    As far as driving high goes, that should be illegal, just like driving drunk.
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  6. #6  
    Now marijuana is an interesting topic.

    Originally outlawed in an act of racism. Marijuana was made illegal to stem the increase in the population of mexicans. The fact that it is a drug really has nothing to do with why it was illegalized.

    Now, I don't condone or condemn marijuana, but I do believe that some consistancy needs to be in effect. Either more drugs need to be made illegal to justify marijuana being illegal, or marijuana needs to be legalized.

    methamphetamine

    legal for medical use, this stuff is dangerous. Meth, if used improperly will near permanently damage the human brain. It attacks the area of the brain that revolves around concentration.


    Nicotine and caffiene
    Man oh man, the two drugs that can be purchased without a prescription. If abused, these drugs are horrid.
    here's a normal SPECT scan:


    Now here's one of a nicotine (cigarettes) and caffeine (coffee) abuser:


    For kicks heres some of alchohol abuse:



    Makes you think. . .
    "The danger from computers is not that they will eventually get as smart as men, but that we will agree to meet them halfway." -Bernard Avishai
    "Computers are a lot like air conditioners - they both work great until you open windows." -Anonymous

  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by metsfan
    Cigarettes cause mouth and lung cancer; marijuana does not.
    Hmm I doubt that one
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tekara
    For kicks heres some of alchohol abuse:

    Where are the marijuana pix? I agree tho.. There are so many legally prescribed perscription drugs out there that are way worse, and far more abused than the "illegal" stuff..
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Joebar99
    Hmm I doubt that one
    Yeah, I do too, actually. I'm finding reports on both sides of this... I retract that statement.

    The most important point out of all of this, for me, is that there are much more harmful drugs that are legal medically. They say marijuana hasn't been proven to have any positive medical effect; just like global warming needs "more study."
    Units - Unit conversion for webOS!
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  10. #10  
    Oh for Pete’s sake! Can’t people who are dying die with some dignity, and with less pain? My God! Can’t the government let people die peacefully?
    You don't stop laughing because you grow old. You grow old because you stop laughing.
    -Michael Pritchard
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by Oops
    Oh for Pete’s sake! Can’t people who are dying die with some dignity, and with less pain? My God! Can’t the government let people die peacefully?
    Huh, what does this have to with marijuana?
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  12. #12  
    As I understand the current situation, at least what I have read, is that all the medical benefits derived from smoking MJ is available in pill form derivatives. If true, legalizing the use and or sale of MJ is not necessary. I suppose you could argue a cost problem here, but the urgency for the sick is not really there any more.

    Should the use of MJ be decriminalized is another argument to which both sides have legitimate arguments. I am in the middle on this one, but I lean toward keeping it illegal, as you will see....

    Is MJ more or less dangerous than other things we take into our body? From my own experience I would rather have had my son be a drinker or a smoker than a pot head. How can I say that??? Drinking can be done in moderation with no ill effects physically or mentally. Most teenagers today quit smoking as adults. I did. No long term effects, usually. I blame my son's problems today on his long term heavy use of MJ. It is the only thing that stands him apart from my other children.

    I watched my brother and sister's lives basically put on hold for almost 10 years as adults because of heavy MJ use in their teens carrying over into adulthood. The damaging affects are insidious.

    Unlike the dangers of smoking, alcohol, heroin, cocaine, etc., the damage from heavy MJ use to those close to me cannot be proven because you have no idea how ones life might have been different if they did not do something along the way. I cannot prove a negative but I am convinced that they would have been much more successful and contributed far more to society had they not dulled their capabilities with heavy use of this "recreational" drug.

    Don't throw some highly successful person at me that you know or heard of who uses MJ. You or I have no idea how much more successful the person might have been without the ingestion of this supposedly innocuous drug. I will not listen to any self testimony either, as I can only ask how would you have been different if you had not made this drug a part of your life.

    My opinion, I feel strongly about it, but it does not matter because wrong or right my words will fall on deaf ears. Been there done that!
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tekara
    Nicotine and caffeine
    Man oh man, the two drugs that can be purchased without a prescription. If abused, these drugs are horrid.
    Of course drinking lots and lots of coffees per day has a damaging effect on the health of the coffee drinker, but still, you cannot really compare drinking coffee and smoking. Smoking has a far more devastating effect, while drinking coffee is only a serious problem in very rare cases.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  14. #14  
    Just because you asked:
    Caffeine: Psychological Effects, Use and Abuse

    direct copy of summary:
    SUMMARY

    A review of the literature reveals that caffeine is an important factor in modifying the psychological state of its consumers under the present condition of usage. Caffeine is probably the most widely used drug and those who drink coffee, tea, cola or take OTC caffeine containing drugs are all potential and susceptible candidates. Those of us who are "normal" can expect manifestations which may be subtle at low doses, overt at high doses, with the possibility of being the victims of a habit which results in tolerance and possible severe withdrawal symptoms. The pleasant stimulant feeling which often occurs at low doses may be replaced by psychological symptoms which resemble anxiety and depressive neuroses at high doses. Those with more severe psychological problems may have their symptoms exaggerated with excessive caffeine usage, or such symptoms can actually be caused by excess. Diagnosis of such conditions must take caffeine usage into account.

    As a result of its potent physiological activity, caffeine can alter our behavior. it affects our sleeping habits generally resulting in insomnia and hyperactivity. Task oriented performance, attention, and concentrations may be modified by caffeine. At lower doses, these effects appear to be beneficial. At higher doses, we can expect the reverse, including toxic and rebound effects.

    The common "Restless Legs Syndrome" which has often been related to psychological disturbances may, in fact, be primarily a symptom of caffeinism according to Lutz.

    Caffeine has been investigated as a possible treatment for hyperkinetic children since central nervous system stimulants have been shown to be effective in this condition. Results of caffeine treatment are controversial, some studies showing a beneficial effect with little adverse reactions and other studies showing little or no benefit.

    Caffeine's effect on our body, our nervous system, our mind, our psychology is no illusion. It is a potent drug. That it may cause symptoms of mental illness as recently published is no small concern. With these findings we see that caffeine abuse is more prevalent than we may imagine. These facts should be brought to the attention of the medical community as well as the public in order that we may have the opportunity of being aware of the possible interactions between ourselves and our environment.
    "The danger from computers is not that they will eventually get as smart as men, but that we will agree to meet them halfway." -Bernard Avishai
    "Computers are a lot like air conditioners - they both work great until you open windows." -Anonymous

  15. #15  
    Tried it, not my thing but, I think it should be legalized. No worse than alcohol and cigarettes and a ton of prescription drugs out there already. Why should people pay for pill forms when they can grow it for free?
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    Huh, what does this have to with marijuana?
    The government doesn't see the benefits in helping dying or gravely ill people to cope with pain by using marijuana. What's not clear about it?
    Quote Originally Posted by johnbdh
    As I understand the current situation, at least what I have read, is that all the medical benefits derived from smoking MJ is available in pill form derivatives...
    Clearly you fail to see the large picture. Huge amount of money is spent by the giant pharmaceuticals to fend-off the use of marijuana as medicine. No need to ask why, I hope.
    The Supreme Court is not asked to confer on legalizing marijuana. The point here is whether to allow sick people to use it.
    You don't stop laughing because you grow old. You grow old because you stop laughing.
    -Michael Pritchard
  17. #17  
    hrm. . .
    Well Joe, I've been trying to get you some images for marijuana use, but all I can find is ones for severe abuse which is about as pretty as the other Spect images I have posted. I was hoping to locate some images at least of a person that is a moderate to low consumer of smoked marijuana.

    Really, the biggest problem with finding research on marijuana is that moderate users are rarely involved in these studies and almost all users use impure (non-medical grade) marijuana.

    This is actually best shown by the fact that marijuana is listed by the FDA as a hallucinogen in spite of the fact that most researchers classify it as a depressent.

    If the legalization of marijuana comes through, I do believe that we will start seeing the true effects
    "The danger from computers is not that they will eventually get as smart as men, but that we will agree to meet them halfway." -Bernard Avishai
    "Computers are a lot like air conditioners - they both work great until you open windows." -Anonymous

  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by johnbdh
    Is MJ more or less dangerous than other things we take into our body? From my own experience I would rather have had my son be a drinker or a smoker than a pot head. How can I say that??? Drinking can be done in moderation with no ill effects physically or mentally. Most teenagers today quit smoking as adults. I did. No long term effects, usually. I blame my son's problems today on his long term heavy use of MJ. It is the only thing that stands him apart from my other children. ...

    My opinion, I feel strongly about it, but it does not matter because wrong or right my words will fall on deaf ears. Been there done that!
    I think this is more a question of information than opinion. While I am far from saying that smoking marijuana is healthy and should be encouraged or anything, it is proven beyond doubt that drinking alcohol and smoking cigarettes is far more dangerous, damaging and addictive than smoking marijuana. I would really like to see the numbers showing that most teenagers quit smoking when they grow up - certainly not those who have become addicted, and that happens VERY fast in the case of nicotine. In fact, the tobacco industry knows all too well that grown-ups very rarely become smokers if they are not addicted during adolescence.

    In contrast to alcohol and nicotine, the THC in marijuana causes no physical dependence. The effects of long-term use of marijuana have been studied, and even though there is some controversy about this and the data is somewhat limited, the results we have so far show that the effects are relatively mild and mostly reversible within a few months, or even inexistant. Certainly, you cannot compare it to the effects of e.g. alcohol, or the physical effect of smoking.

    Nevertheless, smoking marijuana damages the lungs in a similar or worse way than smoking cigarettes (no filters), and driving under the influence of marijuana is just as dangerous and stupid as driving under the influence of alcohol.

    The information is available e.g. here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marijua...and_withdrawal

    I guess we have to be careful about what is cause and what is effect: maybe sometimes problems cause smoking marijuana, and not vice versa. But I agree that smoking marijuana doesn't really make problems easier on the long run.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tekara
    ...If the legalization of marijuana comes through, I do believe that we will start seeing the true effects
    Tekara, the issue before the Supreme Court is "legalizing" (it IS legal in 11 states!) the use of marijuana for medical purpose! Most people who need it for that purpose are gravely ill.
    You don't stop laughing because you grow old. You grow old because you stop laughing.
    -Michael Pritchard
  20. #20  
    I did not mean to be so general or negate the fact that there are already areas where it is legal. Just to state that we should start seeing better research as opposed to the research of 10-20 years ago.

    Those that require marijuana for medical reasons will have a better known medical history and will be followed a lot better, not to mention they will have a known dosage that has been professionally prepared.
    "The danger from computers is not that they will eventually get as smart as men, but that we will agree to meet them halfway." -Bernard Avishai
    "Computers are a lot like air conditioners - they both work great until you open windows." -Anonymous

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