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  1.    #1  
    2 news stories came to my attention... thought I should share them with you...

    http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...1,339115.story
    (if you need to log on use 'treocentral'/'treorules')

    http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/South/08/....ap/index.html
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  2. #2  
    Oh please... Who ever said Freedom of Speech meant speech was really free?! You have a right to say whatever you want, but there are always consequences to what you say. If this ***** wanted to heckle Bush so bad, he should have bought his own damned tickets instead of doing it on some one else's dime...
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  3. #3  
    really no different than having a thread closed because the moderators dont like your delivery.

    Mods expect people to behave a certain way, so do employers.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  4.    #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic
    Oh please... Who ever said Freedom of Speech meant speech was really free?! You have a right to say whatever you want, but there are always consequences to what you say. If this ***** wanted to heckle Bush so bad, he should have bought his own damned tickets instead of doing it on some one else's dime...
    one one hand you have a point, but what good is a political rally if you can't discuss politics? (providing you stay polite off course).
    It is like somebody gives you a ticket to a rock concert, and it turns out the band sux, do you have to cheer them on because the tix were a freeby?
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
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  5.    #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    really no different than having a thread closed because the moderators dont like your delivery.

    Mods expect people to behave a certain way, so do employers.
    I see that, but was he on the companies dime when he went to the rally? and if so, can an employer expect you to have a certain political attitude during work hours?
    As a mod I expect people to behave, not to have my political opinions..
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  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    I see that, but was he on the companies dime when he went to the rally? and if so, can an employer expect you to have a certain political attitude during work hours?
    As a mod I expect people to behave, not to have my political opinions..

    The hecker used a ticket to the Bush even given to his employer by a major client. By heckling Bush, he pissed off the client causing potentially major harm to his employer's business. Is it your right to go off and **** off your clients and customers as you wish? Absolutely...but then you gotta be a moron if you don't think your going to be fired. That's the way it goes...
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  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by gfunkmagic
    The hecker used a ticket to the Bush even given to his employer by a major client. By heckling Bush, he pissed off the client causing potentially major harm to his employer's business. Is it your right to go off and **** off your clients and customers as you wish? Absolutely...but then you gotta be a moron if you don't think your going to be fired. That's the way it goes...
    Did the guy cross the line, yes he probably did. But still it gives us a very interesting topic to debate...
    How far can an employer go to keep his clients happy?
    What should the heckler have done? decline the invitation?
    Is the shallowness of advertising something we should worry about?
    etc. etc. I find this a very intreguing story... just am sorry we dont know what the heckler actually said, I think that could make a big difference?

    And how about needing a license to see canadian TV?? in other words you are not allowed to see other sources of media unless you have a adress overseas.. seems kind of controlling to me...ministery of truth comes to mind..
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
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  8. #8  
    Methinks that this case is going to end up in court, and I suspect the employer will lose.

    The First Amendment will supercede any arguments the employer has about the poor taste in the employee's actions. That is why neo-nazis and the KKK are still allowed to do what they do, even though most people find their activities repugnant.
  9. #9  
    Toolkit, if you're moving to the UK you should know that you need a licence to watch UK TV. That's why there's no advertising on the BBC - it's paid for by the licence. It costs £110 for a colour licence (i think, something like that anyway) and you can get £3 off if you're registered blind!
    Animo et Fide
  10.    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by PeterBrown
    Toolkit, if you're moving to the UK you should know that you need a licence to watch UK TV. That's why there's no advertising on the BBC - it's paid for by the licence. It costs £110 for a colour licence (i think, something like that anyway) and you can get £3 off if you're registered blind!
    Your kidding!
    In holland it was a similar sceme, but I think they called it a tax, but I believe they got rid of it..
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
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  11. #11  
    You pay less for a black and white licence too. If you don't pay for your tv licence but use a tv then you get fined, and even - in extreme cases of non-payment - jailed.
    Animo et Fide
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    I see that, but was he on the companies dime when he went to the rally? and if so, can an employer expect you to have a certain political attitude during work hours?
    As a mod I expect people to behave, not to have my political opinions..

    You may not like it, but if your employer perceives your actions as an employee at work or not to be harmful to the company, you could be let go. That is the employers right to protect his interests. The companies well being outweighs yours especially if you're being a dork.

    I used to work for a company that required me to travel all over supporting a large client. There were actually lots of different people but they all reporesented this client. On e reoccuring activity that occured when on the road was strip clubs. The guys I would go to to do work for loved em, regardless of what part of the country. No biggie, I like a little T&A now and then. (I used to have a map with all the nations best strip clubs on it, before the wife of course).We were however expected to have fun but not get out of hand because we were still representing the company. That is after all why we were there.
    Now I can only imagine what would have happened to my job, had I gotten to darn excited while drinking and getting a lap dance and whipped it out at one of these outings and completely embarassed the client.
    What would my employer have done at this news? Fired me of course. Duh!

    Freedom of speech does not negate ones resposibility to behave in a civilized manner appropriate to the situation. If it did no one would ever get arrested when a protest turned violent. The right to free speech is not an open license to be a moron.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toolkit
    How far can an employer go to keep his clients happy?
    A far as he wants within the law. It's legal to fire people.
    What should the heckler have done? decline the invitation?
    Perhaps checked his hatred for Bush at the door and acted like a respectable human being. Hecklers are such children.
    Is the shallowness of advertising something we should worry about?
    Only if it gets Bush hecklers fired. If a Kerry heckler had been fired we wouldnt be having this conversation. I say that because no Kerry supporter, let alone the media would have even brought it to light with out asserting there was soome tie to the Bush campaign.
    etc. etc. I find this a very intreguing story... just am sorry we dont know what the heckler actually said, I think that could make a big difference?
    ya it would. If this nitwit hadnt said someything that offended the client he wouldnt have gotten fired. Thats the only person it matters too. It wont matter if you think its no big deal. Youre not the client.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurokitty
    The First Amendment will supercede any arguments the employer has about the poor taste in the employee's actions. That is why neo-nazis and the KKK are still allowed to do what they do, even though most people find their activities repugnant.
    The First Amendment applies to governmental restrictions on free speech, not an employer's restrictions. The employer was completely within their rights to fire the guy.

    You can't wear your KKK outfit to work without getting fired.
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  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurokitty
    Methinks that this case is going to end up in court, and I suspect the employer will lose.

    The First Amendment will supercede any arguments the employer has about the poor taste in the employee's actions. That is why neo-nazis and the KKK are still allowed to do what they do, even though most people find their activities repugnant.
    The consitution governs the actions of the government, not private parties.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    I see that, but was he on the companies dime when he went to the rally? and if so, can an employer expect you to have a certain political attitude during work hours?
    As a mod I expect people to behave, not to have my political opinions..

    Reread this one. You nailed it and I dont think youre even aware you did. It's about behavior, not poliical opinion.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurokitty
    Methinks that this case is going to end up in court, and I suspect the employer will lose.

    The First Amendment will supercede any arguments the employer has about the poor taste in the employee's actions. That is why neo-nazis and the KKK are still allowed to do what they do, even though most people find their activities repugnant.

    Methinks you'll be wrong. Clearly your understanding of the first amendement is a little cloudy. See the posts by Mr Heberman and Mr Ramsauer.

    And why would it end up in court. did you read the article?
    "The father of two young girls had worked at the design firm for five months, doesn't plan to appeal the firing, and holds no grudge against his boss.

    "To some degree I can see her point of view," Hiller said. "Advertising is all about having the perfect tan and driving a cool car. It's all about image.""

    Are you gonna file a suit on his behalf??
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by PeterBrown
    Toolkit, if you're moving to the UK you should know that you need a licence to watch UK TV. That's why there's no advertising on the BBC - it's paid for by the licence. It costs £110 for a colour licence (i think, something like that anyway) and you can get £3 off if you're registered blind!
    Can you get a ticket for changing channels too fast?
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    Methinks you'll be wrong. Clearly your understanding of the first amendement is a little cloudy. See the posts by Mr Heberman and Mr Ramsauer.

    And why would it end up in court. did you read the article?
    "The father of two young girls had worked at the design firm for five months, doesn't plan to appeal the firing, and holds no grudge against his boss.

    "To some degree I can see her point of view," Hiller said. "Advertising is all about having the perfect tan and driving a cool car. It's all about image.""

    Are you gonna file a suit on his behalf??
    Think again. There are suits filed every day for wrongful termination. The guy lives in West Virginia. He'll sue.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurokitty
    Think again. There are suits filed every day for wrongful termination. The guy lives in West Virginia. He'll sue.
    Ah yes the clairvoyant speaks. Will he sue because West Virginians are genetically prediposed to law suits or is there a state law that requires them to sue? Do you know him? Have you asked him and he told you yes? Dying to know your angle.

    Please tell me how you know he will sue. From his quotes and such it looks like he is happy to go back to nursing.

    Please I am on the egde of my seat waiting ot hear how you know. Do you do lottery numbers too?
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  20.    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    Ah yes the clairvoyant speaks. Will he sue because West Virginians are genetically prediposed to law suits or is there a state law that requires them to sue? Do you know him? Have you asked him and he told you yes? Dying to know your angle.

    Please tell me how you know he will sue. From his quotes and such it looks like he is happy to go back to nursing.

    Please I am on the egde of my seat waiting ot hear how you know. Do you do lottery numbers too?
    I agree with you, but can you tone down the sarcasm a bit? (especially the last sentence isnt really needed)
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