Page 5 of 18 FirstFirst 1234567891015 ... LastLast
Results 81 to 100 of 345
  1. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by darreno1 View Post
    Well at least you're acknowledging he screwed up, which is the crux of the blame he got. No he did not cause Katrina. And there is enough blame to go around as to why New Orleans wasn't prepared. But I'll repeat, the 'big deal' made about Katrina was in the response time.
    Speaking of deflection tactics, this isn't the katrina thread. I was responding to someone elses deflection! lol

    Good job, just the same!
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  2. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #82  
    Quote Originally Posted by zelgo View Post
    Again, why are the conservative "federal government should keep out of private industry" so upset about the government's response time or the government-imposed limits on liability.

    I would have thought that, according to free market principles, you'd advocate for BP to be responsible for everything and the consequences...
    Since when are you such an anti-environmentist? Don't you agree that focus and containment on an event of this catestrophic level should have happened sooner than the almost 2 weeks? Maybe just a bit sooner, perhaps?

    No, lets deflect with Katrina and Brown? Is it always just left/right with you?
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  3. #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Since when are you such an anti-environmentist? Don't you agree that focus and containment on an event of this catestrophic level should have happened sooner than the almost 2 weeks? Maybe just a bit sooner, perhaps?

    No, lets deflect with Katrina and Brown? Is it always just left/right with you?

    Give me a break. Brown actually has the cojones to get on the airwaves and criticize the management of this problem, and then says that Obama really wanted this to happen, that his support of exploration was really a fake because he somehow knew that there would be an oil spill and he could use that to shut down drilling. Just how prescient does he think Obama is? What a flake. The most incompetent person in any administration in many years and he is criticizing?
  4. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Give me a break. Brown actually has the cojones to get on the airwaves and criticize the management of this problem, and then says that Obama really wanted this to happen, that his support of exploration was really a fake because he somehow knew that there would be an oil spill and he could use that to shut down drilling. Just how prescient does he think Obama is? What a flake. The most incompetent person in any administration in many years and he is criticizing?
    zelgo drew the correlation to napolitano. Brown is a flake as far as I'm concerned. You'll not hear me defend him.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  5. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #85  
    Oh man, this just keeps getting better. Looks like we have another "winner" in this administration....

    While Oil Slick Spread, Interior Department Chief of Staff Rafted with Wife on "Work-Focused" Trip in Grand Canyon
    ABC News Senior White House Correspondent Jake Tapper
    May 05, 2010 5:47 PM

    Though his agency was charged with coordinating the federal response to the major oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico, Department of the Interior chief of staff Tom Strickland was in the Grand Canyon with his wife last week participating in activities that included white-water rafting, ABC News has learned.

    Other leaders of the Interior Department were focused on the Gulf, joined by other agencies and literally thousands of other employees. But Stricklandís participation in a trip that administration officials insisted was "work-focused" raised eyebrows among other Obama administration officials and even within even his own department, sources told ABC News.

    Strickland, who also serves as Assistant Secretary for Fish and Wildlife and Parks, was in the Grand Canyon with his wife Beth for a total of three days, including one day of rafting. Beth Strickland paid her own way, Obama administration officials said.

    The Stricklands departed for the Grand Canyon three days after the leaks in the Deepwater Horizon pipeline were discovered. Ultimately, after the government realized that the spill was worse than had been previously thought, officials decided that Strickland was needed in the Gulf so Strickland was taken out of the Grand Canyon by a National Park Service helicopter.

    One government official, asking for anonymity because of the political sensitivities involved, told ABC News that some Interior Department employees thought it was "irresponsible" for Strickland to have gone on the trip, given the crisis in the Gulf, which was fully apparent at the time he departed for the Grand Canyon. (edit: irresponsible is an understatement! more like "senseless" and "moronic")

    When asked about Stricklandís trip, Interior Department press secretary Kendra Barkoff told ABC News that "the federal government has been all over this issue from day one in a unified coordinated response." (edit: which we're finding out, day by day, is a lie.)

    Barkoff said that Secretary Salazar deputized Deputy Secretary of the Interior David Hayes "to be the point person on this issue and from the morning after the explosion from the time he got to New Orleans he has been working on this non-stop with the help of other people in the Interior Department as well as other agencies involved."

    An administration source says that Stricklandís trip to the Grand Canyon was work-focused. He was with the director of the National Park Service, Jonathan Jarvis, and Grand Canyon National Park Superintendant Steve Martin, the source said, and they discussed matters such as river flows, beach erosion, humpback chub, tamarisk control, overflights, safety, motor boats, and wilderness management. (edit: which of course is way way more important and immediate than the devastation in the gulf)

    Strickland is Salazarís chief of staff as well as the Assistant Secretary for Fish and Wildlife and Parks, having been confirmed to the latter position on April 30, 2009.

    When asked during his Senate confirmation hearings as to which job would take priority, Strickland was very clear to the members of the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee and the Energy and Natural Resource Committee: "My first priority will be the responsibilities of this assistant secretary position, and we are staffing the personal operation of the Secretary with that in mind," he said.

    Stricklandís deputy chief of staff, Renee Stone, "is going to take most of the responsibilities of the chief of staff day-to-day," he testified.

    The White House has aggressively pushed back on any notions that the federal government did not immediately respond to the crisis, providing today a detailed timeline indicating the day by day response in terms of the total numbers of response vessels, feet of boom deployed, oily water recovered, and overall personnel responding, among other measures.

    That timeline, however, might raise even more questions as to why the Assistant Secretary in charge of fish and wildlife -- not to mention the Interior Department chief of staff -- didnít reconsider the timeliness of his trip to the Grand Canyon with his wife, however work-focused.

    The explosion at Deepwater Horizon was on April 20, and Hayes and Barkoff arrived in the Gulf the next day.

    On Saturday April 24, the first oil leaks were discovered.

    On Tuesday, April 27, Secretary of the Interior Ken Salazar announced that his department along with the Department of Homeland Security would launch an investigation into the Deepwater Horizon Incident. Salazar pledged "every resource we can to support the massive response effort underway at the Deepwater Horizon."

    Strickland and his wife arrived in the Grand Canyon that night.

    The day before his travel, the US Fish and Wildlife Service began working with the Coast Guard to identify high-priority national wildlife refuges to be shielded with boom. More than one thousand overall personnel had been deployed to the region.

    By Thursday, April 29, the fact that Strickland was not one of those personnel became sufficient issue that he tried to leave the Grand Canyon. The night before, the federal government updated its assessment that 1,000 barrels of oil a day were leaking into the Gulf, judging the spillage to be five times that. A National Park Service helicopter was flown in to remove him from the Grand Canyon so he could travel to the Gulf of Mexico to help with the federal response to the oil slick.

    As Strickland made his way to New Orleans that Thursday, April 29, President Obama first addressed the oil slick in public, saying his "administration will continue to use every single available resource at our disposal, including potentially the Department of Defense, to address the incident."

    A former U.S. Attorney for the District of Colorado, Strickland ran unsuccessfully for the US Senate in 1996 and 2002.

    On January 22, 2009, Salazar said that at the department he and Strickland - as a former US Attorney and a former Attorney General, respectively - "will hold people accountable. We will expect to be held accountable."

    -jpt

    A week later, and the night after they announce "every resource we can to support the massive response effort underway at the Deepwater Horizon", Strickland arrives with his wife to shoot rapids. Nice. Like he didn't know. And even then, its two days before he "gets the message" that hey, maybe he's needed too?

    Pretty lame.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  6. #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Since when are you such an anti-environmentist? Don't you agree that focus and containment on an event of this catestrophic level should have happened sooner than the almost 2 weeks? Maybe just a bit sooner, perhaps?

    No, lets deflect with Katrina and Brown? Is it always just left/right with you?
    Uh, 5000 gallons a day. This is next to impossible to contain. Even burning it off is not enough. The leak has to be repaired first. So your point is moot.


    edit: I think that's 5000 barrels
    Last edited by darreno1; 05/05/2010 at 06:43 PM.
    Sony Clie --> Tungsten t2 --> iPhone3g --> Palm Pre --> Droid
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Speaking of deflection tactics, this isn't the katrina thread. I was responding to someone elses deflection! lol

    Good job, just the same!
    Wow another deflection. You're good. Also, whether this is the Katrina thread or not is irrelevant considering the context in which it's being discussed here. But, nice try though .
    Sony Clie --> Tungsten t2 --> iPhone3g --> Palm Pre --> Droid
  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post

    A week later, and the night after they announce "every resource we can to support the massive response effort underway at the Deepwater Horizon", Strickland arrives with his wife to shoot rapids. Nice. Like he didn't know. And even then, its two days before he "gets the message" that hey, maybe he's needed too?

    Pretty lame.

    Him being there doesn't make a difference. There will still be 5000 barrels of oil being spilled into the sea and still a disaster that's next to impossible to contain till the leak is stopped. So....again, it's a rather pathetic effort from the right wing smear machine. But in the end, common sense will prevail.
    Sony Clie --> Tungsten t2 --> iPhone3g --> Palm Pre --> Droid
  9. #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by darreno1 View Post
    Him being there doesn't make a difference. There will still be 5000 barrels of oil being spilled into the sea and still a disaster that's next to impossible to contain till the leak is stopped. So....again, it's a rather pathetic effort from the right wing smear machine. But in the end, common sense will prevail.
    It's truly remarkable how desperate the republicans are to find something, anything, that will demonstrate Obama's "failures". So far they've tried to blame the oil explosion, the oil leak, the Times Square car bomb...it's actually humorous. He must have been a really busy guy, arranging all that.
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    It's truly remarkable how desperate the republicans are to find something, anything, that will demonstrate Obama's "failures". So far they've tried to blame the oil explosion, the oil leak, the Times Square car bomb...it's actually humorous. He must have been a really busy guy, arranging all that.
    No different davidra from how the left blamed, and still blames, Bush for everything that happened for 8 years. I mentioned this before, and you being from Florida probably remember this, but there were billboards down in Florida blaming Bush for increasing hurricane activity. Really? Bush was causing more hurricanes? Talk about a powerful guy!

    As far as the terrorist attacks (what, you still can't say that?, gotta be "Times Square car bomb"?), I believe Bush was blamed for 9/11 and the shoe bomber....soooooo.....should Obama not be blamed for the terrorist attacks (Texas) and near misses under his watch? Or is this yet ANOTHER double standard? We've been lucky, and as someone said on TV the other day, our terrorist policy can't continue to revolve around getting lucky.
    PalmPilot, PalmIIIc, Treo 650, Pre, Pre 3, Nokia 1020, Lumia 950

    "It's good to be the King" - Mel Brooks, History of the World, Part 1

    "I would rather have a German division in front of me than a French one behind me." General George S. Patton
  11. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by darreno1 View Post
    Uh, 5000 gallons a day. This is next to impossible to contain. Even burning it off is not enough. The leak has to be repaired first. So your point is moot.


    edit: I think that's 5000 barrels
    Ahh.. well... now that you've explained it, I don't see what the big hubbub is. Why even pay attention at all? We'll just wait for BP to plug it. It's their problem. That about sum it up?
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  12. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    It's truly remarkable how desperate the republicans are to find something, anything, that will demonstrate Obama's "failures". So far they've tried to blame the oil explosion, the oil leak, the Times Square car bomb...it's actually humorous. He must have been a really busy guy, arranging all that.
    Like Bloomberg? That guy is such a moron! lol. Really, he's embarrassing.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  13. #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Ahh.. well... now that you've explained it, I don't see what the big hubbub is. Why even pay attention at all? We'll just wait for BP to plug it. It's their problem. That about sum it up?
    Well... who else is going to plug it up? Please explain how it 'should' have been handled, I'm all ears.
    Sony Clie --> Tungsten t2 --> iPhone3g --> Palm Pre --> Droid
  14. #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by clemgrad85 View Post
    No different davidra from how the left blamed, and still blames, Bush for everything that happened for 8 years. I mentioned this before, and you being from Florida probably remember this, but there were billboards down in Florida blaming Bush for increasing hurricane activity. Really? Bush was causing more hurricanes? Talk about a powerful guy!

    As far as the terrorist attacks (what, you still can't say that?, gotta be "Times Square car bomb"?), I believe Bush was blamed for 9/11 and the shoe bomber....soooooo.....should Obama not be blamed for the terrorist attacks (Texas) and near misses under his watch? Or is this yet ANOTHER double standard? We've been lucky, and as someone said on TV the other day, our terrorist policy can't continue to revolve around getting lucky.
    So let's see....you are equating a person acting alone who left a stupidly-made "car bomb" with firecrackers to a well-orchestrated effort that took years, leaving tracks everywhere and with the president ignoring a specific warning that killed thousands of people?
    And I think it's reasonable to say that I never blamed Bush for hurricanes or the shoe bomber. I think I'm intelligent enough to know better. Are you?
  15. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by darreno1 View Post
    Well... who else is going to plug it up? Please explain how it 'should' have been handled, I'm all ears.
    You're the one talking about approach. I never complained one bit about anyones cleanup strategy. I'm still trying to figure out what your issue is with my posts. It's like you're just looking for random things to counter me on.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  16. #96  
    Quote Originally Posted by clemgrad85 View Post
    No different davidra from how the left blamed, and still blames, Bush for everything that happened for 8 years. I mentioned this before, and you being from Florida probably remember this, but there were billboards down in Florida blaming Bush for increasing hurricane activity. Really? Bush was causing more hurricanes? Talk about a powerful guy!

    As far as the terrorist attacks (what, you still can't say that?, gotta be "Times Square car bomb"?), I believe Bush was blamed for 9/11 and the shoe bomber....soooooo.....should Obama not be blamed for the terrorist attacks (Texas) and near misses under his watch? Or is this yet ANOTHER double standard? We've been lucky, and as someone said on TV the other day, our terrorist policy can't continue to revolve around getting lucky.
    Are you trying to say that Bush was as pro-active as he could've been during the time previous to 9/11? Are you also trying to imply his response to Katrina was appropriate? By attacking another country that had NOTHING to do with 9/11, Bush played a role in arousing even more anger against the United States. So yes, it is appropriate to place some blame on his administration for the situation we are in now. Notice I said some, I cannot blame him outright, and only a nutcase would do that and yes we do have some on the left as well.
    Sony Clie --> Tungsten t2 --> iPhone3g --> Palm Pre --> Droid
  17. #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    You're the one talking about approach. I never complained one bit about anyones cleanup strategy. I'm still trying to figure out what your issue is with my posts. It's like you're just looking for random things to counter me on.
    So what exactly are you complaining about if you don't have a problem with the cleanup strategy? You post blurb after blurb from right-leaning websites discussing varying topics and I'm addressing them. And you're talking about the government not being fast enough regarding the containment. So to me, that would imply you DO indeed have a problem with the strategy.
    Sony Clie --> Tungsten t2 --> iPhone3g --> Palm Pre --> Droid
  18. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by darreno1 View Post
    So what exactly are you complaining about if you don't have a problem with the cleanup strategy? You post blurb after blurb from right-leaning websites discussing varying topics and I'm addressing them. And you're talking about the government not being fast enough regarding the containment. So to me, that would imply you DO indeed have a problem with the strategy.
    What exactly have you addressed again? Did you even read the op?
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  19. #99  
    Quote Originally Posted by darreno1 View Post
    Are you trying to say that Bush was as pro-active as he could've been during the time previous to 9/11? Are you also trying to imply his response to Katrina was appropriate? By attacking another country that had NOTHING to do with 9/11, Bush played a role in arousing even more anger against the United States. So yes, it is appropriate to place some blame on his administration for the situation we are in now. Notice I said some, I cannot blame him outright, and only a nutcase would do that and yes we do have some on the left as well.
    The only one of those I am willing to say Bush should catch some blame on is the Katrina response time. I don't live down in that area, but did live through the Hugo hit here in Charleston, but based on the little time I spent reading and watching the news regarding Katrina it seems like much of the blame should have been placed on the mayor down there who had a horrible plan in place. If the mayor had been more pro-active prior to the storm, it sounded as if things would have been better. But...the mayor is black and you can't really go after him or you get labeled a racist....soooo.....you go after whitie (that would be Bush). In addition, I don't think you blame Bush for people not leaving when they were encouraged to leave. I left for Hugo....in hindsight it was the smart thing to do (though I must admit, I didn't want to leave) but I know many that stayed and while they have some terrific stories, they swear they won't stay again.

    As for 9/11, I don't blame Bush directly for it. Sorry, just don't....but....since it occured while he was Prez I am willing to say he should shoulder some of the blame if Obama should shoulder some of the blame for the Fort Hood shootings. Because the planning of 9/11 started before Bush was Prez, they certainly didn't do the attack because they hated Bush, but apparently they didn't care for how things were going under Clinton. By the way, I would assume you would place some if not more blame on Clinton for 9/11? And I have no problems with us using 9/11 as a reason to go into Iraq.....nope.....no problem with that. I'd rather fight the idiots on their soil with our military than fight them on our soil with civilians. I know, I know....you will say that Iraq had nothing to do with the attack and while that may be true to a large extent, it was time someone took care of Hussein (not Obama, the dead guy). I realize you disagree with that....and that's fine. And davidra, I don't hate darreno1 because I disagree with him.....I don't know him......if I did know him, maybe I would....but at this point I just disagree with him.
    PalmPilot, PalmIIIc, Treo 650, Pre, Pre 3, Nokia 1020, Lumia 950

    "It's good to be the King" - Mel Brooks, History of the World, Part 1

    "I would rather have a German division in front of me than a French one behind me." General George S. Patton
  20. #100  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Ahh.. well... now that you've explained it, I don't see what the big hubbub is. Why even pay attention at all? We'll just wait for BP to plug it. It's their problem. That about sum it up?
    If you're interested in what really happened, and what really was done, you might try looking at the chronology as released by the White House. And if you think anyone would fake this info, imagine the risk that would entail.

    The Ongoing Administration-Wide Response to the Deepwater BP Oil Spill | The White House

    Several things are clear: The Assistant Secretary of the Interior was deployed to Louisiana the morning after the explosion, and a full day before the rig actually sank. It's also clear that that same day, Coast Guard fly-overs and submarines found no evidence of a leak.

    If you read through what actually happened, and you still think they didn't do what they could have, then fine. What was enlightening was watching Joe Scarborough lambasting the republicans this morning for trying to make an issue out of this where no issue exists. A 16 page report was issued within 36 hours of the explosion and before the rig even sank. But I"m sure you are much more aware of what went on, right?
Page 5 of 18 FirstFirst 1234567891015 ... LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions