View Poll Results: Releasing leaked info; right or wrong?

Voters
52. You may not vote on this poll
  • Right - for whatever reason

    32 61.54%
  • Wrong - for whatever reason

    20 38.46%
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  1.    #1  
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    Last edited by GuyFromNam; 03/18/2012 at 06:25 AM.
  2. #2  
    Where's your vote GFN? I'm just going to say that ethically it isn't right. People's lives may be put in danger/risk if the wrong info got into the wrong hands (at the extreme end of the scale). Where do all these documents come from, someone rooting through the trash or are they stolen from file cabinets or what? If they just "happen" to be found, they should be tightening down their disposal methods and if they are actually being searched for and then publically displayed, those responsible should be accountable for their actions. I heard on the news last night that the guy who started the website is wanted for rape in some European country( or countries)....sounds like a real stand up guy
    Due to the cancellation of the penny, I no longer give 2 about anything. I may however, give a nickel
  3. groovy's Avatar
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    #3  
    So, where does it end? The question to ask yourself is what you would think if thousands of your own personal and/or business correspondence made its way to the internet for all to see. Either a reasonable expectation of privacy extends to everybody or it extends to nobody. Sure, you can say that they used government email so there's no expectation of privacy. That's true to a point, but the right to read those correspondences normally extends to their superiors, not some random dude on the internet. If that's all there is to it, you better not cross your company IT guy. For that matter, you'd better not make rude statements to your ISP or email host customer support. Heck, some disgruntled guy at Google can make life suck for a whole lot of people. If we're relying solely on the good graces of the leakywicks to ensure our privacy then we all had better bite our tongues.
  4. groovy's Avatar
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    #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by GuyFromNam View Post
    Isn't the whole point of WikiLeaks to uncover our goverments' (not just the US) darkest secrets or even some level of fraud and/or other semi-criminal activity.
    Under what auspices? Who hired them to do that? What oversight is there? What rules govern them? Who says when they've gone too far? And what have they uncovered save some embarrassing details? All of the MSN have gone to great lengths to say that there's nothing terribly damaging in these emails. Well, if that's the case, why have they been released?

    Cool, those drugs cartel dudes will be thrilled to hear they no longer will be tapped.
    James Earl Jones in a deathbed scene: "You took an oath for your boss. Not the president, but the American people." or something along those lines. Not much of a movie, had Mr Ford respected the privacy of others.
    That's a perfect example. Can law enforcement agencies just tap anyone for any reason? No, they can't. They need approval. Is WikiLeaks bound by the Fourth Amendment?
  5. #5  
    I vote Right.

    Democracy is about accountability and James Earl Jones is never wrong! As for the "who do they answer to" argument, i think the point of Wikileaks is to answer the "who holds are government accountable" question.

    For what its worth, apparently he reached out to the US government for advice on what should be redacted/withheld prior to the release but the government would play ball. Thats why he went to the news agencies because they have experience in deciding what should be redacted so as not to put innocent lives at risk. Oversight would be nice, but in the absence of that its nice to see a bit of self-restraint.
  6. groovy's Avatar
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    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by Courousant View Post
    I vote Right.

    Democracy is about accountability and James Earl Jones is never wrong! As for the "who do they answer to" argument, i think the point of Wikileaks is to answer the "who holds are government accountable" question.
    I hope the answer to that question isn't really "some self-serving clown in Australia".

    For what its worth, apparently he reached out to the US government for advice on what should be redacted/withheld prior to the release but the government would play ball. Thats why he went to the news agencies because they have experience in deciding what should be redacted so as not to put innocent lives at risk. Oversight would be nice, but in the absence of that its nice to see a bit of self-restraint.
    I think self-restraint would have been going to the government and saying "Hey, one of your analysts is giving away confidential and potentially damaging material. You should probably check into that."
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by GuyFromNam View Post
    If you want privacy, don't work for the government, cause you're working for me, and frankly I don't care what individual or organisation tells me how you messed up, and in what ways you did. Own up to it, and better your way or be very embarrassed and exiit the scene.

    As far as auspices, and oversight: they're a media group, journalists, whatever. They're just releasing 250k cables at once instead of rolling them out in 2500 newspapers.
    Actually they are not a media group, nor are they journalists. They like a lot of other ummmm of this type, claim to be journalists, but have absolutely zero standing in my community..

    what he did was buy a bunch of email, from his past exploits, he is was looking for a fast buck on it.. This has less to do with being responsible and everything to do with how much money can I make off this... He is a cracker, with pretty lousy credentials. Much of what he claims he did, is basicly claimed by others with far more clout in that group.
    Did he break the 4th amendmant, gotta say NOPE, one he is not american, two it was released outside of america, and continues to be. Can you get him for recieving stolen goods, hmmm damn straight. The young private who is accused of giving him the info,, hmmm life is gonna be a longgggg time for that kid.. hope he got paid well,
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
  8. groovy's Avatar
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    #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by GuyFromNam View Post
    If you want privacy, don't work for the government, cause you're working for me, and frankly I don't care what individual or organisation tells me how you messed up, and in what ways you did. Own up to it, and better your way or be very embarrassed and exiit the scene.
    So government employees have no expectation that what they write will not be plastered all over the internet? Is that what we want? Keep in mind that we live in a dangerous world. The first major power that has 100% governmental transparency will be the first major power to topple.

    As far as auspices, and oversight: they're a media group, journalists, whatever. They're just releasing 250k cables at once instead of rolling them out in 2500 newspapers.
    They are... whatever. Even the media doesn't have the right to intercept government email.
  9. #9  
    It's just more of the same "thought pattern" that's evolved over the last few years where everybody needs to know everybody else's business. Look at the whole "reality tv" phenomonen. It's gossip, plain and simple, but in a televised format. Even I have my reality shows that I watch, ( I like my Hell's Kitchen, got sucked into Survivor and The Apprentice by the wife), but in the end that's what it is. My example was just a worst case scenario of course, but like Micael was saying, at what point will they have gone too far?

    Personally, I haven't gone to the site, I've no interest or desire to waste even more time on yet another website. If anything worthwhile hearing about comes out of it, I'm sure I'll see it on the evening news. As for the private that was mentioned above, I don't even have a clue what it is you guys are talking about, and if you don't say anything about it, I still won't.
    Due to the cancellation of the penny, I no longer give 2 about anything. I may however, give a nickel
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by GuyFromNam View Post
    Would you have preferred not to know, or don't you care? Reuters asked for the video to be released for months.

    Every country at least has ONE newspaper made by people who are considered journalists, and all you can read in them is trash, scandal and hype. So anyone's a journalist by those standards.
    Its not that I dont care, I do care, I just dislike people stealing. This is what this was, Theft, and in this case, much of it stuff that should never have seen the light of day.
    More than anything, this is all about discrediting any and all govt, you can bet your last nickel, if he could get his hands on say Russian or Chinese info he would do the same thing. However, the fact he is or was, not following it that close, in hiding, would not be the case for those or several other countries I can think of. The fact is they would never ever find his body.
    I gotta ask, what would you do if say your email to your girl friend was plastered all over the net, so your whole family and say,, your wife could see it? What do you think of that? Really its no different.
    While several countries are a lil miffed, they are standing together for the most part, mainly because, they ALL write similar types of stuff. With the same kind of content. They know, that but for the luck of the draw, they could just as easly be the ones trying to put out a bonfire with a water pistol like the states is right now.

    As to the journalists,,,lol yup there are several like that, in every country, but these guys dont even claim to be journalists, or at least hadnt the last time i checked.
    At the last G20 thing up here in Canada, I saw individuals claiming to the press, lol, they got short shift from the cops and other accredited news outlets. heck anyone can do up a biz card, lamenate it, and hang it around their neck. Suprisingly, and this is a real surprise to these yahoos, the cops can read...lol
    "Sledge, I don't know all that much about it either. I'm just a headlines reader. I happen to think newspapers are quasi-intellectualism, and are filled with inaccuracies, subjective articles, and blatant lies.
    I'm just interested in knowing that other people think."
    hmm i am in the media, print, prior to this broadcast radio and tv, your right if you have a news editor that caters to the bottom line. A real journalist and editor will publish or broadcast regardless to the hit they take by advertisers. Editors be it print or broadcast, have an obligation to fair and balance reporting. saying that, I have seen on many occasions where you simply can not get a response from the other side. This is when you run into the problem of being precieved as being slanted...
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
  11. #11  
    I have read a tiny tiny bit of this stuff, from 1966 right up to about a year or so ago.. most of it is strictly house keeping stuff. some of it,, well,, hey we are a free market society,, somebody got paid to steal it, somebody is looking to make a buck off it.. and now that same somebody is in hiding cuz the law is after him for sexual assualt.. lol
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
  12. groovy's Avatar
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    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by GuyFromNam View Post
    Groove, gotta hand it to you.
    You have the ability to state your opinion and pass it off as fact. No offence, you've got class. Why would they topple and why does it have to be 100%. It's too easy to ask extreme questions that have a high likelihood of being answered with No.

    Yes, they should, or we wouldn't have LalaGate, LoloGate, and CacaGate.
    Okay, not fact, just a prediction. But to your question why would they topple? Do you think you'd have any chance of winning a game of chess of you were to announce all of your moves to your opponent before hand?

    As to why does it have to be 100%? Where is the line drawn and who draws it?

    Sorry, I have a habit of answering questions with questions.
  13. #13  
    Sorry, I have a habit of answering questions with questions.

    hmmm ya lol
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
  14. groovy's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by xForsaken View Post
    Sorry, I have a habit of answering questions with questions.

    hmmm ya lol
    Obnoxious, I know. I'll work on it.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by groovy View Post
    Obnoxious, I know. I'll work on it.
    naw i tend to do the same thing,, oh wait,, I am obnoxious lol..
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by xForsaken View Post
    naw i tend to do the same thing,, oh wait,, I am obnoxious lol..
    I wasn't going to say it but...
  17. groovy's Avatar
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    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by GuyFromNam View Post
    Because government and 100% transparancy to me sounds like a fantasy novel. Reality would draw the line, and well below 50%.

    And fine for the chess analogy, but where do the 'people' stand? Are we naive spectators, unknowing bystanders, ehr pawns?
    We're voters.
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by groovy View Post
    We're voters.
    With nobody to vote for....
  19. #19  
    ummm does this mean that all corp email should be out there in the public? 50 percent, 60 percent,,,

    oh and who gets to decide which 50 percent ,, the top half or the bottom half..
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
  20. #20  
    "Governments should be afraid of their people"
    just one more step in the right direction. it's us who have delegated the right and means to manage global affairs to them and we should know if they use it in a wrong way (and hell they do). They need to be aware that they WILL be held accountable for all the mess they mindlessly do each and every day.
    Let's just hope it won't backlash with them cutting another bit off our liberties.
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