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  1. #901  
    blaze, better keep your mouth shut if you wish to be able to compare notes after that walk.
  2. NRG
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    #902  
    Quote Originally Posted by TomUps
    Please dont tell me your quoting an arab dictator as proof that "you cant beat terrorism militarly". Just priceless.

    You do realize this is one of our closest allies in the middle east?
  3. #903  
    Quote Originally Posted by sblanter
    blaze, better keep your mouth shut if you wish to be able to compare notes after that walk.
    Better be bullet proof if you want to make the walk now.
  4. #904  
    I'm having a difficult time understanding exactly what the thread of this conversation is -- besides sniping, I mean.

    relax, hey?
  5. #905  
    U.S., France Agree on Draft Cease-Fire Resolution to End Mideast Violence
    Saturday, August 05, 2006



    UNITED NATIONS — The United States and France agreed Saturday on a draft U.N. Security Council resolution that calls for a "full cessation" of fighting between Israel and Lebanese Hezbollah guerrillas, but would allow Israel to defend itself if attacked.

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    That language is a major victory for Israel, which has insisted it must have the right to respond if Hezbollah launches missiles against it. France and many other nations had demanded an immediate halt to the fighting without conditions as a way to push the region back toward stability.

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    The full 15-nation Security Council was to meet later Saturday to discuss the resolution, and it was likely to be adopted in the next couple of days, Bolton said.

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    The resolution would call for the current U.N. force in Lebanon, known by its acronym UNIFIL, to monitor the cessation in fighting. Once Israel and Lebanon have agreed to a series of steps also spelled out in the resolution for a long-term solution, the Security Council would then authorize a new peacekeeping force for the region.

    It would "support the Lebanese armed forces and government in providing a secure environment and contribute to the implementation of a permanent cease-fire and a long-term solution."

    That element was a victory for France. The U.S. and Israel had earlier insisted that there would be no deal without the immediate deployment of a new force, separate from UNIFIL.

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    Any deal would have to gain the acceptance of both Israel and Hezbollah, which could prove difficult.

    Israel says it wants to continue fighting for up to two weeks to seriously diminish Hezbollah's military capability; Hezbollah's chief spokesman said Thursday the militia will not agree to a cease-fire until all Israeli troops leave Lebanon.

    FULL STORY: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,207168,00.html
  6. TomUps's Avatar
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    #906  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    You do realize this is one of our closest allies in the middle east?
    Yep, and we were allies with stalin during WW2. Didnt change the fact that he was a ruthless dictator.
  7. TomUps's Avatar
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    #907  
    Quote Originally Posted by AsifIqbal
    Quoting an arab dictator is ...... "Just priceless"?
    Um, isnt that what I said? Actually if you read exactly what I posted, I said "Please dont tell me your quoting an arab dictator as proof that "you cant beat terrorism militarly".
    Last edited by TomUps; 08/05/2006 at 03:11 PM.
  8. #908  
    Quote Originally Posted by septimus
    I'm having a difficult time understanding exactly what the thread of this conversation is -- besides sniping, I mean.

    relax, hey?
    I think this thread has fulfilled its premise that nothing is accomplished by personal attacks or disrespect. But we're only humans, I guess.
    (Did I hear the fat lady is done practicing?)
  9. #909  
    Some of the latest developments.....



    KFAR GILADI, Israel - A defiant Hezbollah pounded northern Israel with rockets Sunday after rejecting a U.S.-French truce proposal, killing at least 15 people. Israel also struck hard, killing at least 14 in Lebanon as both sides tried to take advantage of the days before a U.N. resolution is put to a vote.

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    Hezbollah and its chief allies, Iran and Syria, rejected the draft resolution because it does not call for an immediate Israeli withdrawal from Lebanon and does not address other Lebanese demands.

    Mohammed Fneish, one of two Hezbollah members of the Lebanese Cabinet, said Saturday the militant group would not abide by a cease-fire resolution while Israeli troops remain on Lebanese territory.

    Some 10,000 Israeli soldiers are fighting several hundred Hezbollah gunmen in that area, trying to track and destroy rocket launchers. Israel says it won’t leave until a multinational force has been deployed.

    Israel has refused to comment on the draft. But Foreign Ministry spokesman Mark Regev told Associated Press Television News, “We have to make sure that what will be negotiated at the United Nations ensures that Hezbollah will not be allowed to be resupplied by Iran or Syria.”

    FULL STORY: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14196226
  10. NRG
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    #910  
    Galloway slams Sky News' (Fox News in UK) talking head. Now I disagree w/ his views, but damn that is a way to slap around bias questioning.


    Source: Sky News <--Click for video.

    Galloway: 'The Violence Will Go On'
    George Galloway has spoken out in support of Lebanon, saying he believes Hizbollah is justified in attacking Israel. The Respect MP also lambasted media coverage of the war and said the UN resolution means nothing.
  11. #911  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    Galloway slams Sky News' (Fox News in UK) talking head. Now I disagree w/ his views, but damn that is a way to slap around bias questioning.
    I enjoy galloway too. It's fun to see people get their comeuppance sometimes, even if it has to come from a nut like him.
  12. #912  
    Nut is one thing, a preposterously inaccurate gabber is another.
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    #913  
    Quote Originally Posted by septimus
    I enjoy galloway too. It's fun to see people get their comeuppance sometimes, even if it has to come from a nut like him.
    My goodness, this guy is a madman. For a second, I thought this was a skit from SNL.
  14. NRG
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    #914  
    Quote Originally Posted by TomUps
    My goodness, this guy is a madman. For a second, I thought this was a skit from SNL.
    You don't remember him slapping around Duncan Hunter?

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    #915  
    Quote Originally Posted by NRG
    You don't remember him slapping around Duncan Hunter?

    Yeah, this confirms it, hes a madman. I love when he makes the claim the US is responsible for millions of Iraqi childrens deaths because of the UN sanctions (how many billions was Saddam pocketing during this time period). Funny stuff.
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    #916  
    anybody that doesnt think hes a crazy man, just view this video. I love when he claimed ordinary Iraqis didnt hate Saddam. Lets ask the Shiites how much they liked Saddam.

  17. NRG
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    #917  
    Quote Originally Posted by TomUps
    Yeah, this confirms it, hes a madman. I love when he makes the claim the US is responsible for millions of Iraqi childrens deaths because of the UN sanctions (how many billions was Saddam pocketing during this time period). Funny stuff.
    He was probably refering to this. Even still I think his numbers are a little off.


    Source: GlobalPolicy.org

    Chapter 5. Section 7: Deaths

    None deny that Iraq sanctions have caused many deaths, but a debate has raged over how many. The larger the number, the greater the burden on sanction advocates to justify their actions. Unfortunately, wrangling over numbers obscures the unavoidable reality: a tragically large humanitarian disaster.

    The measurement of deaths rests on the concept of “excess” mortality – those deaths that exceed the mortality rate in the previous, pre-sanctions period or that exceed a projection of the earlier trend towards further gains. The previous mortality rate is well-established, but two arguments arise – first, what is the present mortality rate (which, some argue, may be distorted by false Iraq government statistics) and second, what is the cause of such mortality increase. Neither of these questions has a simple answer. Not surprisingly, the government of Iraq claims a very large increase and blames most of its child mortality on sanctions. UNICEF, in a widely-publicised study carried out jointly with the Iraq Ministry of Health, determined that 500,000 children under five years old had died in “excess” numbers in Iraq between 1991 and 1998, though UNICEF insisted that this number could not all be ascribed directly to sanctions. (119) UNICEF used surveys of its own as part of the basic research and involved respected outside experts in designing the study and evaluating the data. UNICEF remains confident in the accuracy of its numbers and points out that they have never been subject to a scientific challenge.

    Prof. Richard Garfield of Columbia University carried out a separate and well-regarded study of excess mortality in Iraq. Garfield considered the same age group and the same time period as the UNICEF study. (120) He minimized reliance on official Iraqi statistics by using many different statistical sources, including independent surveys in Iraq and inferences from comparative public health data from other countries. Garfield concluded that there had been a minimum of 100,000 excess deaths and that the more likely number was 227,000. He compared this estimate to a maximum estimate of 66,663 civilian and military deaths during the Gulf War. Garfield now thinks the most probable number of deaths of under-five children from August 1991 to June 2002 would be about 400,000. (121)

    There are no reliable estimates of the total number of excess deaths in Iraq beyond the under-five population. Even with conservative assumptions, though, the total of all excess deaths must be far above 400,000.

    All of these excess deaths should not be ascribed to sanctions. Some may be due to a variety of other causes. But all major studies make it clear that sanctions have been the primary cause, because of the sanctions’ impact on food, medical care, water, and other health-related factors. Though oil-for-food has changed the situation studied by UNICEF and Garfield, resulting in less malnutrition, recent field reports suggest that infant mortality remains high, due to water-borne disease. (122) The mortality rate for under-five children has probably not continued to rise since the 1999 studies, but the rate apparently remains very much higher than that reported in Iraq before 1990.

    In the face of such powerful evidence, the US and UK governments have sometimes practiced bold denial. Brian Wilson, Minister of State at the UK Foreign Office told a BBC interviewer on February 26, 2001 “There is no evidence that sanctions are hurting the Iraqi people.” When denial has proved impossible, officials have occasionally fallen back on astonishingly callous affirmations. In a famous interview with Madeleine Albright, then US representative at the United Nations, Leslie Stahl of the television show 60 Minutes said: “We have heard that half a million children have died . . . is the price worth it? Albright replied, “I think this is a very hard choice, but the price – we think the price is worth it.” (123)

    Six years after Albright’s statement and twelve years after Security Council Resolution 661, comprehensive economic sanctions continue to impose on Iraq a very high number of deaths of young children, as measured by careful and well-regarded estimates. Combined with the deaths of older children and adults, this adds up to a great and unjustifiable humanitarian tragedy.
  18. NRG
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    #918  
    Live feed of UN Security Council.

    http://www.un.org/webcast/index.asp
  19. NRG
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    #919  
    _

    IDF warns UN troops will be attacked if they repair bridges

    Source: Guardian

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/syria/stor...839443,00.html

    Lebanese officials said there were many reports of other casualties throughout southern Lebanon but rescue workers were not able to reach the sites because of continued Israeli airstrikes. Israel also threatened to attack UN peacekeepers if they attempted to repair bomb-damaged bridges in southern Lebanon. UN officials contacted the Israeli army to inform them that a team of Chinese military engineers attached to the UN force in Lebanon intended to repair the bridge on the Beirut to Tyre road to enable the transport of humanitarian supplies.

    According to the UN, Israeli officials said the engineers would become a target if they attempted to repair the bridge.

    Senior UN officials reacted angrily to the destruction of a temporary causeway over the Litani river overnight. "We must be able to have movement throughout the country to deliver supplies. At this point we can't do that," said David Shearer, the humanitarian coordinator for Lebanon. "The deliberate targeting of civilian infrastructure is a violation of international law."
  20. #920  
    At least they are getting a heads up....war is an ugly biz....

    sad as this sounds, better this happen now, than is 5 more years...lord knows how much ammo iran would've sent over.

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