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  1.    #1  
    " Where were your voices when junior and his GOPer cronies were "blah, blah, blah......??"

    barye








    I ask you and everyone from the left again. Were you similarly incensed when barney frank, chris dodd, acorn and their junta were orchestrating the biggest mortgage disaster in recent US history?

    While some republicans were warning dodd and frank of the imminent crises ready to unfold, these two and many other dems criticized repubs for "trying to create problems where there were none". "Nothing is wrong with our financial system. There is no need to fix it." A phrase frank and dodd as well as many dems were heard to emphasize.

    frank, dodd and acorn forced financial firms to lend to woefully underqualified individuals in order to prove absence of prejudice, discrimination and all that crap. The whole feel good garbage.

    There is mention of Bush's expenses in Iraq, however many prominent dems voted not only for the intervention in iraq, but also for the additional war budgets as long as their personal earmarks were met.

    Now obama chooses his appointees, none of which seem capable of paying their personal income taxes yet they're going to sit and tell the rest of us how much we are supposed to pay? Where is your outrage?

    Obama prints 4 trillion dollars and spends more money in his first 40 days then all US presidents combined, setting up unprecedented dollar devaluation, hyperinflation, and bloated govt. Outrage?

    The "mess" of the last 8 yrs has a LOT to do with dems. Who controlled congress for the last FOUR of the last 8 years, barye? LOL.

    Insider lobbying and earmarks? the dems are every bit as guilty of this as any republican.

    The dems have their own bridges to nowhere. What was that about a multi million dollar project in Texas to build a bridge to a town of 200 under Obama's spending package? That's a democratic bridge to nowhere in my book, too.

    Barye, talk to BILL CLINTON about why the US has become subservient to the chinese. Again, your party to blame.
  2.    #2  
    Where is your outrage towards these unions who terrorize, intimidate and threaten their members if they do not vote the way the union wants them to? Rather than allowing secret ballots, the right of every American, these unions hold "open" ballots so that they can see everyone's vote. They may therefore terrorize any individuals who don't vote "the way they are supposed to".

    Where is your outrage?
  3. g.711's Avatar
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    #3  
    Divide and conquer that s what our government has become. We bicker over what? A republican getting earmarks for a golf course or bridge. While in the same bill a Dem. Are doing the EXACT same thing. We the people should be outraged that we are being told we are pulling our troops out of the war while the same troops are headed to Afghanistan. We should be outraged at thousands of dollars found in a freezer, Sons and Daughters getting campaign money. Money being forwarded to illegitimate kids. Walling about illegal immigrants while you have them cleaning your house and caring for tthe kids. Supporting higher taxes while not paying taxes for years.

    This can not stand.

    Although I am conservative I still agree with the social needs of the poor and needy. Trickle down dried up before it got to people who needed it. But we follow these crooks year after year, it drives me crazy.

    We should all shun being labeled R or D. and vote on pure results. Maybe we should have yearly elections. Review the results and if there is no confidence in a Senator or whoever you are out! I get reviewed yearly on my job why shouldn’t they.
  4. #4  
    Maybe we could agree that both parties are to blame, both taking us to places we do not want to go to. g.711 - conservatives have a history of dealing positively with the poor. Reining in government, making it possible to operate a business in a profitable manner is a win-win situation for all. Conservatives were recently called "radicals" and what a title! The radicals are those wanting to change the core of the country, those who want to enlarge the power and scope of the federal government. Those who believe the government is the answer to all are failing to look at history. The government is good at one thing - enriching itself. The government does not create self-sustaining jobs, just the opposite and more than anything else, many of those we elected to represent us are the ones that are profiting - criminals they are.

    Self reliance provides much more than a government that insists upon spending itself to financial ruin while running down and blaming its citizens for every conceivable ill.
  5. #5  
    The Hawaii legislative crooks fully support Card Check to prevent intimidation. Amazing - Card Check does just the opposite and to think that the federal government has the final say if an agreement cannot be reached!

    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214 View Post
    Where is your outrage towards these unions who terrorize, intimidate and threaten their members if they do not vote the way the union wants them to? Rather than allowing secret ballots, the right of every American, these unions hold "open" ballots so that they can see everyone's vote. They may therefore terrorize any individuals who don't vote "the way they are supposed to".

    Where is your outrage?
  6.    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    The Hawaii legislative crooks fully support Card Check to prevent intimidation. Amazing - Card Check does just the opposite and to think that the federal government has the final say if an agreement cannot be reached!
    And yet we never hear protests from those on the other side of the aisle condemning this gross misconduct. Focus always seems to be pointed AWAY from the grave problems within the party.
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by g.711 View Post
    Divide and conquer that s what our government has become. We bicker over what? A republican getting earmarks for a golf course or bridge. While in the same bill a Dem. Are doing the EXACT same thing. We the people should be outraged that we are being told we are pulling our troops out of the war while the same troops are headed to Afghanistan. We should be outraged at thousands of dollars found in a freezer, Sons and Daughters getting campaign money. Money being forwarded to illegitimate kids. Walling about illegal immigrants while you have them cleaning your house and caring for tthe kids. Supporting higher taxes while not paying taxes for years.

    This can not stand.

    Although I am conservative I still agree with the social needs of the poor and needy. Trickle down dried up before it got to people who needed it. But we follow these crooks year after year, it drives me crazy.

    We should all shun being labeled R or D. and vote on pure results. Maybe we should have yearly elections. Review the results and if there is no confidence in a Senator or whoever you are out! I get reviewed yearly on my job why shouldn’t they.
    Hear, hear!
  8. #8  
    Taking it further - we should be outraged at both republicans and delmocrats who pushed this country over the cliff with the housing situation - FannyMae/Mac. We should be outraged at people who condemn one group as "right wing terrorists" or "right wing extremists" and yet say nothing about the left wing terrorists busy in the 60s blowing up buildings and killing people. They also say nothing about the murder of millions of children and yet are exceedingly vocal about depriving someone of sleep or one lunatic that kills an abortion doctor. Amazing. Simply amazing.

    Amazing to be called an extremist when the person called an extremist only wants to live by the Constitution. The real extremist is the one who wants to change everything to fit his model of thought. Amazing.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214 View Post
    Where is your outrage towards these unions who terrorize, intimidate and threaten their members if they do not vote the way the union wants them to? Rather than allowing secret ballots, the right of every American, these unions hold "open" ballots so that they can see everyone's vote. They may therefore terrorize any individuals who don't vote "the way they are supposed to".

    Where is your outrage?

    Well, where is your outrage towards corporations and management who terrorize, intimidate and threaten employees if they do not vote the way management wants them to?

    I've really never understood the hostility some people have towards unions. The way I see it, corporations and management have an army of lawyers and other professionals working overtime looking out for it's interests. Why shouldn't avg. Joe employee have someone looking out for his? We don't all have a "serf" mentality.

    "Please sir" "more porridge." hahahaha
    Please.
    Iago

    "Good name in man and woman, dear my lord, Is the immediate jewel of their souls: Who steals my purse steals trash . . . But he that filches from me my good name Robs me of that which not enriches him
    And makes me poor indeed."


    Criminal: A person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation.
    - Howard Scott
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Amazing to be called an extremist when the person called an extremist only wants to live by the Constitution. The real extremist is the one who wants to change everything to fit his model of thought. Amazing.
    Well, besides buffoon, what would you call the Republican Governor of Texas, Rick Perry? Talking about seceding from the union is pretty extreme wouldn't you say?
    Iago

    "Good name in man and woman, dear my lord, Is the immediate jewel of their souls: Who steals my purse steals trash . . . But he that filches from me my good name Robs me of that which not enriches him
    And makes me poor indeed."


    Criminal: A person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation.
    - Howard Scott
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by treobk214 View Post
    " Where were your voices when junior and his GOPer cronies were "blah, blah, blah......??"

    barye


    I ask you and everyone from the left again. Were you similarly incensed when barney frank, chris dodd, acorn and their junta were orchestrating the biggest mortgage disaster in recent US history?

    While some republicans were warning dodd and frank of the imminent crises ready to unfold, these two and many other dems criticized repubs for "trying to create problems where there were none". "Nothing is wrong with our financial system. There is no need to fix it." A phrase frank and dodd as well as many dems were heard to emphasize.

    frank, dodd and acorn forced financial firms to lend to woefully underqualified individuals in order to prove absence of prejudice, discrimination and all that crap. The whole feel good garbage.

    There is mention of Bush's expenses in Iraq, however many prominent dems voted not only for the intervention in iraq, but also for the additional war budgets as long as their personal earmarks were met.

    Now obama chooses his appointees, none of which seem capable of paying their personal income taxes yet they're going to sit and tell the rest of us how much we are supposed to pay? Where is your outrage?

    Obama prints 4 trillion dollars and spends more money in his first 40 days then all US presidents combined, setting up unprecedented dollar devaluation, hyperinflation, and bloated govt. Outrage?

    The "mess" of the last 8 yrs has a LOT to do with dems. Who controlled congress for the last FOUR of the last 8 years, barye? LOL.

    Insider lobbying and earmarks? the dems are every bit as guilty of this as any republican.

    The dems have their own bridges to nowhere. What was that about a multi million dollar project in Texas to build a bridge to a town of 200 under Obama's spending package? That's a democratic bridge to nowhere in my book, too.

    BARYE, talk to BILL CLINTON about why the US has become subservient to the chinese. Again, your party to blame.
    I would love to engage with you treobk214, but I fear offending the delicate sensibilities of the powers that be. I have been explicitly warned that my lanquage toward conservatives is much too rough -- and that I have perhaps caused you and the other conservatives here needless distress and hurt.

    For all the pain I monstrously have caused, BARYE most humbly apologizes...
    Last edited by BARYE; 04/17/2009 at 04:41 AM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  12. g.711's Avatar
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    #12  
    Free BARYE !!!!

    he writes well.
  13. g.711's Avatar
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by Iago View Post
    Well, where is your outrage towards corporations and management who terrorize, intimidate and threaten employees if they do not vote the way management wants them to?...
    Here’s how I see it, GM in an effort to increase profits, built terrible cars in the 80s and 90s. when defects were detected they would delay the announcement for years figuring most of those car would be off the market. The unions wanting their share negotiated outrageous contracts to protect their members Greed, on top of Greed.
    ’08 the company is broke and the unions will not give an inch. But because of their influence a republican administration is wedged into providing bailout money to keep the company alive. Six months later a Democratic administration is panning on giving them more $$$$
    So who is at fault for the hens coming home to roost?
    Maybe this is just the natural way of things just as the Roman Empire at its peak imploded being too large to sustain its own weight.
    Maybe Texas is right and we should split up America into several manageable kingdoms.




    (last part is a joke)
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Reining in government, making it possible to operate a business in a profitable manner is a win-win situation for all. Conservatives were recently called "radicals" and what a title! The radicals are those wanting to change the core of the country, those who want to enlarge the power and scope of the federal government. Those who believe the government is the answer to all are failing to look at history. The government is good at one thing - enriching itself. The government does not create self-sustaining jobs, just the opposite and more than anything else, many of those we elected to represent us are the ones that are profiting - criminals they are.

    Self reliance provides much more than a government that insists upon spending itself to financial ruin while running down and blaming its citizens for every conceivable ill.
    I agree with the concept. My fundamental disagreement is with those who state that the Republican party limits government, while the Democratic party expands it. The reality is that both are responsible for expanding our government - they just expand different parts of it. The most recent administration, which also had a Republican Congress for 6 of it's 8 years, expanded our government and its deficit tremendously. The Dems have done the same.

    I agree with the original post that the argument has to get beyond the us vs. them mentality. Both parties are at fault, but if you look at this thread, it immediately turned into "but look at what the other party did", and drawing the "R vs. D" battle lines that this system has created.
    Everything's Amazing and Nobody's Happy

    Treo600 --> Treo650-->PPC6700-->Treo700P-->Treo755P-->Treo800W --> Touch Pro-->Palm Pre --> EVO 4G
  15. #15  
    Yes where? With a secret vote how does one know? With a non-secret vote though, everyone knows. As for unions - good only for those people who do not want to work, poor work attitudes, et cetera. Why should you pay your dues to keep someone who does not perform? Should a company be required to keep an employee who does not perform? Who brings the company down? Really now. Would you keep an employee in the company you own that does not perform? Really now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iago View Post
    Well, where is your outrage towards corporations and management who terrorize, intimidate and threaten employees if they do not vote the way management wants them to?

    I've really never understood the hostility some people have towards unions. The way I see it, corporations and management have an army of lawyers and other professionals working overtime looking out for it's interests. Why shouldn't avg. Joe employee have someone looking out for his? We don't all have a "serf" mentality.

    "Please sir" "more porridge." hahahaha
    Please.
  16. #16  
    I would say the man has the constitution of his state to back up his talk. Obama has nothing to back up his talk. So, besides baffoon, what would you call the president of the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Iago View Post
    Well, besides buffoon, what would you call the Republican Governor of Texas, Rick Perry? Talking about seceding from the union is pretty extreme wouldn't you say?
  17. #17  
    GM - too big to fail - cannot let it go through bankruptcy. What is happening now? What a waste this all has been.

    Did the governor mention kingdoms? I missed that part.

    Quote Originally Posted by g.711 View Post
    Here’s how I see it, GM in an effort to increase profits, built terrible cars in the 80s and 90s. when defects were detected they would delay the announcement for years figuring most of those car would be off the market. The unions wanting their share negotiated outrageous contracts to protect their members Greed, on top of Greed.
    ’08 the company is broke and the unions will not give an inch. But because of their influence a republican administration is wedged into providing bailout money to keep the company alive. Six months later a Democratic administration is panning on giving them more $$$$
    So who is at fault for the hens coming home to roost?
    Maybe this is just the natural way of things just as the Roman Empire at its peak imploded being too large to sustain its own weight.
    Maybe Texas is right and we should split up America into several manageable kingdoms.




    (last part is a joke)
  18. #18  
    Somewhere above I did mention both parties as being at fault. However of the 2, the democrat party has the dirtiest hands. Look at the crooks in there now. Look at the crooks that Obama has with him. Look at the tax cheats. Look at what he said about Gtmo and look at what he has done with isolated prisons. I am glad he kept at least one of them active.

    In times of serious situations around the world, North Korea, Iran, et cetera - one has to wonder where his mind is at. Cut, cut, cut. Typical democrat.

    At least the previous democrat presidents did not damn this country with such eloquence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bujin View Post
    I agree with the concept. My fundamental disagreement is with those who state that the Republican party limits government, while the Democratic party expands it. The reality is that both are responsible for expanding our government - they just expand different parts of it. The most recent administration, which also had a Republican Congress for 6 of it's 8 years, expanded our government and its deficit tremendously. The Dems have done the same.

    I agree with the original post that the argument has to get beyond the us vs. them mentality. Both parties are at fault, but if you look at this thread, it immediately turned into "but look at what the other party did", and drawing the "R vs. D" battle lines that this system has created.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Look at what he said about Gtmo and look at what he has done with isolated prisons. I am glad he kept at least one of them active.
    If you can't even consider that Gitmo was an absolute embarrassment for our country and a betrayal of American values, then I'd suggest that you read the Bush Administration memos that were just released regarding torture.

    If you do that and still hold that our approach to Gitmo was entirely misguided, then I'm certainly not going to debate the point with you - if your level of support of the previous administration extends that far, there's no possibility of finding common ground.
    Last edited by Bujin; 04/17/2009 at 02:38 PM.
    Everything's Amazing and Nobody's Happy

    Treo600 --> Treo650-->PPC6700-->Treo700P-->Treo755P-->Treo800W --> Touch Pro-->Palm Pre --> EVO 4G
  20. #20  
    Didn't mean to veer so far off topic but:

    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Yes where? With a secret vote how does one know? With a non-secret vote though, everyone knows.
    The proposed act does not require a non-secret vote....it's an option.

    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    As for unions - good only for those people who do not want to work, poor work attitudes, et cetera.
    This statement could just as easily describe a manager. Don't want to manage, poor skills and attitudes, et cetera. In my experience that's what I've seen all to often. A managers job is to remove obstacles and impediments to insure a smooth operation. Some managers don't know how to do that. It's a lot easier for a manager to browbeat an employee and accuse him/her as not performing, while ignoring their own lack of skill and/or knowledge and how that lack contributes to the problem in the first place.

    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Why should you pay your dues to keep someone who does not perform? Should a company be required to keep an employee who does not perform? Who brings the company down? Really now.
    Terminating a non performer is not hard, it just requires documentation. Documentation so as to insure the reason you purport is in fact the real reason, and not one that would be considered illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Would you keep an employee in the company you own that does not perform? Really now.
    No I wouldn't. I would terminate him/her. But I would do it legally.

    Now back to Republicans AND democrats over the last 8 years.
    Iago

    "Good name in man and woman, dear my lord, Is the immediate jewel of their souls: Who steals my purse steals trash . . . But he that filches from me my good name Robs me of that which not enriches him
    And makes me poor indeed."


    Criminal: A person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation.
    - Howard Scott
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