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  1. #361  
    Instead of trying to make democrats appear divided, republicans need to spend more time addressing their own disunity and how to overcome it.

    Trying to make differences in policy between Obama and Hillary seem bigger than the differences between McCain and his conservative base is a losing proposition. I am sympathetic to this and it truly must be frustrating for conservatives, who especially appreciate the value of a unified message, to be this displaced from their presidential candidate.

    Going from the very conservative Bush/Cheney to the relatively liberal McCain, the challenge for the republican party will be to show how this shift is derived from their own guiding principles rather than just a reaction to enthusiasm on the left. How they can do it, I'm not quite sure, but the worst thing for republicans is the perception that they are offering a liberal-light candidate.

    These same dilemmas also plaque republican politicians at the local level and I am certain that Gingrich and other party thinkers are grappling with this right now. I think more and more conservatives are not identifying with the republican party, and are becoming far more cynical about politics in general. I do not believe that promoting as much apathy as possible is significantly dampening enthusiasm for politics on the left, more than it is just damaging the republican party itself. Its going to be an interesting election and I will be watching it to see how the republican strategists deal with these issues.
  2. #362  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal View Post
    The top of the Dem ticket is still in question.
    No. It's not.

    And given the recent special election losses of several historically repuglican(sic) congressional seats, this election is going to be a cake walk for the dems.
  3. #363  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal View Post
    This thread (which was started by a far left member of our community) is not about how Rep are going to deal with McCain, but how the Dems are dealing with Hillary (or maybe more true to the point how Hillary is dealing with the Dems).
    Sorry, I can be so irrelevant sometimes.
  4. #364  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas View Post
    No. It's not.
    lol... I'll say.

    And given the recent special election losses of several historically repuglican(sic) congressional seats, this election is going to be a cake walk for the dems.
    If the dems go into Nov with that attitude, mccain wins easier. McCain is not a formidable opponent, but obviously obama has a lot of work to do so he does not end Nov 4th only winning Illinois. It could happen.

    Do I think that will happen? No... I don't think it will be a blowout like that, but it could happen.
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  5. #365  
    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post
    lol... I'll say.



    If the dems go into Nov with that attitude, mccain wins easier. McCain is not a formidable opponent, but obviously obama has a lot of work to do so he does not end Nov 4th only winning Illinois. It could happen.

    Do I think that will happen? No... I don't think it will be a blowout like that, but it could happen.
    Agree:
    1) Hillary-Obama "contest"= pipe dream
    2) Complacency = dem's demise
  6. #366  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas View Post
    No. It's not.
    You might want to knock on Hillary's door and let her know that. I agree that there is little doubt that Obama is going to win the nomination, but no matter what the odds look like the only question is there one or two candidates still actively running and campaigning? Until there is only one, no matter how likely one may be the nominee, it is not yet decided. When and if Hillary throws in the towel or after the official Super Delegate vote at the Dem Convention, the Dem party is still undecided.

    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas View Post
    And given the recent special election losses of several historically repuglican(sic) congressional seats, this election is going to be a cake walk for the dems.
    This is a whole other matter that is going to be very interesting when the national campaigns start kicking in.
  7. #367  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal View Post
    You might want to knock on Hillary's door and let her know that.
    I believe reality has done that.

    edited to add, perhaps Obama will Tuesday:

    May 18, 2008
    Obama to Return to Iowa, Possibly to Claim Victory
    By LARRY ROHTER

    Senator Barack Obama has chosen to spend Tuesday night not in Kentucky or Oregon, the two states that will be holding their primaries that day, or even at his home in Chicago. Instead, Mr. Obama’s staff announced on Saturday, he will be returning to Iowa, where he won the Democratic caucuses way back in January and has at least two good reasons to revisit now.

    Much more than nostalgia seems to have motivated that decision. If things continue to go as well for Mr. Obama this week as they have so far this month, with a romp in North Carolina, a strong showing in Indiana and daily growth in his support among party superdelegates, he could actually end up with enough pledged delegates to proclaim, without fear of contradiction, that he is now the Democratic nominee for president.

    Mr. Obama’s ability to declare victory for the nomination will depend in large part on his performance in the Kentucky and Oregon votes. He has all but conceded Kentucky to Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton, the clear favorite when the race started last year, spending little time there, but is favored in Oregon, where he is making a strong effort.

    On Saturday, for example, Mr. Obama appeared at a town-hall-style meeting in the southwestern Oregon town of Roseburg, talking about health care and foreign policy and then taking questions about subjects that included Oregon’s assisted suicide law and domestic partnerships. Implicitly acknowledging what could be at stake in Oregon, he also urged supporters who have voted for him in advance, a common practice there, to make sure that they got their ballots in to tallying centers early enough to be sure they would be counted.

    There would be a certain symmetry if Oregon proved to be the state to put Mr. Obama over the top and he can indeed celebrate that victory in Iowa.

    It was his triumph in the caucuses in Iowa, of course, a state whose population is virtually all white, that first established him as a viable contender for the nomination. Oregon is another state whose population is overwhelmingly white; Portland, the state’s biggest urban area, is a place where he is expected to do very well, though it is sometimes called, even by its residents, “the whitest major city in the United States.”

    Mrs. Clinton, of New York, has argued recently that one of the reasons she, rather than Mr. Obama, should be the Democratic nominee, despite his lead in delegates and the popular vote, is that she has more appeal to and will perform better among white voters who will be crucial to Democratic hopes in November. For Mr. Obama to be in Iowa to celebrate a victory in Oregon would allow him, without having to say a single word, to undermine, if not refute, that argument.

    Mr. Obama’s traveling press secretary, Jen Psaki, suggested Saturday that his campaign was also in a moment of transition.

    “We have our eye on upcoming primary competitions,” Ms. Psaki said after the meeting in Roseburg, mentioning not only Oregon but also Montana and South Dakota, which vote on June 3, concluding the primary season.

    “But we are also beginning to lay the groundwork,” she added, in swing states that will be battlegrounds in November.

    This past week, for instance, Mr. Obama, of Illinois, visited two of the states that Ms. Psaki mentioned: Michigan, whose disputed primary has provided the Democratic Party with such headaches, and Missouri. Two more are on Mr. Obama’s radar for this coming week: Florida, whose primary results are also being debated and where Mr. Obama plans to spend three days, and Iowa, where everything started.

    Mr. Obama appears so eager to return to Iowa that in an appearance Friday night in Sioux Falls, S.D., he mistakenly greeted the crowd that had come to see him as if they were from Sioux City, which is farther south, in Iowa. As some in the crowd groaned, he quickly realized his mistake and apologized, reminding his South Dakota supporters that “I spent eight months in Iowa.”
    Last edited by daThomas; 05/18/2008 at 07:42 PM.
  8. #368  
    That will be sad if that happens....I was really looking forward to a Convention showdown at high noon!
  9. #369  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal View Post
    That will be sad if that happens....I was really looking forward to a Convention showdown at high noon!
    Naw, obama has already moved on from hillary. If you take a look at his skedule, he is all over the place... focusing on states that are not even on the radar until Nov. You also have to remember, he also needs to setup in FL and MI... he did not spend much time in those two states.

    Like I said before, this is over... she drops out in June. I'd not be surprised if she dropped out before June now.

    Nov seems like a long way off, but when you need to pull in supporters from across the US, five months is not a long time at all. Obama has a lot of work to do.

    He needs to reach people like this -- the ones who voted for hillary:



    Kriss Riggs, 60, a photographer from Blue River, Ore., poses for a photo in Bozeman, Mont., on Wednesday, April 16, 2008. Riggs, one of the army small donors for Democratic presidential hopeful, Sen. Barack Obama's, D-Ill., campaign says Riggs she isn't one to spend her money on politicians. "I've never done anything" before, said Riggs. "This man has stirred me."

    source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24526194...96575/rpage/2/
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  10.    #370  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal

    ...This thread (which was started by a far left member of our community) is not about how Rep are going to deal with McCain, but how the Dems are dealing with Hillary (or maybe more true to the point how Hillary is dealing with the Dems).

    Hobbes -- I think my lefty cred is in grave doubt -- my affection for Hillary has revealed me to be a right wing zeolot, the secret spawn of the DLC ...
    Last edited by BARYE; 05/19/2008 at 11:45 AM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  11. #371  
    Say it ain't so....You have just shattered reality as I know it. Next you will be saying that you will be voting for McCain!
  12.    #372  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal View Post
    Say it ain't so....You have just shattered reality as I know it. Next you will be saying that you will be voting for McCain!
    where have you been Hobbes -- BARYE made that announcement more than 6 weeks ago, on April 1st...


    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post

    after further digesting the probability that Hillary’s chances have likely ended, and much profound thought about Obama's lack of experience, I've begun to reconsider who I will support in the upcoming election.

    This is also in part a result of my reflecting more on the positions advocated by the DLC -- and recognizing that in my heart of hearts -- their positions are also mine.

    My personal quandary has been further intensified by a message I tonight received through one of Senator John McCain's most senior aides.

    It addressed a concern that I have long felt of the utmost importance -- but which has been too much regarded with indifference by other political leaders.

    Its an issue that though I care a great deal about it myself, not only affects me.

    What I have been assured of by the Senator’s senior aide is that should he become President, John McCain would support a constitutional amendment to authorize the election of undocumented foreign born members of minority species to The Office of President of The United States.

    Though I have no intention of ever becoming a candidate for that office myself, I’ve long felt that the artificial barrier to my seeking of that position to be an insufferable personal affront.

    The prospective release of me from this monstrous cage on my ambitions has inspired me to tonight publicly announce my endorsement of Republican Senator John McCain for President.

    BARYE

    ...
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  13. #373  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    where have you been Hobbes -- BARYE made that announcement more than 6 weeks ago, on April 1st...
    Giving the date of the announcement, it is hard to tell if you are serious or not. lol
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  14. #374  
    I quit reading for content a couple of weeks ago and now read for what he said it was - his self entertainment and he is fun to read.
  15. #375  
    The continuing saga of "what happened to Hillary."

    Just like I said, she is putting her supporters in a bad situation... they don't want to switch to obama, but that is what it might take to finally make the light go off and have her step to the side. She is sad...

    Having a friend/supporter call you "desperate" is not very comforting... especially when he/she does so in public.

    Supporter says Clinton getting desperate

    "I would say at this point we're starting to see a little desperation on the part of the woman who I support and I'll support until whatever time she makes a different determination," Paterson told New York radio station WAMC, according to the New York Daily News. "I thought she was the best candidate and I thought she had the best chance of winning."
    http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/
    Last edited by theog; 05/22/2008 at 06:21 PM.
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  16. #376  
    Sometimes I look at the news and wonder, How Stupid Can One Be? Of course, I have motives, and agendas that I refuse to divulge in life. I never tell a soul. Some things are best kept close and taken to the grave.

    Politicians should learn this... but right when I thought no one would be as stupid as to openly suggest Obama would be assisinated, Hillary Clinton surprised me....

    And her weak reply at the bottom of the story is about as lame as they come. I'd thought more of her if she would have simply said, "Well, you never know." And gave a big smile.


    HILLARY RAISES ASSASSINATION ISSUE
    DEFENDS LONG-RUNNING CAMPAIGN

    "My husband did not wrap up the nomination in 1992 until he won the California primary somewhere in the middle of June, right? We all remember Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June in California. I don't understand it," she said, dismissing calls to drop out.
    http://www.nypost.com/seven/05232008..._wa_112232.htm

    For those who don't understand why this is important....

    Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June 1968 while running for president... the day after (or couple days after) winning California.

    LBJ, the sitting pres and dem, dropped out of his bid to run for president. He dropped out sometime in march/april/may 1968

    Humphrey ended up winning, but got his azz smashed by nixon.
    Last edited by theog; 05/23/2008 at 11:50 PM.
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  17. #377  
    Quote Originally Posted by theog View Post
    Sometimes I look at the news and wonder, How Stupid Can One Be? Of course, I have motives, and agendas that I refuse to divulge in life. I never tell a soul. Some things are best kept close and taken to the grave.

    Politicians should learn this... but right when I thought no one would be as stupid as to openly suggest Obama would be assisinated, Hillary Clinton surprised me....

    And her weak reply at the bottom of the story is about as lame as they come. I'd thought more of her if she would have simply said, "Well, you never know." And gave a big smile.


    HILLARY RAISES ASSASSINATION ISSUE
    DEFENDS LONG-RUNNING CAMPAIGN



    http://www.nypost.com/seven/05232008..._wa_112232.htm

    For those who don't understand why this is important....

    Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June 1968 while running for president... the day after (or couple days after) winning California.

    LBJ, the sitting pres and dem, dropped out of his bid to run for president. He dropped out sometime in march/april/may 1968

    Mcgovern ended up winning, but got his azz smashed by nixon.
    Yea, I'd say that's a pretty obvious floating of a fear balloon. I've heard older people say things like, "If he's elected he'll likely be assassinated.". Desperate card to try to play. At least the press is hanging her with it although it's Friday on a holiday weekend. That dazed look on her face while trying to explain the remark says it all, "It's over."

    No! To an Obama-Clinton tix!
  18. #378  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas View Post
    Yea, I'd say that's a pretty obvious floating of a fear balloon. I've heard older people say things like, "If he's elected he'll likely be assassinated.". Desperate card to try to play. At least the press is hanging her with it although it's Friday on a holiday weekend. That dazed look on her face while trying to explain the remark says it all, "It's over."

    No! To an Obama-Clinton tix!
    What is interesting is that she has said this on more than one occasion. I might have given her a pass if this was a onetime comment....

    Seems like someone would have taken her to the side and noted that while she did not mean anything by it, it did not sound too smart. She has some dumb people on her staff to let her repeat this over and over....

    It just sounds dumb....

    Clinton says, "Those snipers that missed me just might hit obama and bring me the nomination!"
    Last edited by theog; 05/24/2008 at 12:02 AM.
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  19. #379  
    I believe this is the 2nd occasion she said basically the same thing in the same context. A slip? Maybe the first time, not the 2nd time and I do not believe it was a slip the first time.
  20. #380  
    Though I totally missed the angle, I called her strategy ....

    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal View Post
    I have been consistent....she is in for the count. ..though in politics 180 degree turn in events never really surprise me. Here are several reasons why I think Hillary is not leaving anytime soon or at least not until about 10-14 days before the convention:

    -----------------------

    WAITING FOR A FUMBLE
    I think a strong possible strategy for her to stay in until just 1-2 weeks before the convention is the possibility of Obama fumbling the ball. All she has to do right now is keep on running behind Obama. If he fumbles the ball at all with a stupid comment, a dirty story breaks, or anything....then she is in the right position at the right time to pick up the ball and run it into the endzone. If she is still in the same position 10 days before the convention and Obama did not fumble at all with no hope of a Super Delegate Win, then at that time she will bow out.

    If I was her political adviser, this is what I would advise.

    FULL POST with all the reasons she will stay: http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...0&postcount=77

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