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  1. #241  
    Quote Originally Posted by groovy View Post
    So you're saying they can only go in for a random or standard periodic audit then?
    Yes. I do not see a problem with that.
    "Brace yourself, you beautiful *****. I am about to **** you up with some truth!" - Kenny Powers

    "I don't mind paying taxes. With taxes, I purchase civilization."
    - H.L. Mencken
  2. #242  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xerlot View Post
    Stats lie but if you want personal experience.
    Stats which can be verified or one's personal experience? Tough call!

    My wife does HR for a construction company. In the last year she has has 1/3 of her new hires come up at a later time to be illegal but they passed the E-verify.
    How frequently is E-Verify required to be employed? What prevents it from being employed more frequently?
  3. Xerlot's Avatar
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    #243  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kenanator View Post
    You get an ID and you make a call to ICE and verify its legitimacy before you make the hire. Or, you know, you can just hire citizens, and not immigrants, legal or otherwise. It is not rocket science.
    You think the new law is bad try not hiring Hispanics. I think they call that racism
  4. Xerlot's Avatar
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    #244  
    Quote Originally Posted by mcmaster48 View Post
    Stats which can be verified or one's personal experience? Tough call!



    How frequently is E-Verify required to be employed? What prevents it from being employed more frequently?
    Every new hire in the state of AZ must go through E-verify or you run the risk of being fined heavily. If you run E-verify you are exempt from any fines.
  5. #245  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xerlot View Post
    You think the new law is bad try not hiring Hispanics. I think they call that racism
    I think it is racist that you are assuming that all Hispanics are illegal...
    "Brace yourself, you beautiful *****. I am about to **** you up with some truth!" - Kenny Powers

    "I don't mind paying taxes. With taxes, I purchase civilization."
    - H.L. Mencken
  6. #246  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xerlot View Post
    Every new hire in the state of AZ must go through E-verify or you run the risk of being fined heavily. If you run E-verify you are exempt from any fines.
    And I am sure that farms and construction companies are strictly adhering to those E-Verify standards...

    Let me ask you a question. If your E-Verify is working, and no illegals are being hired, what are they coming to Arizona for? You can't tell me that they ALL have fake IDs, that would be ignorant. What is drawing them to AZ?
    "Brace yourself, you beautiful *****. I am about to **** you up with some truth!" - Kenny Powers

    "I don't mind paying taxes. With taxes, I purchase civilization."
    - H.L. Mencken
  7. #247  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xerlot View Post
    The reason you can't enforce it is because acorrding to e-verify they are legal. They have stolen Id's. It is all so simple when you are not here in the thick of it. You sit up in your chair from Iowa or wher ever you are and say this is all you have to do. Bottom line is that you can not fine a company for unknowingly hiring illegals. You think the lawsuits might be bad from this law think how bad they would be if you start finning businesses for unknowingly hiring illegals.
    Iowa doesn't have the numbers of illegal immigrants that the border states do, but the illegals are a big reason for the hourly wage in meat packing plants being about 1/2 what it was in the 1980s.
  8. #248  
    Quote Originally Posted by hrminer92 View Post
    Iowa doesn't have the numbers of illegal immigrants that the border states do, but the illegals are a big reason for the hourly wage in meat packing plants being about 1/2 what it was in the 1980s.
    I think that is called Walmart, not illegal immigrants.
  9. groovy's Avatar
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    #249  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kenanator View Post
    Yes. I do not see a problem with that.
    So you're not for corporate racial profiling where someone tips off ICE about illegal immigrant activity and then ICE performs an audit?
  10. #250  
    Quote Originally Posted by groovy View Post
    Does that answer the question? No. Despite your over-generalization and consistent hyperbole, this man's suggestion is no more likely to occur than a monkey popping out of your rear.
    \

    You're right. It's the comparing of Hispanics to dogs that's the true representative attitude of the right wing. He wouldn't want to pay for having chips put in all of them. Too much spending.
  11. #251  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Last time I checked, breaking the law was really negative. When did this change?

    I agree that we need to treat these people with respect, as we bust them for breaking the law.

    That said, the focus needs to be on those that hire these people. Enforce the laws that require businesses to hire legal aliens, or with work permits, and the illegals numbers will be significantly reduced.
    screw "the law" and whoever freakin makes em...and whoever tries to enforce em...an unjust law is no law at all in my book...idk wat country I'm in...idiots talkin about law like whatever is in the law is correct...forget the fact that man(politicians) makes laws and how the vast majority of politicians are currupt and push some sort of agenda...oh or wat about the fact that we once had laws which said racism was ok...segregation ok...women are second class citizens...oh an I gotta add this classic one...marijuanna is illegal and a drug (bs) but alcohol is just fine and dandy to purchase and consume...lol...give me a break!
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    #252  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    \

    You're right. It's the comparing of Hispanics to dogs that's the true representative attitude of the right wing. He wouldn't want to pay for having chips put in all of them. Too much spending.
    How is this a "representative attitude"? Would you care to offer specifics?
  13. #253  
    Quote Originally Posted by groovy View Post
    How is this a "representative attitude"? Would you care to offer specifics?
    US rep backs deport of illegal immigrants' US kids
    (AP) 8 hours ago
    SAN DIEGO Rep. Duncan Hunter said he would support deporting U.S.-born children of illegal immigrants, adding that "it takes more than walking across the border to be an American citizen."
    The San Diego-area Republican congressman spoke Saturday at a video recorded tea party rally in Ramona. Hunter was asked by someone in the crowd if he backed deporting natural-born American citizens who are the children of illegal immigrants.
    "I would have to, yes," Hunter said.
    Hunter said in the video that some of his critics believe his stance is mean-spirited.
    "And we're not being mean. We're just saying it takes more than walking across the border to become an American citizen," he said. "It's what's in our souls."
    The 14th amendment to the U.S. Constitution guarantees citizenship to all persons born in the United States.

    Hunter also supports a House bill that calls for the elimination of automatic birthright citizenship for children born to undocumented immigrants. It is unclear whether the bill would be constitutional.

    Only way you could show it's not representative would be to know what's "in the souls" of the T-baggers like this guy. My guess is that more than half of them would look just like him. Hatred incarnate.
  14. #254  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xerlot View Post
    Gee why haven't those of us in AZ thought of that before................

    Oh wait we HAVE you ever hear of E-Verify. This is the way businesses can check the status of the worker. If this has been done then the business is not responsible for any outcome from Stolen ID's. Which is the problem when you hit the businesses. If as a owner of a business I hire an illegal that has fake documentation then how can I be held reposible for hiring him. I am not versed in fake documents enough to find a good one.

    So come up with a better idea. Don't act as though this is the wild west and we have no idea what we are doing around here. We have been fighting this battle longer than most of us have been alive and have tried all kinds of things to make the problem managable with no success. This is the next step in the function.
    i would humbly suggest that they are either NOT going after the businesses, or the fines are so damn small to be a joke with the businesses.. if it was truly designed to stop the illegals, then the penalty to the businesses would be large, up to and including jail time for managers/owners. I said it before and I will say it again, there is only one reason they come, MONEY, there is only one reason the businesses hire them, MONEY.
    If as you say there are checks in place, then great, USE THEM. Whether your for or against this law, you are opening up yourselves to a massive lawsuit. The cop on the beat is the one that is gonna take the heat, not some bloody legislator in your capital.
    Then you gotta ask yourself this, what if, you have a fine officer of the law, who's parents are illegals, entirely possible, hell entirely likely, is he/she gonna ask? Probably not, and frankly can not blame them one bit in my mind.
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
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    #255  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Only way you could show it's not representative would be to know what's "in the souls" of the T-baggers like this guy. My guess is that more than half of them would look just like him. Hatred incarnate.
    I'm not sure how hysterics advances your cause but it's yours to try to advance nonetheless. Neither Rep. Hunter's remark, nor his stance on "birthright citizenship" explains your personally held belief that conservatives compare Mexicans to dogs. I guess it all makes sense in your mind. However, outside of some concrete evidence, which you appear to really value in other disciplines, I'm just calling your claims like I see them: hysterics.
  16. #256  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xerlot View Post
    The reason you can't enforce it is because acorrding to e-verify they are legal. They have stolen Id's. It is all so simple when you are not here in the thick of it. You sit up in your chair from Iowa or wher ever you are and say this is all you have to do. Bottom line is that you can not fine a company for unknowingly hiring illegals. You think the lawsuits might be bad from this law think how bad they would be if you start finning businesses for unknowingly hiring illegals.
    ok, my brother recently moved back to Canada after about 5 years down in AZ. He did/does computer design, some sort of bloody engineer in it, fact, the company that hired him initially supplied him with false docs, to get him in. He only stayed about 2 months, his claim was/is once he found out, he turned himself in. NOTHING happened to the company that pulled this shiet. He went on to get the proper visas and what not. Said he quite enjoyed AZ, the thing he did hate though was the bs about the illegals, he routinely saw heard companies supply docs or turn a blind eye to hiring illegals. The thing he thought was the worst is the number of non Latino illegals. But, the "dislike" of the Latinos was so intense to be pathetic. Some of the stories he told me were unbelievable, but he swears are true. He claims that was one of the biggest reasons he left.
    Life is short, Play hard, and enjoy every moment as if it was your last.
  17. #257  
    Quote Originally Posted by Issey_phresh View Post
    screw "the law" and whoever freakin makes em...and whoever tries to enforce em...an unjust law is no law at all in my book...idk wat country I'm in...idiots talkin about law like whatever is in the law is correct...forget the fact that man(politicians) makes laws and how the vast majority of politicians are currupt and push some sort of agenda...oh or wat about the fact that we once had laws which said racism was ok...segregation ok...women are second class citizens...oh an I gotta add this classic one...marijuanna is illegal and a drug (bs) but alcohol is just fine and dandy to purchase and consume...lol...give me a break!
    i agree with you 100%
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    #258  
    If you are not here legally...out you go! It's sad that AZ even had to pass such a law.

    Look... If you want to live in the United States, great. Come here through the proper channels and make a new life for yourself...we're glad to have you.

    However, come here illegally and your $hit out of luck. That's not the way it works.

    it's funny how people are up in arms about the unjustness of a law when you've broken it and now fear having to be held responsible for your actions.

    Sorry...you can't rob a bank then whine about how unfair the punnishment is when your about to be caught. You rolled the dice coming here when you shouldn't have. The only person to blame is yourself.
  19. #259  
    OK, I've got an even better idea than before.

    I suggested that once illegal aliens are caught, they should be forced to work for community service or something, in order to pay their plane ride past their home... all the way to Panama.

    How about this one? --> Permit the employer to hand over one paycheck to the alien (just to trick 'em ), but the second one (presumably from weeks 3 to 4 of working) gets handed over to the guy working for NCICS, Homeland Security, Border Patrol, or whatever the heck you wanna call 'em.

    That second paycheck can ship the guy to Panama right away. Eventually, the aliens can relay their greek message to the rest of the aliens, while traveling back up to Mexico... that "You more than likely won't be able to work for more than a month, and half of that time, you will see NO DINEROS! Might as well learn the English language first and immigrate the proper way."

    I'm only about 99% sure that this would solve all of our problems. Employers could effectively hire Mexicans and pay them 50%, while the other 50% goes to NCICS to ship them off to Panama. And then the employer can just start all over again.

    Percentages can be modified for effectiveness and efficiency, of course.
  20. #260  
    Quote Originally Posted by groovy View Post
    I'm not sure how hysterics advances your cause but it's yours to try to advance nonetheless. Neither Rep. Hunter's remark, nor his stance on "birthright citizenship" explains your personally held belief that conservatives compare Mexicans to dogs. I guess it all makes sense in your mind. However, outside of some concrete evidence, which you appear to really value in other disciplines, I'm just calling your claims like I see them: hysterics.
    Well, in fairness, I do abhor hyperbole regarding health care, especially when it's grossly incorrect or outright lying. So I will retract my statement. I don't think the attitude that Mexicans are the same as dogs is "representative" of T-baggers. Just some of them, like Pat Bertroche (R). It's worthwhile to notice, though, that nobody in the republican party has expressed outrage about his "chip" comments.

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