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  1.    #1  
    ... refused to perform a perfectly legal, though not required (i.e. elective) procedure?
  2. #2  
    It would depend on the doctor's reasoning.

    If he (or she) thought the risks of the procdure out weighted the benefits, I ask for clarification.

    If he (or she) said that it was not financially beneficial for them to do the procedure (ie: medicare wouldn't pay enough), I'd look for a new doctor.

    If he (or she) said that they were against the procedure for moral reasons, I'd look for a new doctor.
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim View Post
    ... refused to perform a perfectly legal, though not required (i.e. elective) procedure?
    If the basis for the refusal is not discriminatory (i.e., race, ethnicity, religion, etc.), then you should look for another doctor that will.

    Being a physician myself I can tell you that we are required under law to render any and all necesary emergency care regardless of funding, beyond that we can refuse service - but not abandon a patient - for almost any reason excluding discrimination.
    Have a great one...Doc D.

    Phillips VELO > Palm III > Palm V > Palm 505m > Treo 180 > Treo 300 > Samsung i500 > Treo 700p > HTC 6800 > Treo 800w > Treo Pro > Palm Pre > HTC Evo
  4. #4  
    Shop...why are you asking?
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by Christinac130 View Post
    Shop...why are you asking?
    He likes to "ask".

    What would I do? The same thing I would do if a pharmacist refused to fill my perfectly legal elective prescription.

    Have their a$$ fired and their license revoked.
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas View Post
    He likes to "ask".

    What would I do? The same thing I would do if a pharmacist refused to fill my perfectly legal elective prescription.

    Have their a$$ fired and their license revoked.
    Interesting, on what grounds?

    If a patient comes to me and makes an unreasonable or medically unsound (however legal it may be) request, I have the right and legal responsability to decline such a request.

    That happens very often with the direct to consumer drug advertisement; some people come in demanding that or the other drug they saw on TV, they won't accept any reasoning regarding the usefulness or suitability of such a drug in their condition; if I feel is not the right treatment, I will refuse.
    Have a great one...Doc D.

    Phillips VELO > Palm III > Palm V > Palm 505m > Treo 180 > Treo 300 > Samsung i500 > Treo 700p > HTC 6800 > Treo 800w > Treo Pro > Palm Pre > HTC Evo
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim View Post
    ... refused to perform a perfectly legal, though not required (i.e. elective) procedure?
    This about abortions again?

    Anyway, being an elective procedure they can always shop around for another doctor. It does depend on the funding structure however. In UK they have the national health system, which is funded by 10% of everyone's salary. Medical care is therefore free at the point of service, and it can be argued that you have already paid the doctor for rendering a service, and if he refuses to do so for his own personal reasons one would have a perfectly valid reason to complain.

    Such is the difference between a socialist and capitalist system.

    Surur
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    This about abortions again?
    exactly
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Such is the difference between a socialist and capitalist system.

    Surur
    You are not entirely correct, even under socialized medicine the decision whether to perform a procedure ultimately rests with the physician's medical opinion.

    I deal with the Canadian Health System frequently regarding care needed for Canadian winter visitors and those issues often arise.

    Funding or lack thereof is not always the deciding factor, although I will certainly admit is a factor.
    Have a great one...Doc D.

    Phillips VELO > Palm III > Palm V > Palm 505m > Treo 180 > Treo 300 > Samsung i500 > Treo 700p > HTC 6800 > Treo 800w > Treo Pro > Palm Pre > HTC Evo
  10. #10  
    I would accept the physician's decision and if I still desired to go further, seek it from another source. Ben
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by TreoNewt View Post
    You are not entirely correct, even under socialized medicine the decision whether to perform a procedure ultimately rests with the physician's medical opinion.
    Its not the physicians medical opinion I am concerned about (although my MDU always tells me opinions should be defensible and have a reasonable body of support in the medical community) but their religious opinions and its impact on their decision making.

    Surur
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    This about abortions again?
    Again let me correct you both...in America any physician can and do elect to perform such services for which he is trained and certified and he decides to perform.

    If this an abortion issue, then as long as is elective any physician can decline service and is perfectly legal - you know, not only the woman that has the right to choose, we also do.

    In your socialist utopic society may be different, but we are not there.
    Last edited by TreoNewt; 05/04/2007 at 12:42 PM.
    Have a great one...Doc D.

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  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Its not the physicians medical opinion I am concerned about (although my MDU always tells me opinions should be defensible and have a reasonable body of support in the medical community) but their religious opinions and its impact on their decision making.

    Surur
    Although I agree with you on principle about the religious issue, even if he declines to do an abortion because of his religious believes is still legal in America.

    Again, so long is not an emergency or he is not the only provider of such emergency services available in the immediate area, a physician (like any other American citizen) has the right to refuse based on his religious believes.

    You may not like it, however that does not make it illegal.
    Have a great one...Doc D.

    Phillips VELO > Palm III > Palm V > Palm 505m > Treo 180 > Treo 300 > Samsung i500 > Treo 700p > HTC 6800 > Treo 800w > Treo Pro > Palm Pre > HTC Evo
  14. #14  
    Why should a physician not use his ethics/religious background in making decisions? Every one of us uses our background in many of the decisions we make. I am very sure you do and I definitely do.

    Ben

    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Its not the physicians medical opinion I am concerned about (although my MDU always tells me opinions should be defensible and have a reasonable body of support in the medical community) but their religious opinions and its impact on their decision making.

    Surur
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by TreoNewt View Post
    Although I agree with you on principle about the religious issue, even if he declines to do an abortion because of his religious believes is still legal in America.

    Again, so long is not an emergency or he is not the only provider of such emergency services available in the immediate area, a physician (like any other American citizen) has the right to refuse based on his religious believes.

    You may not like it, however that does not make it illegal.
    I agree that in a capitalist system, like USA, one should not be able to force people to provide a service if they do not want to sell it.

    My comment referred to UK, where one has in a way already paid, and the doctor would therefore be refusing to provide a service already purchased, which is a form of breaking a contract.

    Surur
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger View Post
    Why should a physician not use his ethics/religious background in making decisions? Every one of us uses our background in many of the decisions we make. I am very sure you do and I definitely do.

    Ben
    Being a professional means being able to separate your professional from your personal opinions. Its like that in all walks of life.

    Surur
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    I agree that in a capitalist system, like USA, one should not be able to force people to provide a service if they do not want to sell it.

    My comment referred to UK, where one has in a way already paid, and the doctor would therefore be refusing to provide a service already purchased, which is a form of breaking a contract.

    Surur
    Sorry, I stand corrected once again

    However, I do not believe your contract analysis is correct; the socialist system purchases you access to care, is the doctor's medical criteria that decides which and when to perform a particular procedure.

    BTW: I am only talking about procedures in general and not about abortion, I don't know how provision of abortion services operate under such systems.
    Have a great one...Doc D.

    Phillips VELO > Palm III > Palm V > Palm 505m > Treo 180 > Treo 300 > Samsung i500 > Treo 700p > HTC 6800 > Treo 800w > Treo Pro > Palm Pre > HTC Evo
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by TreoNewt View Post
    Sorry, I stand corrected once again

    However, I do not believe your contract analysis is correct; the socialist system purchases you access to care, is the doctor's medical criteria that decides which and when to perform a particular procedure.

    BTW: I am only talking about procedures in general and not about abortion, I don't know how provision of abortion services operate under such systems.
    As long as its medical criteria, and not if you are a single mother or gay etc. As a practical non-abortion procedure, suppose you need a total hip replacement, and you find you are not being prioritized because you are gay and your GP thinks your pain is God's judgment on you. In USA you would go to another doctor, in UK you would complain to the Health Authority.

    Surur
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    As long as its medical criteria, and not if you are a single mother or gay etc.

    Surur
    As I stated earlier, barring any form of discrimination we have a right to refuse.

    And if your argument is that discrimination is factored in decision to refuse service by some USA physicians, I will be the first to agree with that as I have observed this personaly more than once.
    Have a great one...Doc D.

    Phillips VELO > Palm III > Palm V > Palm 505m > Treo 180 > Treo 300 > Samsung i500 > Treo 700p > HTC 6800 > Treo 800w > Treo Pro > Palm Pre > HTC Evo
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by TreoNewt View Post
    As I stated earlier, barring any form of discrimination we have a right to refuse.

    And if your argument is that discrimination is factored in decision to refuse service by some USA physicians, I will be the first to agree with that as I have observed this personaly more than once.
    I do not have experience with the American health care system, and besides being expensive I have not heard anything (too) bad about it. I can only talk from a UK perspective on this.

    Surur
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