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  1.    #1  
  2. #2  
    We hit record lows. In fact, at times "global warming" sounded nice...
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by copernicus View Post
    Link no longer working (edit: now working). . .. . . but let me say this:

    Global warming is just as real as my beloved Treo 900P (Palm/LinuxOS)

  4. ktm97's Avatar
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    #4  
    Perry...by the time your 900p comes out we will be back into global cooling, just like they warned us about in the 70's
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by sxtg View Post
    We hit record lows. In fact, at times "global warming" sounded nice...
    LOL, personal anecdotes always trump hard science!
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by ktm97 View Post
    Perry...by the time your 900p comes out we will be back into global cooling, just like they warned us about in the 70's
    Ah ha! You are on the "It's Real" side of the fence. . . .
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by Perry Holden View Post
    Ah ha! You are on the "It's Real" side of the fence. . . .
    Yes, its easy to spot, its the side with almost all of the scientists.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by cellmatrix View Post
    Yes, its easy to spot, its the side with almost all of the scientists.

    WOW, all those scientists believe in the 900P?
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by cellmatrix View Post
    Yes, its easy to spot, its the side with almost all of the scientists.

    An interesting read when it comes to long range weather predictions: A Woman With Corns versus Scientists
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by cellmatrix View Post
    LOL, personal anecdotes always trump hard science!
    No joke!! Half the palm trees in the county didn't survive the winter. I think I heard the last time it was that cold was in the 50's
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by Perry Holden View Post
    WOW, all those scientists believe in the 900P?
  12. #12  
    Just for kicks

    Another Ice Age?
    Monday, Jun. 24, 1974


    In Africa, drought continues for the sixth consecutive year, adding terribly to the toll of famine victims. During 1972 record rains in parts of the U.S., Pakistan and Japan caused some of the worst flooding in centuries. In Canada's wheat belt, a particularly chilly and rainy spring has delayed planting and may well bring a disappointingly small harvest. Rainy Britain, on the other hand, has suffered from uncharacteristic dry spells the past few springs. A series of unusually cold winters has gripped the American Far West, while New England and northern Europe have recently experienced the mildest winters within anyone's recollection.

    As they review the bizarre and unpredictable weather pattern of the past several years, a growing number of scientists are beginning to suspect that many seemingly contradictory meteorological fluctuations are actually part of a global climatic upheaval. However widely the weather varies from place to place and time to time, when meteorologists take an average of temperatures around the globe they find that the atmosphere has been growing gradually cooler for the past three decades. The trend shows no indication of reversing. Climatological Cassandras are becoming increasingly apprehensive, for the weather aberrations they are studying may be the harbinger of another ice age.
    ...

    Man, too, may be somewhat responsible for the cooling trend. The University of Wisconsin's Reid A. Bryson and other climatologists suggest that dust and other particles released into the atmosphere as a result of farming and fuel burning may be blocking more and more sunlight from reaching and heating the surface of the earth.
    http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...4914-2,00.html

    Alaska Science Forum
    November 5, 1982

    Are We Heading for Another Ice Age?

    ...We now know, of course, that there was an ice age, but that all life was not destroyed. As a matter of act, there have been several ice ages. A century of research since Agassiz' death in 1873 has established that during the last million years, there have been at least four, and perhaps as many as ten periodic invasions of ice around the world. The last of these, known as the Great Ice Age, began about 70,000 years ago, peaked at about 20,000 years ago, and ended 8,000 years ago when the glaciers shrunk to approximately their present-day limits.

    Since the Great Ice Age ended, there have been intermittent periods of glacial expansion. The most recent of these began in the 15th Century. Because the glaciers had appeared stable for many years, Europeans felt safe in building their homes near the edges of the ice, only to have then bulldozed under when the glaciers began a sudden advance. Over the next 450 years, until the mid-1800s, the cold was so severe and the glacial expansion so pronounced that the period is sometimes called the Little Ice Age.

    Since 1850, we seem to be in a period of glacial retreat coinciding with a worldwide increase of about 1°F in mean temperature. Beginning in the 1940s, however, glaciologists have noted a widespread slowdown in glacial retreat and numerous examples of expansion.

    In Alaska, although 63 percent of the 200 glaciers measured were retreating, seven percent were advancing and 30 percent were holding their own.

    While many scientists believe that the future holds another ice age, most agree that the present interglacial period will last for at least another 2,500 years.
    http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF5/574.html

    Greenhouse effect is a myth, say scientists

    Their argument will be outlined on Channel 4 this Thursday in a programme called The Great Global Warming Swindle raising major questions about some of the evidence used for global warming.

    Ice core samples from Antarctica have been used as proof of how warming over the centuries has been accompanied by raised CO2 levels.

    But Professor Ian Clark, an expert in palaeoclimatology from the University of Ottawa, claims that warmer periods of the Earth's history came around 800 years before rises in carbon dioxide levels.

    The programme also highlights how, after the Second World War, there was a huge surge in carbon dioxide emissions, yet global temperatures fell for four decades after 1940.

    The UN report by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change was published in February. At the time it was promoted as being backed by more than 2,000 of the world's leading scientists.

    But Professor Paul Reiter, of the Pasteur Institute in Paris, said it was a "sham" given that this list included the names of scientists who disagreed with its findings.

    Professor Reiter, an expert in malaria, said his name was removed from an assessment only when he threatened legal action against the panel.

    "That is how they make it seem that all the top scientists are agreed," he said. "It's not true."

    Gary Calder, a former editor of New Scientist, claims clouds and solar activity are the real reason behind climate change.

    "The government's chief scientific adviser Sir David King is supposed to be the representative of all that is good in British science, so it is disturbing he and the government are ignoring a raft of evidence against the greenhouse effect being the main driver against climate change," he said.

    Philip Stott, emeritus professor of biogeography at the School of Oriental and African Studies in London, said climate change is too complicated to be caused by just one factor, whether CO2 or clouds.

    He said: "The system is too complex to say exactly what the effect of cutting back on CO2 production would be or indeed of continuing to produce CO2.

    "It is ridiculous to see politicians arguing over whether they will allow the global temperature to rise by 2c or 3c."
    story

    During the past 2 years, more than 17,100 basic and applied American scientists, two-thirds with advanced degrees, have signed the Global Warming Petition.

    Signers of this petition so far include 2,660 physicists, geophysicists, climatologists, meteorologists, oceanographers, and environmental scientists (select this link for a listing of these individuals) who are especially well qualified to evaluate the effects of carbon dioxide on the Earth's atmosphere and climate.

    Signers of this petition also include 5,017 scientists whose fields of specialization in chemistry, biochemistry, biology, and other life sciences (select this link for a listing of these individuals) make them especially well qualified to evaluate the effects of carbon dioxide upon the Earth's plant and animal life.

    Nearly all of the initial 17,100 scientist signers have technical training suitable for the evaluation of the relevant research data, and many are trained in related fields. In addition to these 17,100, approximately 2,400 individuals have signed the petition who are trained in fields other than science or whose field of specialization was not specified on their returned petition.

    Of the 19,700 signatures that the project has received in total so far, 17,800 have been independently verified and the other 1,900 have not yet been independently verified. Of those signers holding the degree of PhD, 95% have now been independently verified. One name that was sent in by enviro pranksters, Geri Halliwell, PhD, has been eliminated. Several names, such as Perry Mason and Robert Byrd are still on the list even though enviro press reports have ridiculed their identity with the names of famous personalities. They are actual signers. Perry Mason, for example, is a PhD Chemist.
    http://www.oism.org/pproject/s33p357.htm
    Last edited by hoovs; 03/17/2007 at 02:24 AM.
  13. #13  
    Entertaining reading from 25 to 30 years ago, thanks. I enjoy reading history, and of course that is what this is.

    Its always fun to go back to before the science of a particular area was fully developed and read about what people were saying.

    A classic example is 50 or so years ago, when there were still people around who would make long arguments about how they thought tobacco was not harmful.
    Last edited by cellmatrix; 03/17/2007 at 12:11 PM.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by sxtg View Post
    No joke!! Half the palm trees in the county didn't survive the winter. I think I heard the last time it was that cold was in the 50's
    I guess it must be frustrating that you have a cold winter in your county, when the rest of the world is having a record warm year. I hope its getting better now, what county do you live in?
  15. #15  
    And history continues being made, moment by moment.

    "Its always fun to go back to before the science of a particular area was fully developed and read about what people were saying."

    So, now the science is fully developed?

    Also, I think it was more than one county that you cannot include with the rest of the warming world.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by sblanter View Post
    And history continues being made, moment by moment.

    "Its always fun to go back to before the science of a particular area was fully developed and read about what people were saying."

    So, now the science is fully developed?

    Also, I think it was more than one county that you cannot include with the rest of the warming world.
    My points are simply that climate science has developed signifcantly concerning global warming and man's role in it, the world is at record high temps and with all of this, it must be truly frustrating to have a cold winter in your particular county.
  17.    #17  
    I'm more inclined to believe that there is a problem. However, in line with the direction that this thread has taken is the following article I saw a few days ago:

    "Hollywood has a thing for Al Gore and his three-alarm film on global warming, "An Inconvenient Truth," which won an Academy Award for best documentary. So do many environmentalists, who praise him as a visionary, and many scientists, who laud him for raising public awareness of climate change.

    But part of his scientific audience is uneasy. In talks, articles and blog entries that have appeared since his film and accompanying book came out last year, these scientists argue that some of Gore's central points are exaggerated or erroneous. They are alarmed, some say, at what they call his alarmism.

    "I don't want to pick on Al Gore," Don Easterbrook, an emeritus professor of geology at Western Washington University, told hundreds of experts at the annual meeting of the Geological Society of America. "But there are a lot of inaccuracies in the statements we are seeing, and we have to temper that with real data."

    Gore, in an e-mail exchange about the critics, said his work made "the most important and salient points" about climate change, if not "some nuances and distinctions" scientists might want. "The degree of scientific consensus on global warming has never been stronger," he said, adding, "I am trying to communicate the essence of it in the lay language that I understand."

    Although Gore is not a scientist, he does rely heavily on the authority of science in "An Inconvenient Truth," which is why scientists are sensitive to its details and claims. Criticisms of Gore have come not only from conservative groups and prominent skeptics of catastrophic warming, but also from rank-and-file scientists like Easterbook, who told his peers that he had no political ax to grind. A few see natural variation as more central to global warming than heat-trapping gases. Many appear to occupy a middle ground in the climate debate, seeing human activity as a serious threat but challenging what they call the extremism of both skeptics and zealots.

    Typically, the concern is not over the existence of climate change, or the idea that the human production of heat-trapping gases is partly or largely to blame for the globe's recent warming. The question is whether Gore has gone beyond the scientific evidence..."


    Complete article
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by copernicus View Post
    Typically, the concern is not over the existence of climate change, or the idea that the human production of heat-trapping gases is partly or largely to blame for the globe's recent warming. The question is whether Gore has gone beyond the scientific evidence..."
    Complete article
    I agree, global warming and man's contribution to it are not disputed by the scientific community, but some of Gore's overreaching comments are.
  19.    #19  
    That's a good sentence. I believe there is mention that he (Gore) has modified his slide show to some extent.
  20. #20  
    Meet Hoovs, the stick-in-the-mud conservative. Who cares about the present and the future, when you can live in the past?
    “Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.” (Philip K. ****)
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