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  1. gatorray's Avatar
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       #1  
    Okay, here is the scenario. I am trying to vote Democrat next year. Not because I am a Democrat (or Republican for that matter). I am voting Democrat so this country can right itself. I don't think the Dems are better than the Republicans, I just think that everyone will decrease the amount of time they spend complaining about the way the country is.

    But the Dems are driving me crazy. They are spending too much time telling me how bad Bush is. The Dems need that one person that is the slam dunk representative for the party that can start their campaign for president NOW! Instead they are spending too much time fighting each other. The Dems need to realize that if they had a strong candidate, they are in next year. You know what, while typing that I realize that the Dems do know that and that is why they are fighting each other over the nomination....

    I have a feeling that there are plenty of people out there like me who are looking for a change next year and are willing to vote Democrat, but are discouraged.

    Sorry....just needed to vent.
  2. #2  
    the reason for the primaries is to find who they want as that "one person that is the slam dunk representative for the party"

    Some think its Hillary -- others Obama, or Edwards.

    A few people in Iowa and NH will be making that choice.

    A candidate will no doubt be selected by the end of February -- 3 1/2 months from now
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  3. #3  
    You really need to vote on the issues. The problem the Democrat party has is that it offers no issues. It only offers complaints. What it offers and calls solutions do not hold up under close scrutiny. In addition, do you really want a leader with no experience in anything? If you do, Clinton and Obama fit the bill.

    Ben
  4. #4  
    You don't want leaders with no experience. See how well we did the when we picked a leader WITH experience (8 yrs ago). Let's keep that up.

    And let's send the party that had power over the most of last 8 yrs back to the Congress+White House. They will certainly come through on all the issues, like they have in the past. That's experience for you.

    But seriously .. Do only ex-Governors qualify as having experience?
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  5. #5  
    Sadly, many of you are deluded.

    The Democrats cannot win. Watching the "debate" the other night makes that clear.

    The only ticket that _might_ win is Gore/Obama, but that is unlikely.

    Republicans have Giuliani, who is going to be the next President (he's the best of the lot)

    Demoplicans and Republicrats are all the same; keeping themselves in power, and creating purpetuating goverment programs.

    The country needed to "right" itself after having both a democrat president and congress in the 90s, who did nothing.

    In the end, people will pick the stronger person with convictions (whether they agree with convictions).
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikec View Post
    Sadly, many of you are deluded.

    The Democrats cannot win. Watching the "debate" the other night makes that clear.

    The only ticket that _might_ win is Gore/Obama, but that is unlikely.

    Republicans have Giuliani, who is going to be the next President (he's the best of the lot)

    Demoplicans and Republicrats are all the same; keeping themselves in power, and creating purpetuating goverment programs.

    The country needed to "right" itself after having both a democrat president and congress in the 90s, who did nothing.

    In the end, people will pick the stronger person with convictions (whether they agree with convictions).
    Republicans are so amusing. They've all got a hard-on for Giuliani who has a history of standing for none of their core platform but he polls well in a National so they're leaning towards him so they can win. All they care about is winning regardless of position or principal.

    The fact that Edwards is not leading the nationals is proof that working-class Americans either don't care about themselves or don;t even understand who is screwing them.
  7. #7  
    People will get the government they deserve. As Always.

    The rich and influential will get the government they want. As always.
    --
    Aloke
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  8. #8  
    This political arguing just ridiculous. Look, folks, it's really quite simple.

    The fact is that both parties suck. Trying to make one look bad through the use of sarcasm is really just a circle jerk thing.

    Neither tackle border or immigration issues the way they should. The dems never give you any specific answers to the pointed questions we want to hear solutions to, so why should we take them seriously? No consistent, concrete solutions on social security, healthcare, etc. Dems simply play the polls to try to gain popularity rather than going by the strength of their convictions.

    Similarly, the republicans sit in office and achieve nothing. We have failing immigration policies, the borders are as porous as ever,
    Worthless party as well.

    They're both a party of clowns. They just carry different bags of tricks for different agendas.

    My kingdom for a third party, already. Ditch these jokers.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by logmein View Post
    This political arguing just ridiculous. Look, folks, it's really quite simple.

    The fact is that both parties suck. Trying to make one look bad through the use of sarcasm is really just a circle jerk thing.

    Neither tackle border or immigration issues the way they should. The dems never give you any specific answers to the pointed questions we want to hear solutions to, so why should we take them seriously? No consistent, concrete solutions on social security, healthcare, etc. Dems simply play the polls to try to gain popularity rather than going by the strength of their convictions.

    Similarly, the republicans sit in office and achieve nothing. We have failing immigration policies, the borders are as porous as ever,
    Worthless party as well.

    They're both a party of clowns. They just carry different bags of tricks for different agendas.

    My kingdom for a third party, already. Ditch these jokers.

    True. Im in New Jersey. The democrats here (corzine, mcgreevey, to mention but a few) are OUTRAGEOUSLY corrupt, which is why I just cant vote democrat in these elections. I just have a deep seated hatred for the party - nothing but ridiculous property taxes ( avg is about $8000 per year in this state) , special interest pandering, scandals, and empty promises (basically, outright, willful lies to be quite frank) Just an awful status quo in this state.

    Im with you. Third party please. Out with both!
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by logmein View Post
    My kingdom for a third party, already. Ditch these jokers.
    If you had a kingdom to give, your hopes for a viable 3rd party might have a prayer and have your very own joker.

    Not directed at you, but the soft-pedaled, unspoken support for Repugs here and elsewhere is [Billy] Kristol clear.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by logmein View Post
    This political arguing just ridiculous. Look, folks, it's really quite simple.

    The fact is that both parties suck. Trying to make one look bad through the use of sarcasm is really just a circle jerk thing.

    Neither tackle border or immigration issues the way they should. The dems never give you any specific answers to the pointed questions we want to hear solutions to, so why should we take them seriously? No consistent, concrete solutions on social security, healthcare, etc. Dems simply play the polls to try to gain popularity rather than going by the strength of their convictions.

    Similarly, the republicans sit in office and achieve nothing. We have failing immigration policies, the borders are as porous as ever,
    Worthless party as well.

    They're both a party of clowns. They just carry different bags of tricks for different agendas.

    My kingdom for a third party, already. Ditch these jokers.
    All my sarcasm is directed at the people. Why blame the parties? They are doing what works for them.

    The fact that the masses can be manipulated like sheep with carefully crafted sound-bites on TV says it all.

    Don't blame the parties. I have seen how politics works in multi-party systems. It's even worse. No 3rd or 4th party will come to the rescue. They will all end up manipulating the public.

    Blame the vast unwashed electorate.
    --
    Aloke
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  12. #12  
    The dems and reps both are driving me crazy!!!
    at&t iPhone3G
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by aprasad View Post
    All my sarcasm is directed at the people. Why blame the parties? They are doing what works for them.

    The fact that the masses can be manipulated like sheep with carefully crafted sound-bites on TV says it all.

    Don't blame the parties. I have seen how politics works in multi-party systems. It's even worse. No 3rd or 4th party will come to the rescue. They will all end up manipulating the public.

    Blame the vast unwashed electorate.
    Here! Here!
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by lifes2short View Post
    If you had a kingdom to give, your hopes for a viable 3rd party might have a prayer and have your very own joker.

    Not directed at you, but the soft-pedaled, unspoken support for Repugs here and elsewhere is [Billy] Kristol clear.

    I most certainly have a kingdom to give, my young jester. I think a great many Americans are ready now to give a piece of their kingdoms to put toward a third party at this point. The dems have quite a few jokers among their party... they are very clearly just as much of a group of fools as the repubs are.

    Any hopes for a dem president might actually have a prayer if one of their candidates was to be so bold as to actually consistently stand for something without doubletalking issues and engaging in the practice of "not really answering" the meaningful questions.
    Case in point - Hillary, who, if you are a dem, happens to be your very own lead joker. Nothing planned for social security, nothing constructive on immigration, etc. Yet she was among the many who screamed the loudest at bush for his solutions on such problems. pfft.

    Regarding the Repug support, there is blatant, not softpedaled, support for the demoncrats here and elsewhere - all over the off topic forums in fact.
    If the demoncrat candidates` answers to most questions asked of them were [Billy] Kristol clear, they would win more voters. Problem is, they are not, which is why they have a habit of losing to morons like Bush. As we have seen with Hillary, they are as clear as [MUD].

    So like I said - third party, please.
    Last edited by logmein; 11/17/2007 at 01:46 PM.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by logmein View Post
    Any hopes for a dem president might actually have a prayer if one of their candidates was to be so bold as to actually consistently stand for something without doubletalking issues and engaging in the practice of "not really answering" the meaningful questions.
    Case in point - Hillary, who, if you are a dem, happens to be your very own lead joker. Nothing planned for social security, nothing constructive on immigration, etc. Yet she was among the many who screamed the loudest at bush for his solutions on such problems. pfft.

    Regarding the Repug support, there is blatant, not softpedaled, support for the demoncrats here and elsewhere - all over the off topic forums in fact.
    If the demoncrat candidates` answers to most questions asked of them were [Billy] Kristol clear, they would win more voters. Problem is, they are not, which is why they have a habit of losing to morons like Bush. As we have seen with Hillary, they are as clear as [MUD].
    So like I said - third party, please.
    All politicians today doubletalk and spin in order to put themselves in the best possible light. You talk about the Democrats which is true, but both Mitt and Rudy look like a couple of guppies out of water with all their flip flopping. The problem is we are controled by the media in this country.
    Our friend from the UK observed the problem in the thread US Radio stations.........
    Quote Originally Posted by Agg (of Leve) View Post
    I was kinda hoping I could find somthing similar to listen to from over there, just to take the temperature of what the "man in the street" is thinking. The sort of thing I am looking for are shows where people phone up and talk to the presenters telling them what they think. From some of them I've heard to date, it seems to be more the other way round, i.e. the presenter telling the listener what to think!
    It's all about business and what's in corporate America's best interest, which isn't the same as yours or mine as individuals. I don't care who gets elected, Republican or Democrat, it will still be business as usual. We need to get the money out of politics. Politicians are using our treasury as a slush fund for themselves and their friends.
    Iago

    "Good name in man and woman, dear my lord, Is the immediate jewel of their souls: Who steals my purse steals trash . . . But he that filches from me my good name Robs me of that which not enriches him
    And makes me poor indeed."


    Criminal: A person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation.
    - Howard Scott
  16. #16  
    The attitude that both parties suck and politicians will always do nothing is a defeatist attitude that allows one to ignore one's responsibility to knowing what their politicians are doing (or not doing) and holding them accountable.

    If your politician isn't doing what you want, call them and tell them. Write an editorial, do something. But quit whining for a magical third party to come into existence to make everything peachy.
  17. fishera's Avatar
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    #17  
    I am only 15 but I know what I want to do when I grow up... politics. In 2.5 years I will be going to law school to get a law degree and also major in poliscience.

    Today's game of politics is more like a circle with no ends, thats the problem. After reading this whole thread and getting questions from people all the time, they ask "why the heck would you wanna become a politician!?"... its simple... because they have the power to change the world. Politics isn't about playing sides, its not about money, its about helping people. Another reason is because the earliest memory in my mind is the 2000 Presidential election. Yes it was an election, yes Gore did win, no it was not a popular vote thing... it was a US Supreme Court rulling that ultimatly ruled Bush as President.

    What I can tell you about my life before Bush is that my family was able to purchase two homes, moving from Woodland Hills in the Valley of Los Angeles to suburban California... afford 2 new cars for my mother and my father and support any family member in need... that was under Clinton.

    Since 2001, we have been screwed! I don't think tis because ive become more aware of anything because my family sees the same way, we are pissed and partly scared. I started reading into politics and history after Sept 11th and its scary. The US Patriot Act takes away the Bill of Rights and basically sets us back to times before the Magna Carta! I can not imagine not remembering all of the problems we have today.

    Ok... SO NOW to the actual point of the thread. The democrats are less corrupt then the Republicans. The Democrats are actually the voice of the people.. but lets say the republicans are christians. No offense to religion, ill keep my personal beliefs out of this... but the United States ware formed "to create a more perfect union" cited for the US Constitution and so far we have been doing a **** job! Allowing religion to play a role of any kind in politics is tearing our nation apart!!!! If we were like this 100 years ago, the idea of a land of opportunity wouldn't exist... if you were white it would.

    Since Carter became President *yes a democrat, not all are amazing leaders* there has been this notion that religion is politics, and its NOT! Our nation was not founded for that! It was actually founded by religious outcasts that didnt want anything to do with the Church of English. PS: You can blame Henry the 8th for the split of the Church (if im not mistaken that is, could be Charles the 8th, get the roman numerals confused sometimes)

    The republicans are the voice of the few, is more like a... "Bush is an amazing leader... for 1% of the population!" The rest are blinded by religious beliefs, oh the CHOICE of abortion is wrong! Oh killing innocent people in Iraq so an amazing thing to do, but "killing" a non-born child is a sin! TOTAL HYPOCRITES! Its not even a difference of opinion anymore... its fact verse fiction and the republicans are living in fiction! As for alt. energies and global warming... fine, be a dumb-*** and don't believe science, thats fine because you "evangelical republicans" still dont believe Jesus was a JEW! *I am a jewish atheist btw, similar to Karl Marx, so dont say that doesn't exist* BUT your republicans got us into a country "war, yet not because congress never declared it" that has risen our oil prices to nearly $100 a barrel and my folks and friends are paying $4 for a gallon of gasoline in Southern California... so for the sake of OUR money, the money that fuels your capitalist interests, find a cheaper way to get us around... because you republicans seem to be disconnected to the fact that if every American were to stop driving tomorrow, you would be poor as HELL! Remember that we are the majority *the middle class* and your the minority! We have power, if brought together, you don't!

    I support Hillary Clinton for President... not because she would be the first women President or because she is a Clinton, or because my family supports her... because they didn't until about a week ago. Trust me, in my house, we have thrown things because we were pissed at eachother over legislation of illegal immigration, medicare, socialist medicine, wars, computers, etc. They are democrats, but we can still have differences of opinion of course. Hillary Clinton has experience, she is a brilliant women... bet most of you didn't know she used to be a republican! She saw the light =D

    And as for responsibility... I can tell you that we do it in ASB, elected representatives of my high school's student body. I was elected class President last year and so far we have not only pushed for new things, actions, and such... but we are passing out forms to people who are turning 18 before the mid-term elections in California on Feb 5th, 2008... yes, i get to work the polls also! =) but, I mean... I am also involved with JSA *Junior State of America* and am assemblyperson of that at my school, which has a major impact on all of Southern California's JSA's.

    My point is, read up, watch the news, many sources of course, and make an opinion. Also, don't fault the current Democratic majority congress for not being able to stop the "War" because only the president can stop it... sad but true. Although Harry Reid's idea of leaving the lights on so Congress is technically in session so Bush can not use executive privilege and appoint people to positions is utter brilliant!!!!!!!!

    PS: One day I will be President and change the face of politics forever, like Machievelli. Thats not a wish, thats a promise. and I never break my promises!

    -Aaron Fisher
    Aaron M. Fisher
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  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by logmein View Post
    I most certainly have a kingdom to give, my young jester.
    Really? Where's the beef?

    I think a great many Americans are ready now to give a piece of their kingdoms to put toward a third party at this point.
    Since you're only talking about it now, your master plan must be to have a remote 3rd place candidate in 2016?

    Any hopes for a dem president might actually have a prayer if one of their candidates was to be so bold as to actually consistently stand for something without doubletalking issues and engaging in the practice of "not really answering" the meaningful questions.
    Case in point - Hillary, who, if you are a dem, happens to be your very own lead joker. Nothing planned for social security, nothing constructive on immigration, etc. Yet she was among the many who screamed the loudest at bush for his solutions on such problems.
    You should really research, not 'google', before you spread such falsehoods.

    Regarding the Repug support, there is blatant, not softpedaled, support for the demoncrats here and elsewhere - all over the off topic forums in fact.
    Saying what you mean and meaning what you say is considered integrity in most societal circles. The soft-pedaled "I have no particular allegiance to any party" BS coupled with sideswiping remarks against Dems, in particular, is a sad, sad joke.

    If the demoncrat candidates` answers to most questions asked of them were [Billy] Kristol clear, they would win more voters. Problem is, they are not, which is why they have a habit of losing to morons like Bush. As we have seen with Hillary, they are as clear as [MUD].
    When your attention span can grow beyond 20-second soundbites, you'll come to understand that their positions are commonly known and readily available.

    So like I said - third party, please.
    When a car runs out of gas, you can either get out of the car and push or be considered dead-weight. I'm sure your 3rd party Presidential candidate in 2016 will publicly thank you personally for all your "kingdom's" sacrifice.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by lifes2short View Post

    When your attention span can grow beyond 20-second soundbites, you'll come to understand that their positions are commonly known and readily available.
    I agree. This is the problem with voters these days.
  20. gojeda's Avatar
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by fishera View Post

    What I can tell you about my life before Bush is that my family was able to purchase two homes, moving from Woodland Hills in the Valley of Los Angeles to suburban California... afford 2 new cars for my mother and my father and support any family member in need... that was under Clinton.
    Clinton, or any President (Republican, Democrat, socialist, fascist....whatever), did not enable your parents to buy two new cars and get that home in suburban California - YOUR PARENTS made that happen.

    I will stop here because the rest of your post was shockingly ignorant. I hope you make the most of the education that you, apparently, desperately need.
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