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  1.    #1  
    I don’t watch much network television. Just Survivor and Lost. And because of my well known legal entanglements, I have not until now had a chance to watch Thursday’s broadcasts.

    From the beginning I’ve religiously watched Lost.

    Been torn by Kate’s love for Jack, and her lust and empathy for Sawyer.

    Been dizzied by Desmond’s odyssey for the love of his life, and ached by the ghosts that haunt Sayid.

    But for some reason the story of Jin and Sun has held a peculiarly deep resonance for me. The story of his complying with the demands of her brutal corrupt father so as to honor him and be allowed to marry Sun, her affair and betrayal of him -- the lies, the deceits, and the forgivenesses of their relationship...

    Their story always has had a special depth for me (even though they are not always the best performers.) And Thursday’s episode was certainly not one of the best in the series -- a series in which there have many many brilliantly complicated and beautifully told stories.

    But when Hugo came to Sun’s house and she greeted him dressed in black, a shiver of dread raced down my spine. She invited Hugo to hold her baby, and Hugo remarked about how much the baby looked like Jin.

    When Sun asked if Hugo would like to go see Jin, I just totally lost it. The moment they stepped outside, long before they got to the cemetery I started bawling uncontrollably.

    I just knew he was dead -- perhaps from the moment he left the stuffed Panda at the hospital.

    I was at least as affected by the episode a couple of weeks ago when Jack begged Kate to come back with him to the island -- a much more nuanced and complexly told story -- but I was just very profoundly touched by Jin’s death for some reason.

    Maybe its for the same reason I was so affected by the death of John Lennon, which we talked about here a while back. The idea of the death of someone who has fought through a life of pain and heartache to finally find happiness -- and to then die -- is so so much more tragic than every other death. So very few of us ever achieve real happiness. Truly happy lives are very very rare -- and are therefore, I am sad to say, much more precious than every other...

    (please forgive the delusional muttering of THE MONKEY sociopath -- its probably an ephemeral effect caused by the commencement of spring -- or of the DTs...)


    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    blocks away the night he was murdered, I made my way to the Dakota and spent several hours together with the others who gathered in that first night's spontaneous outpouring of agonized disbelief and sorrow.

    His death was the violent horrific end of the Aquarian epoch of love, peace, optimism, and hope -- and the beginning of our current epoch together with the inauguration of Raygunism -- and the phoniness, opportunism, exploitation, lies, and despair that have consumed us since...

    That night though remains for me to this day the most emotionally moving public thing I've ever experienced -- the singing of Imagine, Christmas and the others, all the tearful embraces, was unprecedented -- people came that first night on their own before the news coverage had made it a "popular" media spectacle. A wrenching wrenching end to a wonderful guy.

    His death all the more horrific because he had seemingly finally found happiness after a lifetime of struggle and internal pain. He had finally re-achieved success and happiness in his career, victory against Nixon, overcoming his dependency on drugs and alcohol, and love and reconciliation with Yoko.

    So few humans ever achieve anything like a happy life -- it is especially awful when a life such as that is so wastefully foreshortened so uselessly...
    Last edited by BARYE; 03/17/2008 at 04:02 AM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  2. #2  
    Yeah, Jin being dead gave me chills. But it's the show willing to take chances that keeps me coming back for more.
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  3.    #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScaryHumor View Post
    Yeah, Jin being dead gave me chills. ...

    Scary -- real glad you were as affected as me by Jin's death --

    There's a great movie you ought to try to watch: "Don't Look Now" -- directed by Nicholas Roeg starring Donald Sutherland and Julie Christie. Its kinda obscure -- try to get it from NetFlix. (the title sucks, but its a brilliant film).

    It takes place in Venice where he is working as an art restorer --as they both work to recover from the accidental death of their daughter.

    Its an amazingly well made film -- with some of the elements that we both liked in this particular Lost.

    Most especially though, "Don't Look Now" has within it the best edited love scene ever. Exquisitely romantic, illustrative, and elegant, -- its I think the single best edited bit of film I have ever seen.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  4. #4  
    I normally try to avoid shows like this. Everything is a mystery. You find out over a long period the secrets, while they start new ones. Most of those shows don't make it past the first season. They end with no notice, and we're left hanging. Examples: Surface, Threshold, Earth 2, Stargate SG1, Invasion. Those are just a few that come to mind.

    Lost's sagging ratings had me concerned for a while. If the producers promised an ending, even in book form, then I would gladly jump right in.

    Shows ending the best way: The Bob Newhart Show, Babylon 5, Star Trek TNG (yes, I like Sci-Fi).
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  5.    #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScaryHumor View Post
    I normally try to avoid shows like this. Everything is a mystery. You find out over a long period the secrets, while they start new ones. Most of those shows don't make it past the first season. They end with no notice, and we're left hanging. Examples: Surface, Threshold, Earth 2, Stargate SG1, Invasion. Those are just a few that come to mind.

    Lost's sagging ratings had me concerned for a while. ...
    or like Twin Peaks ...(which began promisingly, but died never developing or delivering on that promise).

    I love everything about Lost. The depth of detail, the intricacies of the plot, the complexity of the characters. They've even created an entire faux Website to support the fiction of the island's backstory.

    Though there are many who obsess over the details and depth of the series hugely more than me, sometimes I fear that the things about it that I like, also make it hard for casual viewers to get into it.

    What does an average viewer think about entire subplot spoken in Korean with subtitles ??

    Sometimes when I watch Lost I wonder if they really need to work as hard as they do -- though I'm in awe of their collective effort.

    Like you I'm glad the show has been promised to have a complete story arc, with eventual plot closure.

    (btw -- are you no longer hanging out with BARYE's evil (twin) brother ?? The internets are too small for the both of us to coexist )
    Last edited by BARYE; 03/19/2008 at 09:52 AM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  6. #6  
    Season Finale...

    Will it live up to the hype?
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScaryHumor View Post
    Season Finale...

    Will it live up to the hype?
    hey Scary -- I've not been able to watch anything though I've DVRed it -- maybe this weekend or by next week I'll have the time --
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    hey Scary -- I've not been able to watch anything though I've DVRed it -- maybe this weekend or by next week I'll have the time --
    It's a 2 hour finale a week from Thursday. For some reason, I thought it was last week. The 60's were very good to me.
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  9.    #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScaryHumor View Post
    It's a 2 hour finale a week from Thursday. For some reason, I thought it was last week. The 60's were very good to me.

    The 60's ???

    My favorite decade was the 90's.

    (Oh -- BARYE's referring of course to the 1790's... )
    Last edited by BARYE; 05/20/2008 at 02:05 AM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  10.    #10  
    Finally I have had the time to watch the last 2 episodes.

    Exhausted and sleep deprived to the point of physically trembling, the last 2 nights I laid back in bed with my laptop on my chest, to watch as the Oceanic 6 escape from their island only to find greater misery instead of the happiness they expected.

    Though the story was told much better than anything I've ever seen on series broadcast TV, these last 2 epsisodes never soared to the heights and depths reached during earlier weeks this season.

    It was almost as though the shortened schedule caused by the writers strike forced them to inorganically hurry the plots unfolding -- to push out story elements as rapidly as they could because of the foreshortened season.

    The subplot of the explosives which were tied to the heart monitor of the mercenary villain, was one such discordant story element. It was as though a large part of their cast needed to be killed off-- and had haphazardly devised a mechanism to do it.

    And I was equally as bothered by Ben's presence waiting for Jack at the funeral home -- where he had gone to view the body of John Locke -- whose suicide is mentioned with hushed foreboding. Another dropped in plot gadget.

    These two episodes do successfully leave open many potentially intriquing developments for the next year -- while they also managed to tie together many of this year's more interesting unresolved and unexplained plot branches:

    The reason why Jack had earlier this season forlornly begged Kate to come back with him to the island, more about how Sayid came to be involved with Ben, and how Jin came to die, and how Sun reacts to it.

    Ironically I was glad that these were not as good as some of this years earlier episodes. I often save HD copies of Lost's best episodes, but needing room on my hard drive, I deleted these two with almost no regret.
    Last edited by BARYE; 06/10/2008 at 10:14 PM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  11.    #11  
    regrettably I didn't see "P.S I love you" -- though maybe I ought to.

    "Don't Look Now" can't really be described as a romantic film. Its more of a story about a marriage suffering through the stress caused by the accidental loss of their daughter -- the reverberations of which threaten the life of their marriage.

    Though surely Donald Sutherland deeply loves his wife Julie Christie (and also mourns their lost child) -- he rationally wants to move on, and is impatient that she can't.

    That is core of the story -- but its much more than that -- and the story is told magnificently -- flawlessly.

    Its also a disturbing film -- one that you will carry in your thoughts long after you’ve watched it. (I’ve perhaps seen the film 5 times and I’m still devastated and scared by it.)

    The particular sequence that I'd referred to is a montage of an encounter between them -- at once romantic, sensual, and revitalizing -- that is I still think, the best edited moment I've ever seen in film. (I haven't seen that film in many years -- probably more than a decade, but I can almost remember it shot for shot).

    (if BARYE ever got a tenured position as a Professor of film despite his absolute absence of an MFA or any legitimate credentials, he would use that sequence to introduce film students to the essence of film editing.)
    Last edited by BARYE; 06/12/2008 at 01:00 PM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  12. #12  
    The finale was surprisingly un-exciting. No real cliff hanger.
    If this show goes the route of the latest Indiana Jones [SPOILER AHEAD IF YOU HAVE NOT SEEN IT YET]
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    ...and it's a bunch of alien / multiphasic beings, I'm done with Lost.
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  13. #13  
    Oh, and happy birthday to me...
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    The 60's ???


    (Oh -- BARYE's referring of course to the 1790's... )
    I'm old, but still immature!
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScaryHumor View Post
    Oh, and happy birthday to me...
    Belated Happy Birthday to you ScaryHumor!
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    Scary -- real glad you were as affected as me by Jin's death --
    Feelin' better?
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  17.    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by ScaryHumor View Post
    Feelin' better?
    Hey Scary !!

    I've been thinking of you, and this thread when I saw your name come up in the Pre forum a week or so ago.

    I've been again busy, and just got to see the last several episodes.

    Ya -- I'm mostly happy with the arc that they have been steering -- like you I was dubious at last year's end that they could reasonably make sense of the plot contrivances and branching -- as well as the radical transformations of some of the various characters (Ben most especially).

    But so far I'm mostly buying in -- for example I like the way the French woman has been "reintroduced" to the story -- telling a shocked Jin on the beach her name -- knowing then that she's carrying the baby that Ben would later adopt as his own.

    Very cool.

    And ya, I'm glad that Jin and and his wife have the chance that so few of us ever have, of completing the stories that are too often foreshortened by the unfairness of fate...
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    Hey Scary !!

    I've been thinking of you...
    I think of you each night as I go to bed, holding your picture in one hand... but I digress...

    I'm still bummed they killed Charlie. Although Hugo saw him last season.
    He had the funniest line in the first season. Kate & Jack upset a bees' nest, and run for the lagoon. Kate takes her top off, getting the bees out. Later, Charlie sees her in just her bra, and asked what happened to her shirt. Kate says "It was full of bees"

    Charlie stares at her chest and says "they look like C's to me".
    Last edited by ScaryHumor; 02/24/2009 at 12:50 PM.
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


  19. Scott_L's Avatar
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    #19  
    Though they "killed" Charlie, I find it odd that Hugo was carrying a guitar on the last episode when returning to the island. Does he know something we don't? I'm thinking he plans on passing it to his little buddy when they meet up again.

    I wouldn't be surprised to see any of the previously "dead" begin making more appearances...
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott_L View Post
    Though they "killed" Charlie, I find it odd that Hugo was carrying a guitar on the last episode when returning to the island. Does he know something we don't? I'm thinking he plans on passing it to his little buddy when they meet up again.

    I wouldn't be surprised to see any of the previously "dead" begin making more appearances...
    And with all the time travel, anything is possible. I want to say we had a brief glimpse 2 weeks ago of the 2 girls they killed off, after having real life dui's.

    I was curious about the blonde, and her prior relationship with Hurley in the nut house.

    Good catch on the guitar case. I remember now that you mentioned it.
    I find it sad/odd that people ask to be thanked. How genuine is it when you have to ask? It's like forcing your kid to call Grandma, to thank her for the new underwear she sent for their birthday.

    "To me, clowns aren't funny. In fact, they're kind of scary. I've wondered where this started and I think it goes back to the time I went to the circus, and a clown killed my dad.
    -Jack Handy, SNL-


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