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  1. g.711's Avatar
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       #1  
    An economics professor at a local college made a statement that he had never failed a single student before, but had once failed an entire class. That class had insisted that Obama's socialism worked and that no one would be poor and no one would be rich, a great equalizer.

    The professor then said, "OK, we will have an experiment in this class on Obama's plan".
    All grades would be averaged and everyone would receive the same grade so no one would fail and no one would receive an A...

    After the first test, the grades were averaged and everyone got a B. The students who studied hard were upset and the students who studied little were happy. As the second test rolled around, the students who studied little had studied even less and the ones who studied hard decided they wanted a free ride too so they studied little.

    The second test average was a D! No one was happy.

    When the 3rd test rolled around, the average was an F.

    As the tests proceeded, the scores never increased as bickering, blame and name-calling all resulted in hard feelings and no one would study for the benefit of anyone else.

    All failed, to their great surprise, and the professor told them that socialism would also ultimately fail because when the reward is great, the effort to succeed is great but when government takes all the reward away, no one will try or want to succeed.

    Could not be any simpler than that.
    http://obamaforwards.com/2009/12/11/...lyAGenius.aspx
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    Last edited by g.711; 05/05/2010 at 03:33 PM.
  2. Micael's Avatar
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    #2  
    Great story. I must admit though that I find it suspect. Why not tell us the professor's name? Which school? Which class?

    No offense, but this is like a ton of the emails I get from my aunt, sans the requirement to forward to 50 of my friends or I'll go broke.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  3. g.711's Avatar
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       #3  
    Maybe, but i agree with the concept, a person has to reach to attain, if it is given with no effort there will be no effort.
  4. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by g.711 View Post
    Maybe, but i agree with the concept, a person has to reach to attain, if it is given with no effort there will be no effort.
    Maybe you'd like to enlighten us with some specifics as to who is being "given with no effort"?
  5. lupos's Avatar
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    #6  
    I could take the time to rewrite the story where the students weren't all selfish bickering jerks and there is a happy ending but it wouldn't make it any more true than the initial POS. I'm no socialists but this kind of broad over simplification doesn't help any thing.
  6. Micael's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by zelgo View Post
    Are you assuming that everyone is starting in the same place and is allowed to reach the same way?
    Naw, he's just laying out one of the fundamental problems with socialism. Unfortunately, he picked a poor example that you guys can easily attack.

    If you want real examples, check out the history of the USSR.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  7. #8  
    Why didn't the professor just keep giving everyone A's or B's. I don't think Obama wants everyone to be poor and he doesn't want to just give people success.
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  8. g.711's Avatar
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       #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Maybe you'd like to enlighten us with some specifics as to who is being "given with no effort"?
    No its a general statement, liken it to the story of a man receiving fish or learning to fish.
  9. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by g.711 View Post
    No its a general statement, liken it to the story of a man receiving fish or learning to fish.

    Right,you betcha. How's that namby-pamby fake story stuff workin' out for ya? I think we know what you really meant.

    The vast majority of people in this country do reach and work. Some of them get little in return.
  10. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Naw, he's just laying out one of the fundamental problems with socialism. Unfortunately, he picked a poor example that you guys can easily attack.

    If you want real examples, check out the history of the USSR.
    lol nice try.. but lets do this right, the ussr was no more a true socialist state or a true communist state.
    Anything is possible if allowed to complete. This is true of "free market" as it is to "communist" systems.
    I have said this before and once again I will repeat myself, all systems, be it religion, govt, market systems, hell a retail store, are subject to the variances of one thing, PEOPLE. The argument listed above against Obama's vision is self defeating. Its simple, you introduce people, who are of free will, who are NOT the same in any way shape or form, you will have a divergence of the original idea. Based on that little class experiment if it was truly weighted properly, no one in the class would do any thing less or more then the other. That is what is wrong with all these "systems. Its human nature for some to want more, to want more at any cost, its also human nature for people to coast, to do less, to allow others to do all the work... lol

    As I said, it matters not, be it communist, or full free market, you still have that one little thing that throws a wrench in to the guts of any system.. you and me..
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
  11. fubka's Avatar
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    #12  
    nice website, full of right wing conspiracy theories, they need to add the one with the oil spill was bio terror
  12. Micael's Avatar
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Right,you betcha. How's that namby-pamby fake story stuff workin' out for ya? I think we know what you really meant.

    The vast majority of people in this country do reach and work. Some of them get little in return.
    You're right. Some of them do. But more importantly, the vast majority of them reap substantial rewards for their hard work. We aren't all rich though. The socialists have made sure of that.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  13. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by xForsaken View Post
    Its human nature for some to want more, to want more at any cost, its also human nature for people to coast, to do less, to allow others to do all the work
    This statement is too true. Sadly, socialism rewards those who can't or won't work and ignores those who work hard. Capitalism rewards those who work hard and ignores those who don't.

    Here is a similar, equally invented example. A class of 30 has 5 students who work extremely hard, 20 that do whats required neither getting ahead or falling behind, and 5 that do very little and don't care (your typical bell curve). To ensure all 30 kids have the best chance to pass the class, the teacher has to spend the majority of his/her resources and time with the bottom 5, expends some energy with the middle 20, and all but ignores the top 5 (or worse, slows down the top 5 so the bottom 5 can catch up or benefit from their efforts). As an educator I often see this as a sad reality and a parallel to modern socialism.
  14. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    You're right. Some of them do. But more importantly, the vast majority of them reap substantial rewards for their hard work. We aren't all rich though. The socialists have made sure of that.
    Are there any countries in which everybody is rich? Other than Luxembourg or Qatar, of course. And maybe Monaco, because everybody that lives there lives in a second home. Hmm. All of those are monarchies. Go figure.
  15. Micael's Avatar
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    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Are there any countries in which everybody is rich? Other than Luxembourg or Qatar, of course. And maybe Monaco, because everybody that lives there lives in a second home. Hmm. All of those are monarchies. Go figure.
    I've travelled many places, davidra. I've seen some pretty remote and poor regions. I get the impression that you may have seen some places as well, so I'm surprised by your response.

    Our poorest are in better shape, and in fact, would be considered "rich" by some of those stuck in some of the circumstances that exist in this world.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  16. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    I've travelled many places, davidra. I've seen some pretty remote and poor regions. I get the impression that you may have seen some places as well, so I'm surprised by your response.

    Our poorest are in better shape, and in fact, would be considered "rich" by some of those stuck in some of the circumstances that exist in this world.
    I second that. According to the World Health Organization, if your household makes more than $33,000/yr, you are in the wealthiest 4% of the worlds population. And that is accomplished if your home has two wage-earners working 40 hours per week at the current minimum wage. Our poor are better off then they realize.
  17. #18  
    Read up until the phrase "Obama's Socialism" and then I decided the whole thing was too ******** read further.
    THIS IS HOW WE HANDLE BUSINESS
  18. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    I've travelled many places, davidra. I've seen some pretty remote and poor regions. I get the impression that you may have seen some places as well, so I'm surprised by your response.

    Our poorest are in better shape, and in fact, would be considered "rich" by some of those stuck in some of the circumstances that exist in this world.
    That wasn't really my point. I agree with you almost completely about that. I was suggesting that a society, by it's very nature, must have people that aren't "rich"....unless they import their service workers from other countries. But even Singapore had a higher GDP than the US per capita. Having been to Haiti several times, and Africa as well, I can tell you that people can live in situations that all of us would find unspeakable. But our country is much richer than those countries, and like the rest of the developed world, we feel a responsibility to our citizens to provide for the poorest and the sickest. That makes us a great country, IMHO.
  19. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    You're right. Some of them do. But more importantly, the vast majority of them reap substantial rewards for their hard work. We aren't all rich though. The socialists have made sure of that.
    Comon, pls, "The socialists have made sure of that", gimme a break. Long before the mere idea of "socialism" there have been people taking advantage of other people. Our entire history is made up of it. Working hard a few years back meant that you were quicker with a gun, prior to that it was any number of other weapons, or hell, just plain beating the hell out of someone. Yes, I will admit there are people now and then that did work hard, and had it all taken away from them by someone else.
    Putting a "system" name on much of what goes on is pure bs. 100 years from now, people could be looking back and calling all the hard working individuals criminals. That they stole, oh wait, considering what I am seeing and reading about some, hell many, of the worlds greatest financial people, they should be calling many of them criminals now. But hey, they are working hard, creating ponzi schemes, ripping off people in the mortgage markets, it goes on and on.
    its not limited to just these people though. Yup the poor are the poor, who are not willing to work. Who demand handouts, free health care, etc etc, but I find it funny as hell, you get a group of them who for a myriad of reasons have a skill set that the powers that are, need, and these poor, form a group, union, what ever, and then again they are the big bad evil socialists. How dare they take away the right of us making obscene profits, how dare they demand more money.

    Your own system creates these quandaries, I believe you call it supply and demand. The poor supply the skill set, you create the demand, they have the right under your system to demand more and get more. But how dare they, well like i said, you create demand by lowering the supply of a given item, so do they lololol
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
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