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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    cell, did he need mr clark to tell him there were things to "fear"?
    treobk, thank you for your comments. let me present my views of this situation:

    Clinton was onto al queda, his advisor Richard Clark tried to warn Bush about al queda in the summer before the attack: Remember the memo?

    "Bin Ladin determined to strike in the US"
    http://www.newsday.com/news/politics...tics-headlines

    Bush's team ignored Clark, and instead tried to smear him later, when he got in their way.

    http://www.salon.com/opinion/blument.../index_np.html

    In summary, I wish the Bush team took as much zeal in going after bin ladin as they did in smearing Clark for just doing his job!
    Last edited by cellmatrix; 10/25/2004 at 11:50 PM.
  2. #22  
    If Clinton was onto Al queda as you say, why didnt he do something?

    What if Clinton had done all this in 93 or 94 after the first WTC attack.
    if Clinton had decided to attack a country that he thought was a danger due to terrorism and or the fear of wmds, would you be raising such a stink?
    if he said "hey I think they are a threat and so does the rest of the intelligence community, so I think we should go in and take them out of power" would you have cried foul like you do now? If he had said "hey there is a threat to the US and I cant risk another attack, so I am going after the terrorists where ever they MIGHT be" would you have raised a fuss?

    I'd say he didnt because he was so worried about his political position. He'd have been in the same battle GWB is in now if he had gone hunting back then. I think he chose his power over what was best for America. Maybe 9/11 would never have happened if he had done so.

    Point is I dont think you would be shouting the same tune if it was 96 and Clinton had started the war on terror.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    If Clinton was onto Al queda as you say, why didnt he do something?
    Probably for the same reason W. didn't do anything until after 9/11, no-one realised quite how big the threat was. The issue is whether W. took it as seriously as Clinton had or whether he (for 'he' read him and all his advisors) assigned it a lower priority and accordingly whether that could have lead to fewer agents investigating etc.
    Animo et Fide
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by cellmatrix
    I think there is room for disagreement as to how effectively Bush is fighting terror. Here are the facts that I see:

    Before 911, Bush basically ignored Clinton's security advisor Clark's warnings about bin Ladin.

    Bush let bin Ladin get away in Afganistan, and instead attacked Iraq, which had no connection with 911 or bin Ladin.

    Later Bush said " I'm not concerned about him [bin Ladin], then lied about not saying it in the presidential debate.

    And this misguided war into Iraq has no doubt greatly increased muslim extremism around the world, making the problem worse not better.

    It is my opinion that Bush is misguided and while he seems to want to fight terror, he is doing it in the wrong way.
    But doesn't this election represent the lesser of two evils for most of us? While Bush has made some mis-steps- some colossal ones at that- there is nothing about John Kerry's past- including 25 unremarkable and undistingusihed years as senator- that make me think he is up to the task of defending this country from another attack. He is a big nebulous of undeclared intentions. He will not state his positions clearly and avoids any attept to clarify them which is precisely why the majority of voters will forsake him next Tuesday.
  5. #25  
    Am I the only sad immature person to scroll ALL the way down the list of faculty at http://www.cwu.edu/~polisci/faculty.html to find BANG-SOON!! I laughed until I cried. Poor thing.
  6. #26  
    Is this structure of faculty staff normal in American Uni's? In a Brit Uni Mathew Manweller would be a Lecturer not an Assistant Professor. Not denigrating the guy, but introducing him as a 'professor' does tend to make people give his views more weight than they might otherwise.
    Animo et Fide
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by JSalviati
    Am I the only sad immature person to scroll ALL the way down the list of faculty at http://www.cwu.edu/~polisci/faculty.html to find BANG-SOON!! I laughed until I cried. Poor thing.
    Just think about her poor sister. Bang Alot
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by JSalviati
    Am I the only sad immature person to scroll ALL the way down the list of faculty at http://www.cwu.edu/~polisci/faculty.html to find BANG-SOON!! I laughed until I cried. Poor thing.
    LOL... I did see it, but didn't even think about it...
    Palm III > HS Visor > Treo 600 > Treo 650 > Treo 750 > Treo Pro > PrePlus GSM

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  9. #29  
    To follow up on Cell's list of things he see's, I'll add a simple, yet complex, question: How do you measure success or accomplishments in the "war on terror?" Lack of attacks here and/or abroad? Incarceration of suspected terrorists? Convictions? Better intelligence? Other metrics?

    Without getting into the question of who would do better at leading this fight, I'm not sure I see a whole lot of progress so far.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by pbryon
    To follow up on Cell's list of things he see's, I'll add a simple, yet complex, question: How do you measure success or accomplishments in the "war on terror?" Lack of attacks here and/or abroad? Incarceration of suspected terrorists? Convictions? Better intelligence? Other metrics?

    Without getting into the question of who would do better at leading this fight, I'm not sure I see a whole lot of progress so far.
    In terms of number of attacks worldwide, they've gone up.
    In terms of incarceration, that's gone up massively, but doesn't seem to be having much effect.
    Convictions, almost non-existent, no-one has been convicted for 9/11 even (there was one guy in Germany, but didn't he get off on appeal?)
    Better intelligence, I don't suppose we'll ever know...
    Animo et Fide
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