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  1. #221  
    Quote Originally Posted by vw2002
    also, apparently kerry received schrapnel from his own handgrenade, and a contusion on his arm which was a result from his being knocked off balance as a result of an explosion near the boat. both incidents warranted purple hearts.

    in kerry's journal, supposedly, HE wrote himself that his crew was yet to be shot at. this after he received the shrapnel and the contusion. so im not so sure about the purple hearts of john kerry. not saying that his serving in vietnam wasnt admirable - it was. but ive a friend who barely escaped death when an ENEMY grenade was tossed into his camp, killing his buddy and wounding him. no purple hearts received here though. so i have a lot of doubts toward kerry's purple hearts.

    not sure his injuries are worthy of purple hearts. you be the judge.

    i
    I hadn't read that about the hand grenade. Do you have a source link?
  2. #222  
    Quote Originally Posted by johnbdh
    If the target were painted squarely on your back, you might think differently.
    Did you ever wonder why the target is painted squarely on your back? What do you think?

    The only achievement of Bush (with the exception of Afghanistan) I can see is that he painted that target in more vivid colours, so that even more people feel like striking... I don't really want you to be the hated target of terrorists, I kind of like some of you, that is one of the reasons why Bush gets on my nerves at times. I think he acts terribly ignorant and short-sighted when it comes to foreign politics (internal politics, too, actually)
    What is really unfortunate in my mind is that too many folks in my country worry far too much about how you in other countries feel about us. I think this is the result our repulsion from the "Ugly American" face we painted on ourselves in the 60s.
    For sure the Bush administration doesn't give a damn what anybody in the world thinks. That is why you are almost totally alone in Iraq. Don't put too much blame on the "Ugly American" from the sixties - few people even know what is meant by that. Believe me, the view of the US in the world has suffered immensly in the world, but almost exclusively because of Bush's behaviour. Sure you don't have to care about that, but don't be surprised about fighting alone and having a target painted on your back.
    President Bush has a responsiblilty to do whatever it takes to protect the citizens of the United States and I admire him for taking that action knowing full well that it would not be popular with our freinds abroad.
    Of course Bush has to protect US citizens. But do you indeed believe the invasion of Iraq was worth all those dead US soldiers? Did their death indeed make the US safer? Because all those inexistent WMD were destroyed? Because Saddam's negligible support of Al Qaida stopped? How exactely did the invasion of Iraq protect US citizens?
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
  3. #223  
    Quote Originally Posted by mrjoec
    I thought after the Gore debacle that the Democrats would give it more than the old college try this time around..... But I think the DNC is handling this whole election pretty poorly.
    I don't think the DNC can afford to have Kerry win. It would be a definite problem running Hillary against a Democrat incumbent.
    Well behaved women rarely make history
  4. #224  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    Believe me, the view of the US in the world has suffered immensly in the world, but almost exclusively because of Bush's behaviour.
    Thank goodness people in other parts of the world are able to differentiate between American politics and American people. I've traveled to Europe nearly a dozen times since September 11- and the Europeans I've encountered have been nothing but nice. They understand that Americans as people are good even if our current leadership sucks.
  5. vw2002's Avatar
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    #225  
    this news story was reported on the television, so I don't have a link. but I would certainly provide one for you here if I did.
    I gotta have more cowbell
  6. #226  
    Quote Originally Posted by vw2002
    this news story was reported on the television, so I don't have a link. but I would certainly provide one for you here if I did.
    No problem. If you come across one, let me know!
  7. mrjoec's Avatar
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    #227  
    Quote Originally Posted by heberman
    I see it as the sad state of the Democratic party. Nothing to vote for, nothing positive about their candidate. The only mindset is to bash Bush, bash the economy, bash the Iraq success, bash conservatives, blah, blah, blah.

    Too bad Kerry has a total lack of support from his own party. If he can't even garner enthusiasm from his own supporters, what kind of a leader can he be?
    How many positive ads have Bush and the Republicans run about his accomplishments? Maybe they're being aired elsewhere, but from where I'm sitting watching the tube, I've seen nothing but anti-Kerry ads. Oh, except for that one about the number of Democracies participating in the Olympics, which, I have to tell you, I'm still trying to figure out. Can't quite put my finger on why, but that ad just makes me feel—well, weird.

    So a thousand US troops and countless civilians die in Iraq, and that's great, because now there are two more democracies in Athens? That's why we're over there? I don't get what he's trying to say.
    mrjoec
    www.joecieplinski.com
  8. #228  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    .... That is why you are almost totally alone in Iraq. ....
    Ok so in Switzerland "almost totally alone" could mean anything.

    I think we had about 90 countries on board with the invasion of Iraq, if memory serves. You call that alone? So I guess if a guy was cheating on his wife with another woman, he could use the Swiss version of totally alone and he would be ok. "Honey I was totally alone!" This of course could mean he up to 90 or so women with him, but hey he was alone.

    Why do you keep insisting we went into Iraq alone when we did not?
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  9. #229  
    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    Did you ever wonder why the target is painted squarely on your back? What do you think?
    As you allude later, the target was put there long before GW became President. I think that target is the result of a generation of middle eastern children being "taught" to hate the west and America because of our blind support of Israel. We were asleep at the wheel while this was happening. Whether or not we were right or wrong in taking the sides we took does not justify the hatred that resulted in the 9/11 attack.


    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    The only achievement of Bush (with the exception of Afghanistan) I can see is that he painted that target in more vivid colours, so that even more people feel like striking...
    For my part this was to be expected in the short term. In the long term, however, the decisive moves we made in the theater will, I believe, ultimately result in a safer world for all of us. It will be painful for a while, but know one said this was going to be easy.


    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    I think he acts terribly ignorant and short-sighted when it comes to foreign politics (internal politics, too, actually)
    For sure the Bush administration doesn't give a damn what anybody in the world thinks. That is why you are almost totally alone in Iraq. Don't put too much blame on the "Ugly American" from the sixties - few people even know what is meant by that. Believe me, the view of the US in the world has suffered immensly in the world, but almost exclusively because of Bush's behaviour.
    You understimate President Bush and put words in his mouth. I think you would be surprised how much he does care what the rest of the world thinks.

    He tried to convince the "world" as you say to join him in taking a strong stance against Iraq's defience of the UN. He spent more than a year at it. He was not 100% successful, but he gave in to United Nations resolution after resolution. Now if you were in President's Bush's shoes, faced with what you honestly believed and averyone else believed as a serious threat to the world that required immediate attention. Knowing the devastation that could be caused by a dirty bomb in one of our cities and having intelligence that said the most likely source for such a Bomb was in the hands of a Dictator that had no qualms about using or giving them to someone who would use them against us. What would you do, wait until we lost tens of thousands of people at home? I think President Bush made the proper decision, and unfortunately had to make that decision without some important allies, who, by the way are suspect in how they were profitting from the continued existence of the Iraqi regime.

    Bottom line is that I do not think President Bush had any other choice but to be firm in his demand for Iraq to come clean about their WMD, ie. tell us where they are or prove what we knew they had had been destroyed. In light of 9/11 we could no longer afford to back down from the threat of consequences if they did not.


    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    But do you indeed believe the invasion of Iraq was worth all those dead US soldiers? Did their death indeed make the US safer?...
    Yes, and Yes. No amount of compassionate talking was going to resolve the hatred towards us that had been planted in the now grown children of the middle east. The time for this has long past. For what ever reason we found ouselves in that situation after 9/11, we had to take the gloves off to protect our way of life. We had to remove the current and future havens of anti US terrorism around the world. While not a good reason for preemptively going into Iraq I believe that if we had not removed the Iraqi regime that country would have become the next haven for those who want to kill us. It is fortunate that the question of Iraqi WMD gave us good reason to do so.

    Now don't tell me how I am all wet because we did not find WMD in Iraq. Try to understand that the reason we went into Iraq is because we could NOT be sure whether or not they existed. All Saddam had to do was come clean and show us he did not have them and how he destroyed what he used to have and we would not have attacked. The lack of WMD in no way condems our actions.


    Quote Originally Posted by clulup
    ...How exactely did the invasion of Iraq protect US citizens?
    By removing one more safe haven for the terrorists. I also believe that changing the basic lay of the land in the Middle East will serve to ultimately protect US citizens. Only time will tell if either of these things prove successful and time and unfortunately blood is what it will take. It will not be easy but if we are ultimately successful I think history will look favorably on the actions of President Bush. If we are not, then we will suffer the consequences of our actions, but at this point in history I strongly believe that the United State had no other choice but to lead 90 plus countries against the Iraqi regime.
  10. vw2002's Avatar
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    #230  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    Ok so in Switzerland "almost totally alone" could mean anything.

    I think we had about 90 countries on board with the invasion of Iraq, if memory serves. You call that alone? So I guess if a guy was cheating on his wife with another woman, he could use the Swiss version of totally alone and he would be ok. "Honey I was totally alone!" This of course could mean he up to 90 or so women with him, but hey he was alone.

    Why do you keep insisting we went into Iraq alone when we did not?

    haha. right on, woof! keep em coming!
  11. #231  
    finally someone who gets me. Thanks vw
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  12. #232  
    Quote Originally Posted by Eurokitty
    ...The problem I see with voters in this situation is that it's not so much a cult of Kerry as a cult of anti-Bush...

    excellent post. this is exactly how i feel.

    I could give a rat's *** about Kerry. But GW is such a failure, I would vote for any candidate that would have a realistic chance of winning.
    www.bubblespeed.com
  13. vw2002's Avatar
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    #233  
    excellent retorts, john. its such a relief to see you counter some of the posts being submitted here.
  14. #234  
    Quote Originally Posted by DJOrient
    excellent post. this is exactly how i feel.

    I could give a rat's *** about Kerry. But GW is such a failure, I would vote for any candidate that would have a realistic chance of winning.
    Do you have a rat's ***? Who would you give it too?

    So lets see if I get this. IF David Duke of the KKK or Richard Butler of the Aryan Nations were to somehow be the one on the ballot with GWB, you would vote for them? "any candidate with a realistic chance"? Isn't their chance based on how many will vote. If Bush is so bad wouldnt any candidate have a chance?
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  15. #235  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof
    Ok so in Switzerland "almost totally alone" could mean anything.

    I think we had about 90 countries on board with the invasion of Iraq, if memory serves. You call that alone? So I guess if a guy was cheating on his wife with another woman, he could use the Swiss version of totally alone and he would be ok. "Honey I was totally alone!" This of course could mean he up to 90 or so women with him, but hey he was alone.

    Why do you keep insisting we went into Iraq alone when we did not?
    I quoted Woof's number in my last post and thought I should back it up somehow. I believe we have overstated it. Here is very interesting link, which may have been posted here before, that sheds light on just how "totally alone" we were/are...

    [HTML]http://www.geocities.com/pwhce/willing.html[/HTML]
  16. #236  
    Quote Originally Posted by johnbdh
    I quoted Woof's number in my last post and thought I should back it up somehow. I believe we have overstated it. Here is very interesting link, which may have been posted here before, that sheds light on just how "totally alone" we were/are...

    [HTML]http://www.geocities.com/pwhce/willing.html[/HTML]
    Well it may not be 90 but it sure aint alone either. Unless of course you are using the Swiss alone.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  17. #237  
    I have said earlier that I think the Swift Boat vets questioning of Kerry's Bronze and Silver Stars was a huge mistake.

    The days ahead will see a strong counter attack from the Kerry campaign. I predict that the Swift Boat vets will not fair very well. I think John Kerry has been waiting for just the right time to blow the vets out of the water at least with regard to his Silver and Bronze stars. It may ultimately silence them.

    I think that perhaps it may be too late to counter the affect that the Swift Boat vets have already had on other vets like myself, who I believe was their main target. Sort of a wake up call for the troops - mission accomplished.
  18. #238  
    I just wish the elections would be more civilized. But no such treat for the American people. Negative (at times nasty!) campaign slogans do turn off voters. For me this whole episode is becoming sickening. I had enough of it. I want to hear what the candidates have to say about ISSUES.
    You don't stop laughing because you grow old. You grow old because you stop laughing.
    -Michael Pritchard
  19. #239  
    pretty humorous return for djorient, woof. lol.

    you know, first we heard folks saying how much better they thought we would be as a country with kerry instead of bush. now we hear how they couldnt give a rats a$$ about kerry as long as bush is replaced.
    the story has changed. interesting.

    pretty weak state of affairs for the dems party. it sounds like the situation comes down to the fact that kerry is regarded as a generally weak candidate, tending to be wish-washy on key issues. but he is at least somebody running against bush. recent polls have actually found bush to win the election with around 58% of the vote. little early to say yet. we will see.
    Last edited by treobk214; 08/23/2004 at 11:17 PM.
  20. #240  
    Quote Originally Posted by heberman
    You have just described the typical Kerry supporter. "Anyone But Bush! - he lied!" Whatever.
    Doesnt that make you wonder? why are people to taking that attitude?

    Quote Originally Posted by heberman
    I also want a president who knows his name is not "Bob".
    please explain the joke..I dont get it..
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
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