Page 58 of 143 FirstFirst ... 848535455565758596061626368108 ... LastLast
Results 1,141 to 1,160 of 2855
  1. #1141  
    Quote Originally Posted by Toby View Post
    I'm watching Hardball at the moment, and Chris was just trying to bring up the "car insurance is mandatory, why not health insurance" argument. To which I can only respond, "which federal law made car insurance mandatory?"
    So am I right in guessing that if you had your druthers there would never have been any Medicare, Medicaid or Social Security either?
  2. #1142  
    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    ...SNIP... YOU LOST THE ELECTION. Now get out of the way.
    Wow hostile much? Since when did the loser of any election, party or otherwise just go in a hole and shut up? Never. And sorry to say winning does not give you the right to bulldoze your way through the Constitution.

    Your team is just mad because you won and people are not drinking the kool aid. Folks are reading the proposed legislation and getting pissed off and you just cant handle it. Boo-hoo.
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  3. jmelan's Avatar
    Posts
    29 Posts
    Global Posts
    37 Global Posts
    #1143  
    Please notice a reference to actual data is posted, not just an opinion from a website

    Although a majority of Americans are dissatisfied with the quality and cost of health care, they are overwhelmingly satisfied with their own care.


    Satisfied / Dissatisfied / Don't know
    Total cost of health care in America 18% 80% 2%
    Personal health care costs 57% 40% 3%
    Quality of health care in America 44% 54% 2%
    Quality of health care personally received 89% 10% 1%
    Quality of communication with personal doctor 87% 12% 1%
    Ability to get medical care 83% 13% 4%
    Ability to get a doctor's appointment 82% 17% 1%
    Ability to see top-quality specialists 79% 17% 4%
    Ability to get the latest treatments 78% 17% 5%

    Source: ABC News/Kaiser Family Foundation/USA Today "Health Care in America Survey"
  4. #1144  
    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    So am I right in guessing that if you had your druthers there would never have been any Medicare, Medicaid or Social Security either?
    If that was a canyon you'd be more famous that Evel Kneivel for that leap.

    On a side note, why is anyone here ga ga over Social Security? Isn't it like BROKE!!!
    “There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order.”
    — Ed Howdershelt
    "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."- Thomas Jefferson
  5. #1145  
    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    So am I right in guessing that if you had your druthers there would never have been any Medicare, Medicaid or Social Security either?
    Among quite a few other things, yes. The federal government is exactly like health care costs. It keeps getting bigger and bigger with no end in sight. If proponents of a 'public option' were being intellectually honest, they would consider it just as unsustainable as the current health care system. I am not opposed to some degree of health care reform at the federal level if it means regulating interstate issues. However, I cannot see how a system with the same issues can hope to fix a different system before it fixes itself. Physician heal thyself, in effect.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  6. #1146  
    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    So am I right in guessing that if you had your druthers there would never have been any Medicare, Medicaid or Social Security either?
    Certainly should not have been there on a Federal level, as this is something that should have been handled on the state level or not at all. None of those items are in the US Constitution as items that the Federal Government should be involved with.....just as education is not in the Constitution as it was something that was left to the states to handle.

    Go to here: Historic Documents - The Constitution of the United States of America Read Article 1, Section 8 that lists the powers of the Congress.

    Another interesting read is a little history of how Social Security got past the Supreme Court: Is Social Security Constitutional? by John Attarian An interesting read....the court did rule in favor of Social Security being Constitutional, but it appears that Roosevelt had a gun to the courts head.
  7. #1147  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmelan View Post
    Please notice a reference to actual data is posted, not just an opinion from a website

    Although a majority of Americans are dissatisfied with the quality and cost of health care, they are overwhelmingly satisfied with their own care.


    Satisfied / Dissatisfied / Don't know
    Total cost of health care in America 18% 80% 2%
    Personal health care costs 57% 40% 3%
    Quality of health care in America 44% 54% 2%
    Quality of health care personally received 89% 10% 1%
    Quality of communication with personal doctor 87% 12% 1%
    Ability to get medical care 83% 13% 4%
    Ability to get a doctor's appointment 82% 17% 1%
    Ability to see top-quality specialists 79% 17% 4%
    Ability to get the latest treatments 78% 17% 5%

    Source: ABC News/Kaiser Family Foundation/USA Today "Health Care in America Survey"
    Do you happen to have a link to the survey data handy?
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  8. #1148  
    Quote Originally Posted by Toby View Post
    Do you happen to have a link to the survey data handy?
    Toby.....found the survey: http://kff.org/kaiserpolls/upload/7572.pdf

    It is an interesting survey.....I enjoyed how high the percent was that wanted a universal style of health care until certain things were added. The percent who wanted it dropped like a rock when things such as "having to pay more taxes"....or "having certain treatments limited"....or "waiting lists for non-emergency treatments".....were added to the question. Sometimes you just have to really look at all the data.
  9. #1149  
    Quote Originally Posted by clemgrad85 View Post
    Toby.....found the survey: http://kff.org/kaiserpolls/upload/7572.pdf

    It is an interesting survey.....I enjoyed how high the percent was that wanted a universal style of health care until certain things were added. The percent who wanted it dropped like a rock when things such as "having to pay more taxes"....or "having certain treatments limited"....or "waiting lists for non-emergency treatments".....were added to the question. Sometimes you just have to really look at all the data.
    Exactly. I've found that most of the Kaiser Foundation data is fairly solid, and they are open about their methodology, which is what's really important. They clearly reveal what the questions were and how they were answered. Their data over time seems to support the trend as well. People may not like something generally, or think that reform is needed, but once details start coming out, general support fades.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  10. #1150  
    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    "The fact is the vast majority of Americans are happy with their healthcare".

    Would that include the senior citizens who depend on Medicare and Medicaid?
    Seniors are unhappy with a federally funded, taxpayer sponsored, government managed health care system?

    Thanks for pointing that out. That's exactly the point many have been making. We've got a prime example of how a bureaucracy manages health care and it stinks. Throwing more money at it (that we don't have) won't fix it.

    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    "It's not about breaking a President"

    Tell that to Republican Jim DeWitt. He seems to think otherwise.
    That's his term and not mine. Even so, This current administration has taken on an overwhelming amount of unconstitutional authority. "Breaking" that trend isn't a bad thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    Better yet tell it to Rush Limbaugh who continues to compare Obama to Hitler.
    Investigate WHY Limbaugh is doing so. Democrat Nancy Pelosi started the whole "Nazi" thing when she called protesters "Nazis." When the 3rd in line for the White House equates people peacefully protesting to keep their health insurance with a regime that brutally murdered 8 million Jews simply because they were Jews, you should expect a response. Pelosi is using extreme rhetoric with no basis in fact to demonize her opponents. Limbaugh is pointing out that the "Z" in Nazi stood for "Socialist" and providing specific examples of how that party nationalized many parts of the economy. The economic similarities are striking. If you listen, you'd hear that he's revealing ECONOMIC similarities and making no accusations about invading other countries or exterminating religious groups.

    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    And the reason there aren't any black faces in those anti-Obamacare crowds is because black folk, like most Democrats, WANT health care reform. And black folk don't believe for a second that Republicans have their health and best interests at heart.
    They really don't want health care "reform." They want OTHER PEOPLE to pay for their health care. That's what this boils down to. People don't care where the money comes from as long as it's not theirs. Well, I'll re-state that: I believe a lot of people DO want to money taken from those who have more simply out of an attitude of revenge. That's hardly good economic policy.

    Democrats have done a very good job of keeping blacks in their pockets by demonizing Republicans. Republicans want people to stand on their own two feet; Democrats have learned quite well that if you promise to penalize a perceived enemy, you can buy their votes. A greater percentage of Republicans than Democrats voted FOR the Civil Rights Act of 1963 (even Al Gore's father voted against it), but I would bet that 90% of blacks aren't aware of that fact.

    And blacks that declare themselves to be conservative are often demonized and called "Uncle Toms" by black leaders. Democrats have owned the black vote for 4 decades but we're constantly reminded of their their economic malaise. After 4 decades, you'd think that a new approach might be in order.

    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    Bottom line is that President Obama was elected on a platform that made Health Care Reform and a public option it's centerpiece. And if it wasn't Obamacare it would have been Hillarycare you Republicans would be protesting. YOU LOST THE ELECTION. Now get out of the way.
    Oh, the "get out of the way" attitude would have been WONDERFUL when the Republicans controlled the White House and Congress. Instead, Democrats cried that they were being shut out and not given any leadership positions even though they lost the elections. Republicans caved after the 2004 election and actually shared power. Now that Dems are in power, that "reach-across-the-aisle" attitude died a quick death. Republicans were dumb to trust Dems to actually return the favor.

    Hey, and Bill Clinton won his first election by promising universal health care AND no tax increases. Remember that one? Followed by that "I tried harder than anything" speech?

    I agree that health care reform was a major factor in Obama's nomination. He also agreed to post bills on the internet for 5 days before votes. He also promised to end pork-barrel spending. He also promised to not hire lobbyists. He also promised to be bipartisan. He also promised to lower the deficit. He promised unemployment wouldn't reach 8% if the stimulus bill was passed. He said a number of things that he completely disregarded after his nomination.

    Instead, the "transparent" administration is anything but, lobbyists are running policy, unemployment is over 9%, he signed a stimulus bill with 9,000 earmarks, and the deficit is through the roof and will be for years. (Not to mention, heads of committees (Conyers, for example) are not even reading the bills they're voting on, probably because they know they won't have to live under the laws they pass.) Seriously, he promised things that appealed to Independents and he won their vote, but now they realize that he promised a lot and has shown rather obviously that those promises were empty rhetoric. The spirit of bipartisanship has been replaced with "get out of the way." In speeches that he reads from teleprompters, he consistently makes references to those that oppose him and he demonizes them. There's no coming together; there's only division.

    Obama's overall approval ratings dropped faster than those for W. Bush and Carter, dropping more than 16 points in about 6 months. He stood at 52% at the end of July...hardly an overwhelming mandate of approval. And this is with fawning media coverage.

    Now with universal, taxpayer-funded health care, he's trying to actually follow through on a promise. The problem for him is that people don't want it and we simply can NOT afford it. Obama says that he's not for a single-payer system, but there's video proof of him saying that a single-payer system is what he wants. In 100 days, he's gone back of most of his promises and the American people have noticed.

    The thing is, he doesn't need a SINGLE Republican vote to get it passed. He has filibuster-proof majorities in both Houses. This should be SOOOO simple to do for the administration...they cannot be stopped. Obama is telling Republicans to get out of the way, but they're already out of the way...they're the minority.

    So IF this is a wonderful thing, and IF the majority of people want it, why haven't Democrats simply passed it? They want it so bad, why not vote and just do it? They've made such a big deal out of this issue and they know their reputation is hanging on it. And they're scared...
    Last edited by semprini; 08/11/2009 at 12:12 AM.
  11. groovy's Avatar
    Posts
    941 Posts
    Global Posts
    955 Global Posts
    #1151  
    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    Yes I am saying that race is a factor. I'm saying that the most vehement protesters include BIRTHERS who are thinly described racists. I'm saying that those trying to compare our President to HITLER are thinly described racists.

    And I'm saying that anyone who would take my original comment and immediately think of Ted Danson probably has some "issues" too. What's next, a Michael Richards allusion?
    What issues might those be?
  12. groovy's Avatar
    Posts
    941 Posts
    Global Posts
    955 Global Posts
    #1152  
    Quote Originally Posted by zelgo View Post
    Sure it is. Much of what the Republicans have been doing is stirring up the fear that the white power structure is in danger as minority communities grow in the US.

    Remember all the talk about Obama's thugs which would supposedly roam the streets if he got elected? What about the whole nutty "birthers" movement? Remember...Sotomayor is a racist...Immigrants are taking over....the uninsured don't matter because they're either illegal or stupid, non-working, welfare-collecting minorities, Bush chronies claiming McCain had a "Black baby" in the South Carolina primaries, etc.?

    Republicans make it ALL about race--because it scares people (and that's the WHOLE "Southern Strategy" to win elections)

    Sadly for the party, the Republicans needs these kooks because no one else will join the party. So, the Republicans keep on feeding these nuts with fear.

    Check out the videos of the townhall chaos--as white as snow--who else will listen to the Republican talking heads??
    Strawman much? Well, I find it pretty telling that the first person in this thread to bring up the matter of race with regard to this President's policies is a supporter of this President.

    But then, I just have "issues".
  13. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #1153  
    Quote Originally Posted by Woof View Post
    If that was a canyon you'd be more famous that Evel Kneivel for that leap.

    On a side note, why is anyone here ga ga over Social Security? Isn't it like BROKE!!!
    Only for you and me. It's currently still being mailed out to recipients.... for now.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  14. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #1154  
    Quote Originally Posted by clemgrad85 View Post
    We agree on something!!!!! Yes, the Constitution is an "evolving document", or as I referred to it, "living".
    Careful. You're definition if a "living" document isn't the same as the left's. They see it as in "it needs to be changed (rewritten) to keep up with the times", and I think you mean, "it needs to be amended here and there to keep up with the times, but its founding/core principles remain the same".

    This congress is doing everything it can to ignore the constitution, and they won't hesitate to "update" it, given the chance.
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  15. Micael's Avatar
    Posts
    736 Posts
    Global Posts
    739 Global Posts
       #1155  
    Quote Originally Posted by zelgo View Post
    Dermatologist waits, for example, can approach a full year in some places in the US.
    And this is why you want us to go to a government run program that will control what currently accounts for 1/5th of the US economy?

    BTW, what part of DC do you live in, Zelgo?
    The Law of Logical Argument: Anything is possible if you don't know what you are talking about.
  16. #1156  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael View Post
    Careful. You're definition if a "living" document isn't the same as the left's. They see it as in "it needs to be changed (rewritten) to keep up with the times", and I think you mean, "it needs to be amended here and there to keep up with the times, but its founding/core principles remain the same".

    This congress is doing everything it can to ignore the constitution, and they won't hesitate to "update" it, given the chance.
    Good point....my point is as you explained, to allow for changes as needed, but via the proper channels as has been done 27 times. I realize this great document is open for interpretation, and that is where many differ and that is why elections are so important when it comes to the interpretation of the Constitution by these appointed judges.
  17. #1157  
    Oh geez....the town hall meeting had a 10 year old girl asking a question....I'm glad Obama is taking this seriously.
  18. #1158  
    You seem to forget that Nancy calls middle Americans who do not agree with her Nazis. Have you ever taken the time to ask yourself this question: if American health care were so bad, then why or why do our elected representatives (those even that call Americans Nazis) get their treatment here in the USA. Why do they not go to Canada? Why do they not go to Sweden? You know as well as I do - the health care provided in this country is the best there is.

    As for Medicare suffering - you did not read the article about having to cut Medicare in order to obtain savings? Goodness gracious. Google may be your unknown friend.

    Quote Originally Posted by RolandStone View Post
    "The fact is the vast majority of Americans are happy with their healthcare".

    Would that include the senior citizens who depend on Medicare and Medicaid? I'm old enough to remember when Republicans fought tooth-and-nail against any form of Medicare or Medicaid, calling it "Socialized Medicine". Now those same Republicans are trying to rile up seniors against "Obamacare" by scaring them into thinking that Medicare will suffer as a result. As if those same Republicans wouldn't revoke Medicare too if they could.

    "It's not about breaking a President"

    Tell that to Republican Jim DeWitt. He seems to think otherwise.

    Better yet tell it to Rush Limbaugh who continues to compare Obama to Hitler.

    And the reason there aren't any black faces in those anti-Obamacare crowds is because black folk, like most Democrats, WANT health care reform. And black folk don't believe for a second that Republicans have their health and best interests at heart.

    Bottom line is that President Obama was elected on a platform that made Health Care Reform and a public option it's centerpiece. And if it wasn't Obamacare it would have been Hillarycare you Republicans would be protesting. YOU LOST THE ELECTION. Now get out of the way.
  19. #1159  
    And what is wrong with a 10 year old GIRL from Wisconsin asking a question at a town hall meeting and getting the answer that her grand father needs to die? No worse than others given tickets in the audience to speak up for government run health care.

    Quote Originally Posted by clemgrad85 View Post
    Oh geez....the town hall meeting had a 10 year old girl asking a question....I'm glad Obama is taking this seriously.
  20. #1160  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    You seem to forget that Nancy calls middle Americans who do not agree with her Nazis. Have you ever taken the time to ask yourself this question: if American health care were so bad, then why or why do our elected representatives (those even that call Americans Nazis) get their treatment here in the USA. Why do they not go to Canada? Why do they not go to Sweden? You know as well as I do - the health care provided in this country is the best there is.

    As for Medicare suffering - you did not read the article about having to cut Medicare in order to obtain savings? Goodness gracious. Google may be your unknown friend.
    Interesting... Nancy was calling those at the meetings wrong for comparing obama and dems to the Nazis. Although, if you read what she said, it does seem to link her to saying some of the protesters were carrying swastikas and other Nazi paraphernalia.

    Don't know, I was not there... but we have seen plenty of conservative sites and such displaying such stuff around obama and other dems.

    How far off was she? Not far...

    Truth hurts... ask that pill popping Rush Limbaugh.

    The Republican party is spinning towards non-existance due to this type of politics. Unfortunately, it seems to feed upon itself.
    01000010 01100001 01101110 00100000 01010100 01101000 01110010 01100101 01100001 01100100 00100000 01000011 01110010 01100001 01110000 01110000 01100101 01110010 01110011 00100001

Posting Permissions