View Poll Results: Answer one of these questions

Voters
21. You may not vote on this poll
  • I went to the concert.

    5 23.81%
  • I wanted to go to the concert.

    9 42.86%
  • I don't like U2 so I didn't go to the concert.

    3 14.29%
  • I don't like concerts so I didn't go to the concert.

    4 19.05%
Results 1 to 15 of 15
  1.    #1  
    Has anyone gone to any of the concerts that U2 has been putting on? I went to the one on the 19th in San Jose. It was a great 2 hour long set.
  2. #2  
    I've been to their last two Houston concerts, and both were great. Last time was a little better as it was at the Astrodome and was a longer set.
    James Hromadka, TreoCentral Editor
    Houston - EST. 1836
  3. #3  
    I'm afraid I missed the latest one - went to their concert during the Pop tour, it was great.
  4. #4  
    you forgot the survey option of

    U2? I don't support hypocritical, close-minded artists.

    if you're able to alter the survey, i'll vote for that one.

    mc
  5. #5  
    I didn't get a chance to go this time around. The last time that I saw U2 was at Camp Randall WI for the Achtung baby/Zooropa tour back in 92 (or was it 93... the memory seems to be going). That was a great show w/ Public Enemy opening for them
    Son mis dos centados!
  6. #6  
    Originally posted by mensachicken
    you forgot the survey option of

    U2? I don't support hypocritical, close-minded artists.

    if you're able to alter the survey, i'll vote for that one.

    mc
    WOAH WOAH WOAH WOAH.... care to elaborate? That's just a mighty big comment and since I see from the other side of the fence I just wanted to hear you explain this.

    The survey also forgot to mention that I WILL be going since the whole tour isn't over yet. They have 4 shows in Chicago.
  7. #7  
    Originally posted by timmins


    WOAH WOAH WOAH WOAH.... care to elaborate? That's just a mighty big comment and since I see from the other side of the fence I just wanted to hear you explain this.

    The survey also forgot to mention that I WILL be going since the whole tour isn't over yet. They have 4 shows in Chicago.
    i elaborated in the other thread on killer modules, where the topic was also raised. if you want full details, read the first book on this page

    http://www.negativland.com/nmol/negbooks.html

    it's also available from amazon but the band gets more money if you buy direct from them. in addition, the case was mentioned (VERY briefly) in rolling stone and spin, and more elaborately in MONDO 2000, where the edge was interviewed.

    mc
  8. #8  
    Well, I have to disagree with your no-talen accusation. I think that's just your frustration with the band rather than a serious critique of their song writing skills.

    There used to be a band named LFO, a small techno house band that made amazing contributions to the early years of house. Then along comes this band that names themself "LFO" (I don't know what theirs stands for, but the first originator of the name used the name as Low Frequency Oscillations = "Bass"). I get infuriated when people sing that song, but I wouldn't say they have no talent. Think about it this way, even if their song writing skills suck... they have a "talent" for getting to where they are right now (ah-hem... one hit wonders).

    The music industry is so back-*** dumb I could list numerous things I don't like with them. For instance, the Orb was not allowed to release Cydonia for up to 8 months after final pressing because Island recordings wanted to ride out the latest Spice Girl release and the U2 release. Both bands have their completely individual marketshare but for some reason Island wanted to get seperate releases so their releases weren't competing with each other.

    I don't know what me point is... I hate certain bands, and I really dislike the music industry (15 bucks for a 12 cent piece of plastic is a good topic to get me mad. -- CD prices). MC Hammer was ripped of everything when he sampled SuperFreak and didn't get permission. It happens, it's the law. And who is to say that Negativland would or wouldn't have profitted or made it big-time from this song? I don't know.

    U2, however, has changed radically over the years. They want to be politically aware and active, yet they have big olives hanging from arches and large tv screens. It's is money not used for the effective manner and them on stage shaking their moneymaker in order for the dollars to pour in.

    Eh, my rant... I'm done. Please respect my opinion as I have done yours. I don't mean anything personal, but just wanted to know what you meant by mentioning your opinion on U2. I promise I am not trying to start a flame-war. U2 is not even my favorite band, but my gf's... I would much prefer Orb, or Cowboy Junkies.
  9. #9  
    Originally posted by timmins
    Well, I have to disagree with your no-talen accusation. I think that's just your frustration with the band rather than a serious critique of their song writing skills.

    um, yes and no. i mean, i haven't listened to the band in about a decade (i shut off my radio in 1987 and haven't turned it back on). however, occasionally i'll hear a trickle of the edge's signature guitar riff (which i've never liked), which makes me think they have not grown at all.

    i understand what you're saying about i should listen to the music and pass judgement on that and not on the actions of their record label (which u2 partially owned at the time--don't know if they still do), but u2 is a band that equates themselves with politics so i feel nothing wrong with looking at their actions when judging them.

    however, even were i to listen to their latest record or last few, i'm sure my opinion would not change on their talents. it's not my kind of music. when i think of great songwriters, i think of will oldham, townes van zandt, isaac brock, joel rl phelps, bob dylan... not bono and his peers.

    The music industry is so back-*** dumb I could list numerous things I don't like with them.

    sure, i agree with that.


    Island recordings wanted to ride out the latest Spice Girl release and the U2 release.

    well in my opinion, island is one of the worst labels (with regards to treatment of artists) on the planet. why any new band would go with them after the negativland thing and the way they treated tom waits is beyond me.

    And who is to say that Negativland would or wouldn't have profitted or made it big-time from this song? I don't know.

    well Negativland is a group of sound collage artists. "band" really isn't even the right term for them. the cd that u2/island squashed had already been out a few weeks when they were pulled from the shelves (hence the missing 492 copies--of which, thankfully, i have one). negativland have been around for about 20 years now and have never sold more than 5000 (yes, 5 thousand) copies of any of their cds. they posed no threat to island or u2.

    i also have no interest in a flame war either. however, it makes me ill that bono and his band mates live under this umbrella where it's okay for them to sample (without permission) but not okay for others. i don't have much of a stomach for hypocrisy.

    as for u2 not being one of your favorite bands--cool, i'm not a big negativland fan (though i do love the u2 song--let me know if you want an mp3 of it). it's the principal that i was having a problem with.

    I would much prefer Orb, or Cowboy Junkies.
    is that where your nick comes from? timmins?

    mc
  10. #10  
    funny how you read my mind. I would love a copy of it, I would like to see how they sampled it. Last night I was listening to the original Joy Division version of the Dead Souls, and my friend goes... "hey, did someone remake a NIN's song?"

    Um... no.

    I am beginning to see your point, especially how if U2 is so judgemental of others action (Bishop TuTu, aparteid, etc.), then why not be honored or appreciate others reusing a catchy tune.

    You're absolutely correct about the nick. Most people ask me if I am from Timmins, Canada. So... I just inform them of my infatuation with Margo and how Michael is a genius (my opinion). Which leads me to a great reference...

    Sweet Jane (not my favorite song, but it's what keeps the band recognized in mainstream music) was a remake of Lou Reed. WHO, IN TURN, said that the remake is better than his version. I see your point with U2...

    Being an artist (digital, no less)... you should always "borrow" ideas with design, simply because it sparks further creativity or incorporates a great design. I don't steal, I just interpret and re-use. You make an interesting comment and now I find myself thinking about it more... thanks.
  11. #11  
    Originally posted by timmins
    funny how you read my mind. I would love a copy of it, I would like to see how they sampled it.

    keep in mind that the band consider themselves collage artists, rather than musicians (though they do play instruments). i would not call this a "cover" of u2, but more a satiric poke at the band. in fact, part of negativland's defence is that it is supposed to be legal to "sample" artwork if it is re-interpreted and does give new meaning, specifically parody/satire.

    remember that collage is legal in all other mediums (video, print, etc.) except audio, which is essentially what Negativland is trying to change. they feel that the laws are antiquated, and that because they predate current technologies that they should be re-written.

    Sweet Jane (not my favorite song, but it's what keeps the band recognized in mainstream music) was a remake of Lou Reed. WHO, IN TURN, said that the remake is better than his version. I see your point with U2...

    i am both a cowboy junkies and a reed fan and i enjoy BOTH versions of the song. i'm sure u2 fans that have a sense of humour will also get a chuckle out of the negativland interpretations of their songs. both bono and the edge have said they found it quite funny, as has casey kasem (after you hear them you'll understand why i mention this).... however, as i said in another thread, people are what they do, not what they say.

    I don't steal, I just interpret and re-use.

    then you will definitely appreciate the tracks.

    i am a designer, myself. and constantly borrow from others in my field as well as other fields. inspiration is everywhere. were bono, et al, to have investigated the past works of negativland, i believe they would have found the groups using of their music to be a huge compliment. however, once the legal dogs were let loose, u2 never looked back or even wanted to know what was happening.

    interestingly, the edge, thinking that the band was, i suppose, of interest to those keen on contemporary technology, called up the magazine MONDO 2000 and offered himself up as an interview subject. they said they would get back to him. now, because M2K was a relatively hip magazine, they were well aware of the negativland incident. so what they did was call mark hosler (negativland) and tell him about the edge and asked if THEY (negativland) would do the interview. they agreed.

    so they call the edge up and halfway thru the interview, they mention the negativland issue and the edge says that he is quite sympathetic and wishes it didn't go down as it had. at that point, hosler reveals his identity. the edge fumbles and... hangs up. he calls back a while later (presumably after consulting his lawyer), apologizes and says that he got disconnected, and the interview proceeds. negativland asks if he really feels sympathetic, would he (and the rest of the band) be willing to pay their legal fees, which were insurmountable to negativland (the band is still paying them off almost 10 years later), but would be an afternoon's pay for bono. the edge said that sounded like a good idea, that he would get back to them. of course he didn't. the interview appeared in M2K and, i believe, was released somewhere on cd. personally, i find this extremely funny.

    the mag is being sold on ebay by someone right now, actually. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI...tem=1427033496

    You make an interesting comment and now I find myself thinking about it more... thanks.

    well i'm glad you think so. i can certainly see both sides of the equation (both our original points of view), but i do find it hard to sympathize with the artist/victim that is u2, when they were really never in a bad position and their action (or lack thereof) basically devestated hard working artists who truly are doing unique work--then use their influence to keep the story as under wraps as they can. ugh.

    check out www.victoryshag.com/negativland/ before midnight tonight and the tracks will be there to download. feel free to share them with whoever you wish. those two tracks are then *entire* record and the sole course of the conflict.
  12. #12  
    i forgot to mention that the files are large.

    mc
    Last edited by mensachicken; 04/27/2001 at 04:42 PM.
  13. #13  
    my dsl is 1.5 down and 512 up... however you want to work it.
  14. #14  
    i uploaded the tracks so they should be accessible at www.victoryshag.com/negativland/ now.

    mc
  15. #15  
    Downloaded them, and I will listen to them in the morning, with my girlfriend (the U2 fan). This will be interesting.

    I enjoyed conversing with you and will give you my take on the songs in the future.

    Thanks.

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