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  1. #161  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    The press has for this entire political process presented itself many times as presenting fact when in actuality it was opinion - look at NBC's decision to move 2 of its journalists in a recent action. Blogs often present news that the main stream press ignores - that cannot be denied. Look at what the blogs have done in other recent events. What I presented had facts behind them. Blogs are now doing the work that traditional journalism did. The blogs are necessary to balance what we do not hear in the main stream press.
    LOL - so now you're really stating that blogs = news? That's awesomely convenient!

    I tend to agree with you that the news isn't objective: MSNBC has a liberal bias, while Fox has a conservative one. However, you can easily cross-check them with each other for a balanced view. You don't seem able to pull from any sources other than blogs.

    I'll challenge you do answer some direct questions (and I'm sure you'll just deflect into another anti-Obama rant):

    - Is Kathleen Parker biased against McCain-Palin? http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...mentator-says/
    - Is Fox News biased against McCain-Palin when they reported that polling indicated that Obama won the debate? http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/09...ain-in-debate/
    Everything's Amazing and Nobody's Happy

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  2.    #162  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    I've now watched the first 3/4 of tonights debate played back from the DVR (BARYE's cave does not get live broadcasts --- and I've been watching with my attention divided between playing XBOX Live) but so far I'm very very pleased.

    I'd give Obama a strong B+ -- and McCain perhaps no better than a C. (well possibly a C+, in honor of his POW experiences).

    McCain is making me think more and more of Humphrey Bogart, in the movie "The Caine Mutiny". (Bogart in testifying with relish about finding the missing tins of berries...as he repeatedly juggles within his hand those creepy brass balls...)

    Obama is cast as the calm defense attorney who systematically debones Bogart.

    I'm getting slightly less crazed with fear about November...
    After watching the rest of the debate, I caught about 15 minutes of the Faux Newz post debate spin.

    I haven't seen or read anything else about it (other than a few of the comments made here.)

    I watch these things possibly a little differently than others -- in as much as I watch them played back at a faster than normal speed as I play Xbox Live. (its how I watch all my news -- I never play Xbox otherwise...)

    This gives me special insight into how the average voter perceives things.

    I, of course, deplore polls -- I only make exceptions when they confirm BARYE's opinions and brilliance.

    The Faux site's poll linked by Bujin, unfortunately provides BARYE with just such an opportunity:

    SNAPSHOT POLLS GIVE OBAMA EDGE OVER MCCAIN IN DEBATE
    by Associated Press
    Saturday, September 27, 2008

    Fifty-one percent said Obama, the Democrat, did a better job in Friday night’s faceoff while 38 percent preferred the Republican McCain...

    Obama was widely considered more intelligent, likable and in touch with peoples’ problems, and by modest margins was seen as the stronger leader and more sincere. Most said it was McCain who spent more time attacking his opponent.

    About six in 10 said each did a better job than expected. Seven in 10 said each seemed capable of being president.

    In a CBS News poll of people not committed to a candidate, 39 percent said Obama won the debate, 24 percent said McCain and 37 percent called it a tie. Twice as many said Obama understands their needs than said so about McCain.

    Seventy-eight percent said McCain is prepared to be president, about the same proportion of uncommitted voters as said so before the debate. Sixty percent said Obama is ready — a lower score than McCain, but a solid 16-percentage-point improvement from before the debate.

    In another Obama advantage in the CBS poll, far more said their image of him had improved as a result of the debate than said it had worsened. More also said their view of McCain had gotten better rather than worse, but by a modest margin...


    These numbers are meaningful.

    I expect the McCain side understands this.

    One of the really bad sections for McCain last night was when he repeatedly attacked Obama on the subject of his "inexperience".

    I haven't seen news coverage except for that Faux thing I mentioned -- so maybe this has been commented on by others besides me, but I thought this was a catastrophe for old man McCain.

    I could hear the collective echo of 300 million american humans saying reflexively to themselves: "and what about Palin ???"

    Its an argument that McCain irrevocably cast away when he plucked Mayor PTA away from her igloo. You don't go back there -- and he must have done so against the advice of his handlers within the stress of the debate itself.

    Obama's unruffled calm was a constant rebuttal to McCain's jabs and insinuations.

    As much as I hated many of the specifics of what Obama said (if I allowed myself to hear them over my video gaming) i.e. his support for Star Wars, his being a little too gracious in thanking McCain too often -- (there were others I'll probably remember later) -- I was, as I said last night, overall very happy with Obama's performance.

    Things are likely to begin to get uglier again. (the GOP is scared -- understandably so.)
    Last edited by BARYE; 09/27/2008 at 06:30 PM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  3. #163  
    It was a close debate. But I have to give the edge to Obama. Even though he left a lot on the table, he stood toe to toe with McCain in discussing foreign policy.

    McCain is pretty tough. He is a much better debater than I originally gave him credit for. In fact this was the best performance Iíve seen him give. BUT:

    He seemed to rely a little to much on stories, so much that it seemed he was kinda filibustering....just filling up his allotted time because he didnít have much substance. Than again maybe itís because Iíve heard them all before, and so has Obama. When McCain made reference to the bracelet he was wearing, given to him by a mother of a soldier, Obama was ready and subsequently pulled out his own bracelet, kinda nullifying McCainís point.

    As I said, Obama left a lot on the table. When McCain started going on and on about how he would take care of vets, Obama could have destroyed that assertion by simply pointing out McCainís voting record on vet issues. Also, when the moderator asked McCain about the present financial crises on Wallstreet, he started talking about government spending and earmarks. Obama should have asked him to tie in the corps.,being bought out or seeking government assistance with government spending. We probably would have had a senior moment.

    But then again, in all fairness to Obama, you only have so much time to make your point, you canít possibly get it all in.

    I thought Obama agreeing with McCain showed maturity. Heís able to acknowledge and concede a point, which makes him look like a consensus builder. Contrast that to McCain, and his condescending body language (never looking at Obama) and petulant attitude.

    This was suppose to be McCainís night. A night to look presidential and knowledgeable. And he did. But so did Obama.
    Iago

    "Good name in man and woman, dear my lord, Is the immediate jewel of their souls: Who steals my purse steals trash . . . But he that filches from me my good name Robs me of that which not enriches him
    And makes me poor indeed."


    Criminal: A person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation.
    - Howard Scott
  4. #164  
    A lot of McCain's voting record appears to be negative due to the pork thrown in with it - McCain has often voted against agendas he favors simply because of the pork - that was pointed out in the debate.

    On the debate area, Obama did stutter more than McCain in the 20 minutes I was able to listen to it.
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post

    On the debate area, Obama did stutter more than McCain in the 20 minutes I was able to listen to it.
    I suppose there's a point somewhere. Don't bother to elaborate, I'll just take a look at one of your many duplicative posts.
    Iago

    "Good name in man and woman, dear my lord, Is the immediate jewel of their souls: Who steals my purse steals trash . . . But he that filches from me my good name Robs me of that which not enriches him
    And makes me poor indeed."


    Criminal: A person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation.
    - Howard Scott
  6. #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by Iago View Post
    I suppose there's a point somewhere. Don't bother to elaborate, I'll just take a look at one of your many duplicative posts.
    How can you not look at your own candidate and admit that he had a stuttering problem and he is hiding it? Why won't he release his speech therapists records on him so we can all learn the truth about him? And why is the media covering up Obama's obvious disability? Can you imagine if he stutters when he meets with Iran's President with no preconditions?

    (I got this one for you Ben...it was pretty easy actually....control-c and control-v in a couple of your posts did the trick)
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by moderateinny View Post
    How can you not look at your own candidate and admit that he had a stuttering problem and he is hiding it? Why won't he release his speech therapists records on him so we can all learn the truth about him? And why is the media covering up Obama's obvious disability? Can you imagine if he stutters when he meets with Iran's President with no preconditions?

    (I got this one for you Ben...it was pretty easy actually....control-c and control-v in a couple of your posts did the trick)
    HAHAHA That's the same thing I came up with. I see you've got bclinGO down pretty good.
  8. #168  
    Love the response.
  9.    #169  
    McShame has realized that as long as people are thinking about their jobs, the economy, the value of their homes -- he will lose.

    He must change the subject.

    He has two choices: he can try to make Obama seem too "liberal" to be trusted. He can distort Obama's record and accuse him of intending to raise everyone's taxes, of planning to nationalize health care.

    Or he can hope for a major terrorist attack.
    (if that's what it will take to win, I truly wouldn't put it past the GOP to "enable" it.)



    McCain Plans Fiercer Strategy Against Obama
    By Michael D. Shear
    Washington Post Staff Writer
    Saturday, October 4, 2008; A01

    Sen. John McCain and his Republican allies are readying a newly aggressive assault on Sen. Barack Obama's character, believing that to win in November they must shift the conversation back to questions about the Democrat's judgment, honesty and personal associations, several top Republicans said.

    With just a month to go until Election Day, McCain's team has decided that its emphasis on the senator's biography as a war hero, experienced lawmaker and straight-talking maverick is insufficient to close a growing gap with Obama. The Arizonan's campaign is also eager to move the conversation away from the economy, an issue that strongly favors Obama and has helped him to a lead in many recent polls.

    "We're going to get a little tougher," a senior Republican operative said, indicating that a fresh batch of television ads is coming. "We've got to question this guy's associations. Very soon. There's no question that we have to change the subject here,"...

    Moments after the House of Representatives approved a bailout package for Wall Street on Friday afternoon, the McCain campaign released a television ad that challenges Obama's honesty and asks, "Who is Barack Obama?" The ad alleges that "Senator Obama voted 94 times for higher taxes. Ninety-four times. He's not truthful on taxes." The charge that Obama voted 94 times for higher taxes has been called misleading by independent fact-checkers, who have noted that the majority of those votes were on nonbinding budget resolutions.

    A senior campaign official called the ad "just the beginning" of commercials that will "strike the new tone" in the campaign's final days. The official said the "aggressive tone" will center on the question of "whether this guy is ready to be president."

    McCain's only positive commercial, called "Original Mavericks," has largely been taken off the air...

    Palin kept up the attack yesterday, saying in an interview on Fox News that Obama is "reckless" and that some of what he has said, "in my world, disqualifies someone from consideration as the next commander in chief."

    McCain hinted Thursday that a change is imminent, perhaps as soon as next week's debate. Asked at a Colorado town hall, "When are you going to take the gloves off?" the candidate grinned and replied, "How about Tuesday night?"...

    ... McCain made clear that he intends to press Obama on a variety of familiar GOP themes during the debate, as he accused the Democrat once again of getting ready to raise taxes and increase government spending.

    "I guarantee you, you're going to learn a lot about who's the liberal and who's the conservative and who wants to raise your taxes and who wants to lower them," McCain said...

    ...Republicans said the new ads are likely to hammer the senator from Illinois on his connections to convicted Chicago developer Antoin "Tony" Rezko and former radical William Ayres, whom the McCain campaign regularly calls a domestic terrorist...

    The Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. appears to be off limits after McCain condemned the North Carolina Republican Party in April for an ad that linked Obama to his former pastor, saying, "Unfortunately, all I can do is, in as visible a way as possible, disassociate myself from that kind of campaigning."...

    Campaigning in Abington, Pa., yesterday, Obama continued to focus on the economy, even as he lashed out at McCain.

    "He's now going around saying, 'I'm going to crack down on Wall Street' . . . but the truth is he's been saying 'I'm all for deregulation' for 26 years," Obama said. "He hasn't been getting tough on CEOs. He hasn't been getting tough on Wall Street. . . . Suddenly a crisis comes and the polls change, and suddenly he's out there talking like Jesse Jackson."

    Obama highlighted a new report showing a reduction of more than 159,000 jobs last month, and he linked the bad economic news to McCain and Palin...

    Before the bailout crisis, aides said, McCain was succeeding in focusing attention on Obama's record and character. Now, they say, he must return to those subjects.

    "We are looking for a very aggressive last 30 days," said Greg Strimple, one of McCain's top advisers. "We are looking forward to turning a page on this financial crisis and getting back to discussing Mr. Obama's aggressively liberal record and how he will be too risky for Americans."
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  10. #170  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    McShame has realized that as long as people are thinking about their jobs, the economy, the value of their homes -- he will lose.

    He must change the subject.

    He has two choices: he can try to make Obama seem too "liberal" to be trusted. He can distort Obama's record and accuse him of intending to raise everyone's taxes, of planning to nationalize health care.

    Or he can hope for a major terrorist attack.
    (if that's what it will take to win, I truly wouldn't put it past the GOP to "enable" it.)
    You've hit on a key point - the terrorist attack card. I want to believe that nobody would stoop to such a level, but the Bushies blatantly used the terrorism threat levels for political gain AND the most egregious of course, was the timing of the Iraq war - just in time for Rove's midterm elections.

    But I'm not a big fan of conspiracy theories - for instance, I believe Oswald was the lone assassin. So hopefully you're wrong about the neo-cons trying to pull a stunt like that. Now a small circle of them playing around with threat levels, fake intel, etc. to try and gain an edge against Obama...sure, that I can see. Heck, its not like they don't have a record of doing just that.

    What does worry more than anything is an assassination of Obama before the election. As the neo-cons and right-wing media continue to paint Obama as a terrorist lover and the lies and attacks become more and more visceral, I can seriously see some whack job Hannity or Bill O viewer taking it upon themselves to do their "duty" and assassinate Obama.
    Last edited by moderateinny; 10/06/2008 at 04:02 PM.
  11.    #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by moderateinny View Post
    You've hit on a key point - the terrorist attack card. I want to believe that nobody would stoop to such a level, but the Bushies blatantly used the terrorism threat levels for political gain AND the most egregious of course, was the timing of the Iraq war - just in time for Rove's midterm elections.

    But I'm not a big fan of conspiracy theories - for instance, I believe Oswald was the lone assassin. So hopefully you're wrong about the neo-cons trying to pull a stunt like that. Now a small circle of them playing around with threat levels, fake intel, etc. to try and gain an edge against Obama...sure, that I can see. Heck, its not like they don't have a record of doing just that.

    What does worry more than anything is an assassination of Obama before the election. As the neo-cons and right-wing media continue to paint Obama as a terrorist lover and the lies and attacks become more and more visceral, I can seriously see some whack job Hannity or Bill O viewer taking it upon themselves to do their "duty" and assassinate Obama.
    There are many people who believe that 9/11 was an inside job (some of them embarrassingly, are BARYE's friends).

    I do not. I think it was an impeachable act of malfeasance and incompetency. That it was foreseeable -- and preventable.

    Some still believe that Pearl Harbor should not have happened. That we had broken the Japanese code, that radar operators detected the attack with more than enough time to have defeated it, that the way the fleet was moored and the airplanes stationed ensured the maximum effect and damage from the Japanese attack. That Roosevelt was looking for a provocation to bring the US into WW2.

    I do not. Though again, its true that the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor was foreseeable and preventable.

    Do any of us doubt that Bin laden and friends want to again strike the US ??

    Have they history of attacking nations on the eve of elections, like in Spain ??

    Has this administration a history of using just the threat of terrorism to manipulate voters and elections ?? Most grievously as it did in just before the 2004 and 2002 elections ??

    Whether or not Bin Laden is prepared to attack, or wants to attack -- an attack is practically the only way they can now win -- the only way to change the subject away from people's terror about the economy, their homes, their jobs.

    The logical imperative is so overwhelming toward this, that I have to think that it is inevitable.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    There are many people who believe that 9/11 was an inside job (some of them embarrassingly, are BARYE's friends).

    I do not. I think it was an impeachable act of malfeasance and incompetency. That it was foreseeable -- and preventable.

    Some still believe that Pearl Harbor should not have happened. That we had broken the Japanese code, that radar operators detected the attack with more than enough time to have defeated it, that the way the fleet was moored and the airplanes stationed ensured the maximum effect and damage from the Japanese attack. That Roosevelt was looking for a provocation to bring the US into WW2.

    I do not. Though again, its true that the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor was foreseeable and preventable.

    Do any of us doubt that Bin laden and friends want to again strike the US ??

    Have they history of attacking nations on the eve of elections, like in Spain ??

    Has this administration a history of using just the threat of terrorism to manipulate voters and elections ?? Most grievously as it did in just before the 2004 and 2002 elections ??

    Whether or not Bin Laden is prepared to attack, or wants to attack -- an attack is practically the only way they can now win -- the only way to change the subject away from people's terror about the economy, their homes, their jobs.

    The logical imperative is so overwhelming toward this, that I have to think that it is inevitable.
    Well...even if you're onto something...and sorry, but I just cannot believe they would go that low (if they did...I'd move out of the country until I could return with an Army capable of overthrowing them )....anyway, even if you're onto something they'd never do it. Why? Because the last shred of phony credibility Bush has is that there has never been a terrorist attack since 9/11. I know I know...its pure bullcrap, but to the Republiscum, they would undermine any remaining argument that they are stronger on national defense by allowing an attack to happen on US soil. It will never happen.
  13. #173  
    We are aware of the female who was involved in preventing the FBI and the CIA from talking, are we not? We are aware that this particular female moved on to the FM group. We are aware that this particular female made millions and was forced out in shame.

    I speak of your paragraph, "...impeachable act of..."

    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    There are many people who believe that 9/11 was an inside job (some of them embarrassingly, are BARYE's friends).

    I do not. I think it was an impeachable act of malfeasance and incompetency. That it was foreseeable -- and preventable.

    S
  14. #174  
    Is it bull crap that there has not been a terrorist attack since 9/11 on American soil? Please point out where we were attacked in this country by a terrorist.

    Quote Originally Posted by moderateinny View Post
    Well...even if you're onto something...and sorry, but I just cannot believe they would go that low (if they did...I'd move out of the country until I could return with an Army capable of overthrowing them )....anyway, even if you're onto something they'd never do it. Why? Because the last shred of phony credibility Bush has is that there has never been a terrorist attack since 9/11. I know I know...its pure bullcrap, but to the Republiscum, they would undermine any remaining argument that they are stronger on national defense by allowing an attack to happen on US soil. It will never happen.
  15.    #175  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    We are aware of the female who was involved in preventing the FBI and the CIA from talking, are we not? We are aware that this particular female moved on to the FM group. We are aware that this particular female made millions and was forced out in shame.

    I speak of your paragraph, "...impeachable act of..."
    much too obscure for me Ben -- whom are you talking of -- and what is the FM group ??
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Is it bull crap that there has not been a terrorist attack since 9/11 on American soil? Please point out where we were attacked in this country by a terrorist.
    The "illusion" that Bush had anything to do with no terrorist attacks is the "bullcrap" I'm referring too.

    The guy was on perpetual vacation for crying out loud.
  17. #177  
    Talk about vacation, have you thought of a thread to discuss the Democrat preoccupation for vacation? Nancy would really make a great person to look up to when it comes to vacations.
  18.    #178  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Talk about vacation, have you thought of a thread to discuss the Democrat preoccupation for vacation? Nancy would really make a great person to look up to when it comes to vacations.
    Which President has been on vacation more than any other ??

    Which was on vacation when he got a memo titled: "Bin Laden determined to strike the U.S." ??


    (BTW -- you still have'nt answered my earlier question)
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  19. #179  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    Which President has been on vacation more than any other ??

    Which was on vacation when he got a memo titled: "Bin Laden determined to strike the U.S." ??
    Ooh ooh ohh...I know I know...can I answer?
  20.    #180  
    Quote Originally Posted by moderateinny View Post
    Ooh ooh ohh...I know I know...can I answer?
    No -- we need to give Ben enough time to do the research needed to come back to us with his answer.

    I'm sure Ben is even now thoroughly Googling the infinite news sources that Sarah Palin consults.

    He will come back soon I'm certain with the detailed information that we're all seeking...
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
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