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  1.    #1  
    Here is more vital information to consider for all undecided voters!

    they are blaming bush for this issue with acquiring drugs from canada?
    lets take a look at what the other side has done to help us with our current flu epidemic.


    Flu Shot Info

    How the vaccine works:

    Influenza vaccine is produced by growing the virus in eggs. The virus is killed and processed to create the vaccine, which is given by injection under the skin. The body then produces antibodies to the virus over the next two to four weeks. If the immunized person then comes into contact with the influenza virus, the antibodies attack and kill the virus before it has a chance to cause infection. The vaccine contains the 3 most likely strains to
    be active during the "flu season."

    Why the shortage?
    Almost half of the nation's flu vaccine will not be delivered this
    year. Chiron, a major manufacturer of flu vaccine, will not be distributing any influenza vaccine this flu season. Chiron was to make 46-48 million doses vaccine for the United States. Chiron is a British company. Recently British health officials stopped Chiron from distributing and making the vaccine when inspectors found unsanitary conditions in the labs. Some lots of the
    vaccine were recalled and destroyed.

    Why is our vaccine made in the UK and not the US?
    The major pharmaceutical companies in the US provided almost 90% of the nations flu vaccine at one time. They did this despite a very low profit margin for the product. Basically, they were doing us a favor. In the late 80's a man from North Carolina who had received the vaccine got the flu. The strain he caught was one of the strains in that years vaccine made by a US company. What did he do? He sued and he won. He was awarded almost $5 million! After that case was appealed and lost, most US pharmaceutical companies stopped making the vaccine. The liability out weighed the profit margin. Since UK and Canadian laws prohibit such frivolous law suits UK and Canadian companies began selling the vaccine in the US.

    By the way...the lawyer that represented the man in the flu shot law suit was a young ambulance chaser by the name of John Edwards.

    a link dedicated to the subject of whether or not a malpractice lawyer should be a vp or president.

    http://www.personalconsult.com/artic...president.html

    Last edited by treobk214; 10/24/2004 at 11:10 PM.
  2. #2  
    There were more than 20 companies producing the vaccine and it's down to, what, 3? The legal profession and those members of it that are in the "ambulance chasing" end of it are the ones responsibile for it. Sue until they drop and sue some more. Go for the high rates, make it so they are no longer willing or able to accept the liability.

    How can we blame Bush? There is no way. We need to blame those that allowed this to happen. Blame those who voted for the legislation allowing it and for those attorneys that are the ultimate winners. Going further, how can anyone believe that Kerry and Edwards support tort reform....

    Ben
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    Here is more vital information to consider for all undecided voters!

    they are blaming bush for this issue with acquiring drugs from canada?
    lets take a look at what the other side has done to help us with our current flu epidemic.....
    Vital information??? This is pathetic. It takes no more than 20 seconds to find out that this story is total nonsense, but still, it is posted here as an argument against Kerry/Edwards:

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/flushot.asp clearly states that this story is FALSE, invented, just another urban legend... Some people seem to be willing to post ANYTHING in order to try to convince others of their views, no matter how untrue. When looking at the quality of information they base their decisions and opinions on, it comes as no surprise who they favour.

    Their lack of valid arguments in favour of Bush obviously leads to some pretty desperate moves. So, undecided voters, look at the methods the pro Bush side uses, and decide who you want to trust....
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  4. #4  
    Unless the WSJ has been duped like <cough> other "Mainstream Media Outlets" they place the blame squarely on Hillary Clinton and Trial Lawyers...

    http://www.ncpa.org/iss/hea/2003/pd081803e.html
    Avatars.... <hrumpphh> I guess, since all the cool kids are doing it.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger
    There were more than 20 companies producing the vaccine and it's down to, what, 3? The legal profession and those members of it that are in the "ambulance chasing" end of it are the ones responsibile for it. Sue until they drop and sue some more. Go for the high rates, make it so they are no longer willing or able to accept the liability.

    How can we blame Bush? There is no way. We need to blame those that allowed this to happen. Blame those who voted for the legislation allowing it and for those attorneys that are the ultimate winners. Going further, how can anyone believe that Kerry and Edwards support tort reform....

    Ben
    It's easy to blame the lawyers, the pharm co.'s and the government, even the President.

    But you can't place the blame on one side. For example, our neighbors to the north (Canada) have all the flu vaccine they want -- they get theirs from France, not Great Britain. And the French companies have vaccine to spare. However, we won't buy vaccine from a French company. Why? Could it be the fact that they didn't support the war? I don't know, but if the vaccine exists, does it really matter where it comes from, assuming it is safe?

    Everyone talks about tort reform and that the lawyers are all evil doers in our society. Blaming lawyers is in fashion today, but what we really need to do is step back and not repeat history. Silencing lawyers will destroy our individual freedoms. After all, Shakespeare said it best, "If tyranny is to prevail, then tyrants must first kill all the lawyers."

    One or two examples may help:

    In seventeenth century England, Cromwell decreed that no more than 3 lawyers could meet outside of court.

    Adolf Hitler once said, “I shall not rest until every German sees that it is a shameful thing to be a lawyer.”

    When the Declaration of Independence was signed, 25 of the 56 signers were lawyers.

    James Madison in the Federalist Papers was the champion of individual rights over the government. He was a lawyer.

    Or how about this, “Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!” Spoken by Patrick Henry, a lawyer.

    It's very easy to decry what lawyers do. In my business they have become quite invasive. But looking at it with an objective eye, the people most effected by the lawyers were the ones placing their interests ahead of their clients' interest. And it was wrong. We are all better off for it. For those of us that didn't violate the tenets of our profession, guess what, we had no problems with the lawyers. This seems to be the key point people miss ...

    In closing, I'll bet few of us have the need for a lawyer and see it from this viewpoint. But, what if you had a situation where negligence existed and it cost you the life, safety or health of a loved one? Would you want to have what could be awarded limited to some legislatively directed amount? Not me.

    Each time we draw the line on civil liberties closer, limiting our personal rights and protection, it becomes increasingly difficult to get the line back where it belongs. People want to come to America because we have these rights. In times when we are actively encouraging democarcy in the world, what are we doing? Pulling back on individual rights, limiting freedoms and challenging those protections many have fought so hard to protect.
    << My command as we escape Palm HQ with a new Pre 3>>.

    Treo 300 >> Treo 600 >> Treo 650 >> Treo 755 >> Instinct >> Pre- >> TouchPad
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by dannoz
    Unless the WSJ has been duped like <cough> other "Mainstream Media Outlets" they place the blame squarely on Hillary Clinton and Trial Lawyers...

    http://www.ncpa.org/iss/hea/2003/pd081803e.html
    As much as I enjoy reading the WSJ, it is a very biased and conservative newspaper. Its editorial is anti-Hilary and anti-democrats on a daily basis. Big deal!
    You don't stop laughing because you grow old. You grow old because you stop laughing.
    -Michael Pritchard
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by tjd414
    But you can't place the blame on one side. For example, our neighbors to the north (Canada) have all the flu vaccine they want -- they get theirs from France, not Great Britain. And the French companies have vaccine to spare. However, we won't buy vaccine from a French company. Why? Could it be the fact that they didn't support the war? I don't know...
    The scandal in the United Nations "Oil for Food" program has pretty much been downplayed by the mainstream media. I was hoping Bush would talk it during the debates. When Kerry claimed that he can "win the peace" in Iraq by rallying our former allies, Bush should have pointed out that our "allies" were actually allies of Saddam Hussein before the war.

    The records that were found after Saddam was overthrown show the true nature of the relationship between Saddam, the United Nations, and our so-called "allies." Now there's proof that France, Germany, Russia and China were seriously involved in illegal arms deals and the sale of advanced military technologies to Iraq.

    When sanctions were partially lifted to allow oil to be traded for food, Saddam issued "oil vouchers" to those same "allies" and U. N. officials profited. In return, he received $11 billion under the guise of humanitarian aid. Sadly, the "aid" money was used to support Saddam and his murderous regime instead of the Iraqi people.

    Let's continue to support economies that arm our enemies. Right.
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Chick-Dance
    And let children and the elderly (possibly) die from the flu?
    20,000 or more elderly die from the flu every year. This year is certainly no different then many years past.. Since before Bush was elected, there have been years of shortage before as well as years where millions of flu doses have gone unused.

    "Take a deep breath," said Julie Gerberding, MD, MPH, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, at an Oct. 5 news conference. "We are going to work through this as we have other shortages in the past."

    This year, by early October, the World Health Organization and the CDC reported limited flu activity.
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    By the way...the lawyer that represented the man in the flu shot law suit was a young ambulance chaser by the name of John Edwards.
    How adroit of you to connect Edwards with the flu vaccine shortage.

    It's the trial lawyers again, man they are busy people!

    OK, I'm changing my vote right now
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Chick-Dance
    Again, you miss the point and google-away irrelevant information.
    It's curious that everyone that doesnt fall lockstep with your point of view misses the point.

    I would much rather take the opinion of the CDC and the AMA regarding this then your "The Sky is Falling" approach.
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  11. #11  
    It is fact that the Clinton Government Vaccine Buying Program as harmed the vaccine industry. If you don't like how the WSJ reports this look other studies on the subject.
  12. #12  
    Chick-Dance is right, the lives of our children elderly and sick should be at the top of our priorities. It is inexcusable that we do not have flu vaccine for the people that need it. Whoever is in charge should take responsibility and make sure it never happens again.
    Last edited by cellmatrix; 10/25/2004 at 11:20 AM.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by cellmatrix
    Chick-Dance is right, the lives of our children elderly and sick should be at the top of our priorities. I am disappointed that we do not have flu vaccine for the people that need it. It is inexcusable. I do not care who is to blame, lets not let it happen again!
    I thought it was the war that was the top priority...oh no, it was jobs. Wait, election fraud? No, it's flu vaccine
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by clairegrrl
    I thought it was the war that was the top priority...oh no, it was jobs. Wait, election fraud? No, it's flu vaccine
    The top of our priorities, there is an "s" at the end. You don't think health care should be one of our top priorities?
    Last edited by cellmatrix; 10/25/2004 at 11:27 AM.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by cellmatrix
    The top of our priorities, there is an "s" at the end.
    The most top individual priority would be singular
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  16. #16  
    I realize I am talking to a journalism major here

    I meant "one of our top priorities".

    I think we could be doing much better than we are regarding health care, much much better.
    Last edited by cellmatrix; 10/25/2004 at 11:42 AM.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by clairegrrl
    The scandal in the United Nations "Oil for Food" program has pretty much been downplayed by the mainstream media. I was hoping Bush would talk it during the debates. When Kerry claimed that he can "win the peace" in Iraq by rallying our former allies, Bush should have pointed out that our "allies" were actually allies of Saddam Hussein before the war.

    The records that were found after Saddam was overthrown show the true nature of the relationship between Saddam, the United Nations, and our so-called "allies." Now there's proof that France, Germany, Russia and China were seriously involved in illegal arms deals and the sale of advanced military technologies to Iraq.

    When sanctions were partially lifted to allow oil to be traded for food, Saddam issued "oil vouchers" to those same "allies" and U. N. officials profited. In return, he received $11 billion under the guise of humanitarian aid. Sadly, the "aid" money was used to support Saddam and his murderous regime instead of the Iraqi people.

    Let's continue to support economies that arm our enemies. Right.
    Either you can not read or you have a mind that can't comprehend what I wrote ... nowhere did I discuss the Food for Oil program.

    My comments were strictly limited to the current scapegoating of everything we don't like to problems with the legal system.

    Perhaps you should go back and reread my post.
    << My command as we escape Palm HQ with a new Pre 3>>.

    Treo 300 >> Treo 600 >> Treo 650 >> Treo 755 >> Instinct >> Pre- >> TouchPad
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by cellmatrix
    OK, I give up, you are right, I made a boo boo.

    I realize I am talking to a journalism major here
    The point is you made the big deal about it...

    I dont want you riled...your blood pressure and all
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by tjd414
    Either you can not read or you have a mind that can't comprehend what I wrote ....
    Your personal attacks aside. I can read and comprehend very well.

    You made comment about why we might not buy vaccine from france. Which was part of your post that I quoted. I offered a very valid reason why we might not.

    Maybe you should relax and try some breathing exercises
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by tjd414
    Either you can not read or you have a mind that can't comprehend what I wrote
    Please refrain from personal attacks... Claire has proven she is an exelent reader (maybe even too good ) and I'm sure she is pretty smart.
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
    Do files get embarrassed when they get unzipped?
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