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  1.    #1  
    Detainees May Test Reach of Guantánamo Ruling
    By NEIL A. LEWIS




    WASHINGTON, June 30 — Federal courts will soon have to grapple with the reach of the Supreme Court's ruling this week on terror suspects, including whether detainees at Guantánamo Bay and elsewhere may move to assert their rights under the Geneva Conventions, several human rights officials and academics said Friday.

    Nearly all the more than 400 petitions filed by Guantánamo prisoners challenging their detention include a claim that American authorities have violated their rights under what is known as Common Article 3 of the Geneva Conventions, which prohibits torture and cruel, inhumane and degrading treatment.

    In its 5-to-3 ruling on Thursday, the court majority said that Common Article 3 could be invoked by an inmate at Guantánamo to challenge the Bush administration's use of military commissions to try him for war crimes.

    Bill Goodman, the legal director of the Center for Constitutional Rights, a New York group that has coordinated efforts to file motions known as habeas corpus petitions on behalf of most Guantánamo detainees, said the court ruling provided new impetus to challenge the detentions.

    "We think the Supreme Court's statements about the Geneva Conventions revitalizes those petitions," Mr. Goodman said. "It should give them more traction"....
  2. #2  
    I think part of this problem stems from the way we classify the detainees.

    This makes it that much more important for Congress and the President to work together on this issue.
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  3.    #3  
    If "work together on this issue" means work together with the legislature to create a court system which is not under the control of the military and the executive, then I would agree.

    But given that it took a supreme court ruling to remind this administration that they do not have the power to indefinitely imprision even american citizens, I think I may have to see it to believe it.

    And it seems working with this congress, is not proving to be quite as easy for this president as it used to be, and I don't see that changing unless his poll numbers make a turn for the better.
  4. vw2002's Avatar
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    #4  
    it would appear that the ny times desires the release of all enemies of America so that they may return another day to maim and murder us.

    Its apparent that the times also genuinely wants to help al qaeda by revealing to them how America tracks terrorist finances, so that al qaeda may be given a heads up on where they are going wrong. now the terrorists will most likely operate differently, and in so doing, may be more successful in killing people worldwide.

    good work, ny times.

    the next story I expect to hear is how the new york times supports shorter jail sentences for convicted murderers, repeat child molestors, and rapists. I'm sure they'll be demanding that child molesters should be allowed to return to neighborhoods where there are many young children, because child molesters, just like al qaeda, are people too.
    I gotta have more cowbell
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by vw2002
    it would appear that the ny times desires the release of all enemies of America so that they may return another day to maim and murder us.
    Its apparent that the times also genuinely wants to help al qaeda by revealing to them how America tracks terrorist finances, so that al qaeda may be given a heads up on where they are going wrong
    Listening to the republican talking points, are we? Nice of you to mention that the Wall Street Journal and the LA Times reported on the same story on the same day.

    Oh, and your comments have nothing to do with the story posted by the Original Poster, as all media outlets reported on the ruling of the Supreme Court in this matter. Try reading the article next time and do hold back from whatever reflex actions you suffer from when viewing a New York Times Logo.



    Does that frighten you?
  6. vw2002's Avatar
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    #6  
    its the same type of mentality that supports leniency for those who go out and murder innocent people in cold blood, but demand the HARSHEST punishments for law-abiding citizens who kill these types of criminals in self-defense during break-ins.

    its amazing to see how the justice system of america has eroded to an absolute farce. its as if we want to defend the criminals from the cold, cruel world anymore. just amazing.
    Last edited by vw2002; 07/02/2006 at 01:00 AM.
  7. vw2002's Avatar
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    #7  
    ill say whatever I want, g-funkster. does that scare you?
    I gotta have more cowbell
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by vw2002
    ill say whatever I want, g-funkster. does that scare you?
    Yes, it does scare me when people speak the words of others as if they had no mind of their own. But scared of you specifically, nah
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by g-funkster
    Listening to the republican talking points, are we? Nice of you to mention that the Wall Street Journal and the LA Times reported on the same story on the same day.
    Treasury Dept tried for two months to ask the New York Times to not publish the story. Even John Murtha asked them not to publish for fear of damage to national security. After the Times decided to publish, Treasury contacted the Wall Street Journal voluntarily with the story. WSJ wasn't aware that Treasury had asked NYT not to publish. All this according to WSJ Op-Ed:
    Based on his own discussions with Times reporters and editors, Mr. Fratto [Treasury Dept Assistant Secretary for Public Affairs] says he believed "they had about 80% of the story, but they had 30% of it wrong." So the Administration decided that, in the interest of telling a more complete and accurate story, they would declassify a series of talking points about the program.
  10. #10  
    Who in this forum believes the Gitmo residents honored the Geneva Convention rules before their detainment or will honor the Geneva Convention rules after their release from Gitmo.

    Of course this question is for everyone except blaze, daT and g-functster. I already feel fairly certain where the mentioned 3 stand.

    I believe the Gitmo residents never did and will never honor the Geneva Convention when it comes to their prisoners. It is interesting that the Gitmo residents will use the Geneva Convention in their own cases.

    Chuck
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    #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by g-funkster
    Yes, it does scare me when people speak the words of others as if they had no mind of their own. But scared of you specifically, nah
    so let me get this straight. if someone doesnt share your views, then by definition, they must simply be regurgitating the words of someone else, is that it?
    so you know for a FACT that the words i typed above were not my own thoughts? wow, do you claim to read palms, too?

    individuals with "minds of their own" shouldnt presume to know where others get their opinions. doing so is a sign of either a simplistic or delusional way of thinking, unless you are psychic. are you psychic, g-funk? if not, well you know where that leaves you....
    Last edited by vw2002; 07/02/2006 at 01:41 AM.
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    #12  
    well-said, chckhbrt. you've just hit upon the crux of this whole issue.
    I gotta have more cowbell
  13. #13  
    chckhbrt:

    Who in this forum believes the Gitmo residents honored the Geneva Convention rules before their detainment or will honor the Geneva Convention rules after their release from Gitmo.

    I don't think they will likely honor the Geneva Convention but is the point your making that we should only follow it if our enemy does?

    If that is your point then I disagree. The US is the example of democracy. Hence we need to set the example.
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  14. vw2002's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    chckhbrt:

    Who in this forum believes the Gitmo residents honored the Geneva Convention rules before their detainment or will honor the Geneva Convention rules after their release from Gitmo.

    I don't think they will likely honor the Geneva Convention but is the point your making that we should only follow it if our enemy does?

    If that is your point then I disagree. The US is the example of democracy. Hence we need to set the example.
    democracy for law-abiding citizens and for crimes unrelated to global terrorism? yes, absolutely, without question.

    democracy for terrorists, who seek to attack civilization on a large scale and bring war to us on our lands and abroad? absolutely not. no way in hell
    Last edited by vw2002; 07/02/2006 at 01:42 AM.
  15.    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim
    Treasury Dept tried for two months to ask the New York Times to not publish the story. Even John Murtha asked them not to publish for fear of damage to national security. After the Times decided to publish, Treasury contacted the Wall Street Journal voluntarily with the story. WSJ wasn't aware that Treasury had asked NYT not to publish. All this according to WSJ Op-Ed:
    If you mean by this post that the NY Times refrained from publishing this story for 2 months while giving the administration time to make thier case, then I agree.

    But that would be for another thread wouldn't it.
  16.    #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    I don't think they will likely honor the Geneva Convention but is the point your making that we should only follow it if our enemy does?

    If that is your point then I disagree. The US is the example of democracy. Hence we need to set the example.
    The Japaneese put our boys to work in caves, and fed them sewer water, we gave their prisoners a soft bed and a chocolate bar.

    I guess that means Rosevelt, MacArthur, and our armed forces were Freedom Haters too.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by vw2002
    well-said, chckhbrt. you've just hit upon the crux of this whole issue.
    I don't understand how this could be the 'crux' of anything, anymore. I keep hearing things like this from the right, for example, how Al Qaeda doesn't apply to Geneva because they don't wear uniforms and specific language in the Convention mentions the word 'uniform', lol. Nevermind that this is Still being said after the decision, which held that "Common Article 3 of Geneva applies as a matter of treaty obligation to the conflict against Al Qaeda"

    The Geneva Convention, more importantly, is a treaty we made with the rest of the world, and we hold ourselves accountable to that in the face of others.
  18. #18  
    Prisoners challenge their detention??? WOW! There's a new one.
  19.    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    Prisoners challenge their detention??? WOW! There's a new one.
    Agreed. In this administration it is.

    By the way, welcome back, glad to see you are finished boycotting the unfair liberal TC discrimination.
  20. #20  
    Did you miss all of my other posts? Just because I haven't been responding to your flame-bait doesn't mean I'm boycotting anything.
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