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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    they said they were moving troops to Baghdad to avoid civil war

    but this is great, 3 and a half years in to this mess, we've gone from

    "the smoking gun could be in the form of a mushroom cloud", to

    "they will greet us as liberators and throw flowers at our feet", to

    "mission accomplished", and now to

    "well the generals did not "technically" say this is a civil war yet",

    with a straight face, all without missing a beat
    \

    Here's news...it's a war. Wars are notoriously unpredictable. The term "fog of war" is very descriptive.

    The argument boils down to, "Was it worth it?" It will be the better part of a generation before we find out.

    If only liberals had the same patience with this war as they had with the "War on Poverty".
  2. NRG
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    #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    \

    Here's news...it's a war. Wars are notoriously unpredictable. The term "fog of war" is very descriptive.

    The argument boils down to, "Was it worth it?" It will be the better part of a generation before we find out.

    If only liberals had the same patience with this war as they had with the "War on Poverty".
    What more patience you want? The American people were NOT told it would take a decade or more, and they won't stand for it either. You should know that. Add on to the top of it that we cannot afford this war, this is not a game we are playing here.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    If only liberals had the same patience with this war as they had with the "War on Poverty".
    Or the war on drugs. We know hoe that's going.

    War on terrorism.. terrorism is a tactic. How do you defeat a tactic?
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  4. NRG
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    #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74

    "well the generals did not "technically" say this is a civil war yet",

    with a straight face, all without missing a beat
    I disagree, there was a pretty long stall for Pace, here is the video:

    http://www.crooksandliars.com/posts/...-whack-a-mole/
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by aprasad
    Or the war on drugs. We know hoe that's going.

    War on terrorism.. terrorism is a tactic. How do you defeat a tactic?
    You kill the practitioners of that tactic and convince others not to go down that road.

    I do see a day where we'll be negotiating...but not for a while and not until after a whole lot more killing.
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    \

    Here's news...it's a war. Wars are notoriously unpredictable. The term "fog of war" is very descriptive.

    The argument boils down to, "Was it worth it?" It will be the better part of a generation before we find out.

    If only liberals had the same patience with this war as they had with the "War on Poverty".
    is there a red line -- any red line -- beyond which you will say this is a toilet from hell, I want no more american treasure spent on this, no more american broken bodies, no more american deaths ??

    Is there ANY development that will overwhelm even your patience for this war, your confidence in its desirability and correctness ??
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    What more patience you want? The American people were NOT told it would take a decade or more, and they won't stand for it either. You should know that. Add on to the top of it that we cannot afford this war, this is not a game we are playing here.

    What we can't afford is to lose.

    The game that is being played here is by politicians on the left. How much aid and comfort do you suppose they've given the enemy with their traitorous statements?
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    You kill the practitioners of that tactic and convince others not to go down that road.

    I do see a day where we'll be negotiating...but not for a while and not until after a whole lot more killing.
    How do you plan to kill EVERY islamic fundamentalist who can blow up a car, building or a bomb, or him/herself? Maybe here, maybe in a friendly country?

    After you have killed off all (known) individuals, how can we be sure no one else will adopt this tactic (terrorism)?
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  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    is there a red line -- any red line -- beyond which you will say this is a toilet from hell, I want no more american treasure spent on this, no more american broken bodies, no more american deaths ??

    Is there ANY development that will overwhelm even your patience for this war, your confidence in its desirability and correctness ??
    Well, I'm going on the 18th of September. That is my level of commitment.

    As far as numbers, well, let's see. We lost 400,000 KIA in WWII. Many times that in the Civil War.

    And what is your tolerance point? Not to start...but when to fight? I have my suspicions, but would like to hear it from you.
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by aprasad
    How do you plan to kill EVERY islamic fundamentalist who can blow up a car, building or a bomb, or him/herself? Maybe here, maybe in a friendly country?

    After you have killed off all (known) individuals, how can we be sure no one else will adopt this tactic (terrorism)?
    You have to kill enough to convince the others that it isn't an effective tactic. You DID see where I wrote about negotiation, didn't you?
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by aprasad
    How do you plan to kill EVERY islamic fundamentalist who can blow up a car, building or a bomb, or him/herself? Maybe here, maybe in a friendly country?

    After you have killed off all (known) individuals, how can we be sure no one else will adopt this tactic (terrorism)?
    And what would YOU be doing right now if you were the commander in chief?
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    You kill the practitioners of that tactic and convince others not to go down that road.

    I do see a day where we'll be negotiating...but not for a while and not until after a whole lot more killing.
    A followup question:

    Can you cite an example whre this approach has worked?

    My idea: Isolate the individuals, infiltrate the organizations, get the locals to turn them in instead of harboring them.
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  13.    #73  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    You kill the practitioners of that tactic...
    Unless they happen to be white, american, christian, be engaged in "collateral damage", be an elected president carrying out an "act of war", or otherwise be on our side in some way, or not fit in to our immediate agenda.
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by aprasad
    A followup question:

    Can you cite an example whre this approach has worked?

    My idea: Isolate the individuals, infiltrate the organizations, get the locals to turn them in instead of harboring them.
    Are you familiar with The Troubles? How do you think WWI ended? Have you read about the British COIN effort in Maylaysia?

    OK...that is a good tactic. Guess what...we're doing that. Along with the force on the ground there is an intelligence war that is going on every day. I am surprised the NYT hasn't leaked it yet.
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    Unless they happen to be white, american, christian, be engaged in "collateral damage", be an elected president carrying out an "act of war", or otherwise be on our side in some way, or not fit in to our immediate agenda.
    More mindless hatred.
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by aprasad
    How do you plan to kill EVERY islamic fundamentalist who can blow up a car, building or a bomb, or him/herself? Maybe here, maybe in a friendly country?

    After you have killed off all (known) individuals, how can we be sure no one else will adopt this tactic (terrorism)?
    And killing the father or brother of an islamic fundamentalist would serve as a deterrent for him to commit said tactic?

    I suppose we would have to kill every last one.

    Wonder how we will be able to tell which ones to kill?
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    Well, I'm going on the 18th of September. That is my level of commitment.

    As far as numbers, well, let's see. We lost 400,000 KIA in WWII. Many times that in the Civil War.

    And what is your tolerance point? Not to start...but when to fight? I have my suspicions, but would like to hear it from you.
    and you know you have my respect for that.

    I never would have gone there -- I would never have destroyed the world wide support our country had after 9/11 -- I would never have jumped with blissful ignorance into the tarpit of iraq. Like millions of others I pleaded with the empty headed zeolots who have run this nation the last 6 years to not make that colossal blunder.

    (FWIW, after junior was selected by the Supremes, I wandered down to Pa. Ave in front of the WH to meditate to myself about what horrors awaited. One of the things I was certain would happen was that junior would stop at nothing to topple Sadamm -- to finish the job he thought of his daddy as having blown.)
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  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by AsifIqbal
    And killing the father or brother of an islamic fundamentalist would serve as a deterrent for him to commit said tactic?

    I suppose we would have to kill every last one.

    Wonder how we will be able to tell which ones to kill?

    What is your alternative? How do you negotiate with practitioners of an idealogy that want to see you dead?
  19. #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by 1911sforever
    What is your alternative? How do you negotiate with practitioners of an idealogy that want to see you dead?
    Sounds like you want to see them dead too.
  20. #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    and you know you have my respect for that.

    I never would have gone there -- I would never have destroyed the world wide support our country had after 9/11 -- I would never have jumped with blissful ignorance into the tarpit of iraq. Like millions of others I pleaded with the empty headed zeolots who have run this nation the last 6 years to not make that colossal blunder.

    (FWIW, after junior was selected by the Supremes, I wandered down to Pa. Ave in front of the WH to meditate to myself about what horrors awaited. One of the things I was certain would happen was that junior would stop at nothing to topple Sadamm -- to finish the job he thought of his daddy as having blown.)
    Yes. World wide support. How laughable. How lip bitingly Clintonesque. Tears for us while their hands were in Saddam's pocket.

    Your hatred of Bush blinds you to the threat. Joe Lieberman sees it, and the extremes are pushing him out.
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