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  1. #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    OK. So my interpretation is that you don't really care as long as it doesn't affect you. That's fine too. I'll avoid even raising any theoreticals, but will take it to mean that you are in support of a woman's right to choose, since you won't take a stand.
    Are you asking me a question?

    I support a woman's right to choose. She can choose to avoid sex during ovulation (I know this possible), she can choose to use various methods of contraception.
    She can choose to be responsible for her actions (the main purpose of sex is to get pregnant so anyone who chooses to have sex needs to responsible for any of the outcomes, disease, pregnancy etc.).
    She can choose not to kill her unborn children because she is too lazy, stupid, or irresponsible to make a different choice before she gets pregnant.
    If that makes me an uncaring republican conservative right wing whacko, so be it. If she is old enough to choose to have sex, she should be responsible enough to deal with whatever happens. Why hold an unborn child responsible because its mother is a stupid cow.

    That enough of a stand for you?
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  2. #82  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof View Post
    Are you asking me a question?

    I support a woman's right to choose. She can choose to avoid sex during ovulation (I know this possible), she can choose to use various methods of contraception.
    She can choose to be responsible for her actions (the main purpose of sex is to get pregnant so anyone who chooses to have sex needs to responsible for any of the outcomes, disease, pregnancy etc.).
    She can choose not to kill her unborn children because she is too lazy, stupid, or irresponsible to make a different choice before she gets pregnant.
    If that makes me an uncaring republican conservative right wing whacko, so be it. If she is old enough to choose to have sex, she should be responsible enough to deal with whatever happens. Why hold an unborn child responsible because its mother is a stupid cow.

    That enough of a stand for you?
    Even when the "stupid cow" risks death by carrying the child? You have shown your rear end, but you haven't answered the original question. Or can you remember what it was, given your blind hatred for women?
  3. #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof View Post
    Are you asking me a question?

    I support a woman's right to choose. She can choose to avoid sex during ovulation (I know this possible), she can choose to use various methods of contraception.
    She can choose to be responsible for her actions (the main purpose of sex is to get pregnant so anyone who chooses to have sex needs to responsible for any of the outcomes, disease, pregnancy etc.).
    She can choose not to kill her unborn children because she is too lazy, stupid, or irresponsible to make a different choice before she gets pregnant.
    If that makes me an uncaring republican conservative right wing whacko, so be it. If she is old enough to choose to have sex, she should be responsible enough to deal with whatever happens. Why hold an unborn child responsible because its mother is a stupid cow.

    That enough of a stand for you?
    Does she choose to get raped by her father?

    Do you choose to flush millions of people down the toilet every time you are feeling frisky?
  4. #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Funny. I'm a doc, and private insurance companies tell me what to do at least as much as Medicare. Neither really has much impact on what I do, they just pay me. Some make it easier than others (like Medicare). Where in this bill do you see the government telling doctors what to do?

    Actually...they do go to places with lower prices, if not free.



    If by "freedom" you mean the ability to die because you can't get the care you need, yep, we've got that, unlike every other developed country.

    You must be highly trained in health care economics to be so confident about what's going to happen in the future. Can you please enlighten us about your training so we can give your opinion the attention it deserves? Or are you just mouthing off about something you know nothing about?

    And yes, health care is different. If you don't think it is, try going without it when you need it.
    Since you're a doc, I'm happy you are willing to make a more average salary, say $75k/yr? Since that's above average, getting all docs and their bosses to make sub 100k will lower expenses. Personally, I don't mind docs making the big salaries they do; it takes a lot of lost years of earning income to get the degrees. From the few docs I know, they are not happy now days taking medicare b/c they are paid less and basically cover cost. I just have a problem w/ someone telling me I MUST buy insurance. That's BS. No where does it say my country has to provide me the luxury (no right) to heath care. When is the "fat" tax being implemented? What about the "no exercise" tax? I work to stay in shape and not eat pizza every meal (Lou Mulnatti's rocks, BTW), and now I get to pay for the lazy people. If you believe health insurance is a RIGHT, then we'll always be opposed. If it's about the $, please inform me the last time you bought anything and actually offered to pay more for it. Everyone is underpaid. Everything cost a bit more than we think it should. People make bad decisions and want to the same results as those of us that make better decisions. I smoke my 15 cigars a year...and if I get throat cancer b/c of this, it's MY FAULT. I don't expect someone to pay for my medicine if I elect to spend my money on vacations and big screens instead of insurance. I swear, if we had this attitude 240 years ago the dang Jolly Roger flag would still be flying. I don't know what will happen, and neither do you.

    What I do know is that gov't ALWAYS cost more than they predict and are always more inefficient than private business. I worked for a bit in a gov't project...and the people there don't care about cost, b/c it's NOT THEIR $. When it's not your cash, you spend it carelessly.

    My final main complaint is that all these goof balls that passed this bill WILL NOT BE USING IT! Talk about hippo-crates!

    I'll ignore your condescending remarks, b/c you obviously know all the health economics. Is that a degree? PhD Medical economics? Must be through the econ department.

    Really? "Freedom to die"? As far as I know anyone can go to the ER room and get treated. Ride a Harley w/o a helmet and become a vegetable and you get the rest of us to pay for it. Bad decision that the rest of us pay for.

    This should be a new thread, but does anyone know if democrats itemize their taxes? I'd assume no, since they seem to be against tax cuts, and therefore enjoy paying them. Just curious! fairtax.org
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Even when the "stupid cow" risks death by carrying the child? You have shown your rear end, but you haven't answered the original question. Or can you remember what it was, given your blind hatred for women?
    Love this one. Let's see some stats on how many pregnancies threaten the lives of the mothers. Ya I can google, but it's your comment so you show the data. I'm gonna bet it less that 1%.
    Blind hatred for women...lol don't tell my wife.
    What I do hate is people who refuse to take responsibility for their actions.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  6. #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by NathanS View Post
    Does she choose to get raped by her father?

    Do you choose to flush millions of people down the toilet every time you are feeling frisky?
    1. Does anyone choose that? And what are the percentages that get abortions are raped by their fathers?
    2. Uh ya you need to go back to biology class Nate.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof View Post
    Love this one. Let's see some stats on how many pregnancies threaten the lives of the mothers. Ya I can google, but it's your comment so you show the data. I'm gonna bet it less that 1%.
    Blind hatred for women...lol don't tell my wife.
    What I do hate is people who refuse to take responsibility for their actions.
    You have a short memory. When we began this discussion I asked specifically if it made a difference how commonly this occurred. I did that on purpose because you seem to fall back on this excuse for avoiding the question. So let's try again, and see if it's possible for you to answer the question, for the third or fourth time, with the understanding that we are talking about a philosophical and political policy, and not the frequency of occurrence. The question was not how frequently this occurs, because really that doesn't make any difference at all. It occurs. And when it occurs, some decision has to be made.

    Do you support abortion in situations where pregnancy threatens the woman's life?

    And yes, I believe your paternalistic and demeaning statement demonstrated clear disdain for women and their ability to function as sentient beings. Of course, as best I can tell you don't fit that description either, so maybe that's an explanation.
  8. #88  
    Religious excuses for murder #5000+


    DALLAS - A Texas man faces charges after he filed documents in federal court threatening to use deadly force to stop an abortion if the U.S. Supreme Court didn't immediately act to outlaw the practice, federal officials said Monday.

    Erlyndon Joseph "Joey" Lo, 27, of Plano, filed documents there Friday saying his religious beliefs entitled him to use deadly force to prevent an abortion. He listed the name of a clinic, its address and the time he was going to show up — noon that day.

    "I plan on saving at least one human life in Dallas, Texas," Lo wrote.

    It is unclear if Lo is married. Authorities said Monday he lives with his parents.

    In his complaint against the Supreme Court, Lo said he was filing a class-action lawsuit seeking more than $999 trillion in damages. He asked the court to pay him $1,000 an hour in attorney fees.

    Lo equated abortion to murder, explaining his religious convictions required him to kill in order to prevent women from terminating pregnancies.

    "My religious beliefs include the beliefs that an individual is alive at the moment of conception, abortion is murder and is the worst murder of all murders possible because these babies are completely defenseless, and I am entitled under my religious beliefs to use deadly force if necessary to save the innocent life of another," Lo wrote.

    So how many of you are supportive of this right-wing approach? Woof, how bout it? Why don't you be an apologist for this creep?
  9. #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof View Post
    1. Does anyone choose that? And what are the percentages that get abortions are raped by their fathers?
    2. Uh ya you need to go back to biology class Nate.
    Uhh, so a collection of stationary unviable cells is a human... right.
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    So how many of you are supportive of this right-wing approach? Woof, how bout it? Why don't you be an apologist for this creep?

    Doc nobody is suggesting that so quit being a flame thrower...it reflects poorly on your noble profession.
  11. #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by NathanS View Post
    Uhh, so a collection of stationary unviable cells is a human... right.
    Number one too tough for you?
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    Religious excuses for murder #5000+




    So how many of you are supportive of this right-wing approach? Woof, how bout it? Why don't you be an apologist for this creep?
    Everyone who disagrees with you is in the same boat. Grow up.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  13. #93  
    49,551,703 Total Abortions since 1973 in the US alone.

    Why Do Women Have Abortions?
    - a statistical breakdown

    Responses listed as primary reason %

    Social Reasons (given as primary reason)
    - Feels unready for child/responsibility 25%
    - Feels she can't afford baby 23%
    - Has all the children she wants/Other family responsibilities 19%
    - Relationship problem/Single motherhood 8%
    - Feels she isn't mature enough 7%
    - Interference with education/career plans 4%
    - Parents/Partner wants abortion <1%
    - Other reasons <6.5%
    TOTAL: 93%
    (Approx.)

    "Hard Cases" (given as primary reason)
    - Mother's Health 4%
    - Baby may have health problem 3%
    - Rape or Incest <0.5%
    Just call me Berd.
  14. #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by davidra View Post
    You have a short memory. When we began this discussion I asked specifically if it made a difference how commonly this occurred. I did that on purpose because you seem to fall back on this excuse for avoiding the question. So let's try again, and see if it's possible for you to answer the question, for the third or fourth time, with the understanding that we are talking about a philosophical and political policy, and not the frequency of occurrence. The question was not how frequently this occurs, because really that doesn't make any difference at all. It occurs. And when it occurs, some decision has to be made.

    Do you support abortion in situations where pregnancy threatens the woman's life?

    And yes, I believe your paternalistic and demeaning statement demonstrated clear disdain for women and their ability to function as sentient beings. Of course, as best I can tell you don't fit that description either, so maybe that's an explanation.
    1. Not sure. How can i make the determination on something so rare? It would seem best to me to be a case by case basis, because otherwise the "let abort everyone" crowd would find a way to make alot more pregnancies "a danger to the mother".
    2. I love the fact that your a consistently condescending and demeaning child in these forums. It makes you so fun to be around and discuss things with. Said it before, grow up.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  15. #95  
    There were over 3,500 abortions per day in 2003, 146 per hour, about one every 25 seconds.

    In 2003, more children died from abortion than Americans died in the Revolutionary War, the Civil War, World Wars I and II, the Korean, Vietnam and Gulf Wars combined.

    At an average cost of $372, the abortion business is a $400 million a year industry.
    Just call me Berd.
  16. #96  
    'O' My Gosh! I'm pregnant again' says the reckless woman.
    'No big deal - Insurance will cover it'
    'Hey sexy man, no need for protection, I got insurance'
    Just call me Berd.
  17. #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle View Post
    49,551,703 Total Abortions since 1973 in the US alone.

    Why Do Women Have Abortions?
    - a statistical breakdown

    Responses listed as primary reason %

    Social Reasons (given as primary reason)
    - Feels unready for child/responsibility 25%
    - Feels she can't afford baby 23%
    - Has all the children she wants/Other family responsibilities 19%
    - Relationship problem/Single motherhood 8%
    - Feels she isn't mature enough 7%
    - Interference with education/career plans 4%
    - Parents/Partner wants abortion <1%
    - Other reasons <6.5%
    TOTAL: 93%
    (Approx.)

    "Hard Cases" (given as primary reason)
    - Mother's Health 4%
    - Baby may have health problem 3%
    - Rape or Incest <0.5%


    So out of those numbers since 1973

    1,982,068.12 Due to Health Issues
    1,486,551.08 Because the baby MAY have health problems
    247,758.515 because of Incest

    Now my question is... How many of the first 2 are repeat customer?
    Last edited by Major Payne; 04/06/2010 at 01:26 PM.
    In a world of droid, Pre does it better.

    Shouldn't we treat this world like the Garden of Eden and avoid the apple at all costs?
  18. #98  
    Nearly half of all abortions are obtained by women who have already had at least one abortion.
    Just call me Berd.
  19. #99  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof View Post
    1. Not sure. How can i make the determination on something so rare? It would seem best to me to be a case by case basis, because otherwise the "let abort everyone" crowd would find a way to make alot more pregnancies "a danger to the mother".
    2. I love the fact that your a consistently condescending and demeaning child in these forums. It makes you so fun to be around and discuss things with. Said it before, grow up.
    #1. Fine. I totally agree. It should be on a case-by-case basis. At least it finally appears that we can conclude that you are not 100% opposed to the concept, which was all I was trying to find out. Would have been much easier if you had just said that from the beginning instead of hiding behind numbers and the fact that it can't happen to you.
    #2. Condescending and demeaning would be an appropriate description of your posts concerning the behavior of, and ability of women to make their own decisions without criticism and insults from a paternalistic extremist.
  20. Micael's Avatar
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    #100  
    Quote Originally Posted by Major Payne View Post
    So out of those numbers since 1973

    1,982,068.12 have had there lives saved.
    1,486,551.08 Because the baby MAY have health problems
    247,758.515 because of Incest

    Now my question is... How many of the first 2 are repeat customer?
    My questions... where's the .12 life that was saved?
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
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