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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    the statement that there may always be war may very well be true - sadly.
    you know the us, with all of its technology and power could do anything it wants at any time... but it doesn't.
    america could invade any country and take over its land at any time... but it doesn't.
    america could enslave the people of any country, but it doesn't.
    america could nuke any country it wants for fear of a threat.... but it doesn't.
    in the majority of cases, america uses its power to try and help people, rebuild their nations, send them food, help them replace dictatorsships with a chance to make their own govts.
    fight genocide in sudan, starvation in ethiopia, etc.
    now america is hit by attackers, so she tries to defend herself, and she is met with such criticism.
    its not possible to please everyone simultaneously. they teach us this in grammer school - to give a very simple example. but you try your best to help the most that you can with the means that you have and still try and keep yourself successful. sure, there are things we have done in history which may be subject to debate as to how well we've handled them, but as a whole I believe america has been the best fighter for good on this planet - along with the invaluable efforts of our allies.
    we welcomed people from every culture into our borders and allowed them to create whatever lifestyle they dreamed of for themselves. we gave them freedom to fulfill their dreams! how is it that some people still joust at us that we are only out to exploit the world? sure we live in a capitalist society, so exploiting opportunities for business takes place, but ANY nation presented with these opportunities would do so - that's a fact.
    no one is perfect. but with the types of criticisms of the us I read here it would sound like we were taking over the world as would a napoleon bonaparte, adolf hitler or ghenghis khan! its not the case folks! we do things for the cause of good as our guiding motives, not some tyrannical nation!

    Well said.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by Oops
    Add me to the list! I am tired of the arrogance displayed on Off Topics by Woof.
    I agree. Woof has made many simple errors in various posts, but I haven't seen anyone attack him for that. This isn't the first time Woof has poked fun of someone for this either. Perhaps it's easier to attack the messenger than to actually debate/discuss the message. It's really too bad ...Woof can engage in meaningful discussion, I guess he simply doesn't want to.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by Oops
    Add me to the list! I am tired of the arrogance displayed on Off Topics by Woof.
    What arrogance? So you don't agree with the guy on this issue. Big deal. You have your opinion, others have other opinions. On this issue, I believe Woof is spot on. I guess that makes me arrogant too since you don't agree with me.

    Try arguing the merits, instead of just getting mad.
    Palm V-->Visor Deluxe-->Visor Prism-->Visorphone-->Treo 180-->Treo 600-->Treo 650 on Sprint-->Treo 700p-->Centro-->Diamond-->Pre-->HTC EVO 4g???!
  4. #64  
    I agree.
  5. #65  
    Gonna have to start handing out tissues with my posts.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  6. #66  
    I am beginning to see a pattern though. I get jumped on when I hit a nerve, or make a point that the left can't rebutt. At least it seems so. If my arguments were all nothing, it would be simple to tear them apart, but instead they tear ME apart.

    Guess I'll have to starting crying to the mods about personal attacks...NOT! Bring it on, I can take it. It must be the arrogance holding me up
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  7. #67  
    it may very well be that things turn personal when a rebuttal can't be put together. I've seen that happen too. its the "cornered cat" scenario possibly.
    I don't know... maybe chickdance with return with a retort, but until then that's what it looks like. I guess we will see.
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    it may very well be that things turn personal when a rebuttal can't be put together. I've seen that happen too. its the "cornered cat" scenario possibly.
    I don't know... maybe chickdance with return with a retort, but until then that's what it looks like. I guess we will see.

    or maybe the "cornered chicken"
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    you know the us, with all of its technology and power could do anything it wants at any time... but it doesn't.
    america could invade any country and take over its land at any time... but it doesn't.
    Wow, I am deeply impressed. So America is omnipotent now? Again, wow! So why don't you just stop the killing of your soldiers in Iraq, and the constant attacks of terrorists there? That is really only a quite insignificant country, hasn't even got proper weapons. Why don't you just free North Korea, too? Make people in the US feel safe, cure world hunger, stop children dieing from curable diseases? You can do everything you want at any time, no?

    The delusions of grandeur you exhibit are really impressive. Yuk.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by heberman
    What arrogance? So you don't agree with the guy on this issue. Big deal. You have your opinion, others have other opinions. On this issue, I believe Woof is spot on. I guess that makes me arrogant too since you don't agree with me.
    "Damn liberals. You always think kissing someones *** and making friend with them is the best way. Lets all be friends and no one will fight. "

    "Damn conservatives. You always think torturing people to death and killing everybody is the best way. Just kill them all and no one will fight."

    That last part is not my view, but maybe when you read it this way you realize that this has nothing to do with agreeing or disagreeing with an opinion, as you wrote in your post. It is just a plain stupid and derogatory comment, designed to insult.

    Woof's next part isn't any better, to the contrary:

    "I guess you would try to make friends with the guy who breaks into your house to rape and kill your family. When your wife and daughter have been raped and slaughtered please post and tell us how well it went."

    The only purpose of this sentence is to make the people who don't share his views look like silly a$$holes. Of course this tells us much more about Woof than about the people who don't share his political views, but let's not confuse this kind of crap with an opinion or an argument in a discussion.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by heberman
    What arrogance? So you don't agree with the guy on this issue. Big deal. You have your opinion, others have other opinions. On this issue, I believe Woof is spot on. I guess that makes me arrogant too since you don't agree with me.

    Try arguing the merits, instead of just getting mad.
    So, Heberman, you believe that liberals are like this: (from Woof)

    "guess you would try to make friends with the guy who breaks into your house to rape and kill your family. When your wife and daughter have been raped and slaughtered please post and tell us how well it went. Me I'll shoot 'em and know my family is safe."

    You agree with that, Heberman? Is this how you express yourself? Honestly, is that how you feel? Have you ever been physically assaulted, or raped? If so, how does it make you feel when people (with whom you say you agree with) banter around this type of discussion so casually? Can you not see how this may be insensitive? Obviously no liberal, conservative, or moderate individual has even remotely communicated this idea -yet you believe anyone would react this way?

    I don't think so, Heberman. You've always demonstrated far more tact and poise when expressing your opinion. I'm surprised that you're not at least a bit offended -and believe it should be rebuffed or debated. Honestly, where are the merits in the above comments by Woof?
    Last edited by Tribalenvy; 09/06/2004 at 03:48 AM.
  12. #72  
    I am a survivor of just the situation you described, Woof. Not all of my family survived, however. I'd rather not post and tell you "how it went." I get the feeling from the insensitive nature of your post that you'd either not care, or not understand.
  13. #73  
    I think some people on this forum learn debating "skills" from shock-jocks.
    Animo et Fide
  14. #74  
    clulup, omnipotent, delusions of grandeur?
    you really go lengths to twist what is said don't you? the point was we could be using our resources for all the bad reasons, but we don't. we instead choose to help the world. but many like to twist this into debates serving certain agendas.
    clulup, you, I just think like to play the omnipotent one. lol. whenever you read posts from you there is this air of pretension. I am sure others pick this up as well. YUK!!! even those who share your view must see this.
    high atop mt pilatius sits this guy, in all his omnipotence! quite laughable. hey, whatever ya wanna do, ya know? go ahead.
    id still like to see where switzerland has taken up and actively done something other than the red cross and just sitting as the world's banker. so easy to play the world's sidelines announcers, isn't it? if you are watching a game, you watch the players, not those on the sidelines don't you? yep. they don't contribute to the game so you for the most part ignore them. YUK! what a boring position to be in!
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    "Damn liberals. You always think kissing someones *** and making friend with them is the best way. Lets all be friends and no one will fight. "

    "Damn conservatives. You always think torturing people to death and killing everybody is the best way. Just kill them all and no one will fight."
    Actually it would be: Damn conservatives. They are always willing to defend themselves against those who would harm them and not kowtow to bullies and zealots for the sake of looking good.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214
    clulup, omnipotent, delusions of grandeur?
    Good news, treobk214, I will not bother you with a reply, it's getting boring.
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tribalenvy
    I am a survivor of just the situation you described, Woof. Not all of my family survived, however. I'd rather not post and tell you "how it went." I get the feeling from the insensitive nature of your post that you'd either not care, or not understand.
    Well on one hand thats awfully convenient. On the other hand thats really sad and unfortunate.

    If it's true, my sympathies to you.

    Having a tendency to question that which is almost too convenient however, I wonder. I mean what are the odds that someone in this discussion of less than ten people, had experienced the very fanciful example that I pull out of the air. Slim. With that kind of luck I should start buying lotto tickets. It's just instinct but I am going to call BS on you tribal.

    I will admit though that is a really good way to get those already opposing me to firmly move to your side.

    lets also note that as yet, no one has done anything to refute the points I made. It has all just been criticism of my delivery.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by Chick-Dance
    ....It is about time people stand-up for your arrogance, regardless of our political views or sides.
    ..
    I would think you meant stand up to not for, but hey that's just my grammar filter running I guess.

    Maybe this will be better for you. I'll do my best to argue my point without unintentionally hurting anyones feelings.

    I disagree with you.

    Is that sensitive and politically correct enough for you? I have left out any kind of specific examples or references to avoid the possibility that anything I say could hurt someone.

    I thought of a different analogy to use to make my point that involves kids on a playground and a bully that is less horific than my first choice. Upon further reflection however I realize that it is possible that someone here could have been picked on by a bully as a child, and using a nonspecific example intended to only make a point, could rekindle long buried feelings of persecution and inadequacy. How am I doing?
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  19. #79  
    Can't I be offline for a few days without things getting out of hand???

    This thread is (once again) just heading towards mud slinging and hence I am closing it..
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
    Do files get embarrassed when they get unzipped?
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