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  1. #21  
    I have never been a fan of conspiracy theories, I have always subscribed to the idea that it is difficult to impossible to keep secrets in Washington. It's one of the things I love about America most.

    That being said, I don't like the changes this administration has made to the Supreme Court, or the direction some of their newest rulings seem to be headed.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    I don't like the changes this administration has made to the Supreme Court, or the direction some of their newest rulings seem to be headed.
    I may have to dig out my history books, but how does this compare to past changes? I mean, in retrospect, I don't think you'll find a single reasonable person today who believes the civil rights movement / legislation / the 24th amendement was a bad idea. However, at the time, there were a ton of people who were actively fighting the change. Just saying.
  3.    #23  
    Th one person who comes out really bad in this documentary is George Tenet. David Kay says "It was a faustian bargain. He traded integrity for access" or something like that.

    I hope people get to watch this. They interviewed a lot of insiders at the Pentagon, State Dept and CIA.

    This, together with the earlier Frontlines on the execution of war, and "War behind Closed Doors", makes up a great set. As is the show about behind the scenes of the 1st gulf war.
    --
    Aloke
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  4. #24  
    It pretty much says all you need to know about Tenet, and why he would not speak when W pinned that freakin' medal on him near the end of the film. lol
  5. #25  
    I didn't sense even the least bit of bias as they played "evil" music almost every time they showed a picture of the VP. I especially enjoyed the way they focus in on his eyes; as if to imply that they might turn fire red at any moment.

    If I were Cheney, I would distrust the CIA as well being that they missed TONS of important intelligence in the past.

    I did enjoy parts of the program (very well produced), but they did not accurately represent both sides. Its funny how PBS and NPR constantly point out the bias over at FOX News, yet openly and proudly air a one-sided Michael-Moore-like documentary.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by aairman23
    Its funny how PBS and NPR constantly point out the bias over at FOX News
    They do?
    Last edited by theBlaze74; 06/21/2006 at 10:35 PM.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by aairman23
    I didn't sense even the least bit of bias as they played "evil" music almost every time they showed a picture of the VP. I especially enjoyed the way they focus in on his eyes; as if to imply that they might turn fire red at any moment.
    No comments on the substance of the film which came directly from the mouths of the principles themselves? After the entire presentation, your compalint was that they played scary music, and Cheney looked shifty? lol
    Last edited by theBlaze74; 06/21/2006 at 10:36 PM.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by aairman23
    If I were Cheney, I would distrust the CIA as well being that they missed TONS of important intelligence in the past.
    Mistrust would have been fine.

    The problem was that Cheney actually re structured how intelligence is handled, created HIS OWN intelligence gathering inside the military whose stated goal was to find what he wished them to find. Then leaked it to the press at every turn, ignoring Al Quaida in the process.
    Last edited by theBlaze74; 06/21/2006 at 10:37 PM.
  9. #29  
    And if you want to see the leaks from this new "alternate" intelligence gathering. Just click on Hobbes hundreds of postings about how we actually did find WMDs in Iraq, and about Saddam's connections with 9/11.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    They do?
    I highly advise people to listen to WNYC's On the Media. It's a "Meta" journalism show that focuses on the media itself (as you could probably tell from the title). Thats the only show where I've heard people actually tell the truth with regards to media outlets' political leanings. They're not afraid to call Fox News "right" and some other outlets (NYT, I think) "left."

    As for the show itself, they do a phenomenal job of sticking to their mission and staying out of politics. They are at times a little over-zealous with various guests (some of their questions are outright nasty) but they are trying to set a journalism standard, and all in all, I think they do a good job.
  11.    #31  
    I hope everyone knows that WNYC is Public Radio (NPR). :-)

    I agree with the post. I am a big NPR fan.
    --
    Aloke
    Cingular GSM
    Software:Treo650-1.17-CNG
    Firmware:01.51 Hardware:A
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by aprasad
    I hope everyone knows that WNYC is Public Radio (NPR). :-)

    I agree with the post. I am a big NPR fan.
    Yes, I probably should have mentioned that. But for what it's worth, WNYC is an NPR affiliate, meaning they broadcast stuff from NPR in washington. NPR doesn't own them, nor (I think) does it directly influence their other shows like OTM.
  13.    #33  
    Most NPR stations work that way. From WNYC's web site: WNYC is a member station of NPR and PRI.

    The afiliates raise their own $ and pay NPR/PRI for the programming.

    OTM is produced by WNYC and distributed by PRI. I can listen to OTM here in Central Ohio on my local "NPR station".
    --
    Aloke
    Cingular GSM
    Software:Treo650-1.17-CNG
    Firmware:01.51 Hardware:A
  14. #34  
    The bottom line is that PBS has/had an agenda before they even started putting the documentary together. They started from the title (Dark Side) and gathering ONLY the evidence that bolstered their case against Cheney and the Rumsfeld......which is pretty ironic since the entire program was dedicated to accusing the Bush administration of doing the same thing with the Iraq + al-Qaida connection.

    If FOX News channel aired a "documentary" defending Cheney, all of the CNN/PBS junkies on this site would be crawling out of your skin with how biased it was....well thatís how I feel about this documentary. I'm sure there were lots of things that were absolutely true in that program, but without the Bush administrations side of the story, its just a straw-man.
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by aairman23
    I'm sure there were lots of things that were absolutely true in that program, but without the Bush administrations side of the story, its just a straw-man.
    It's television. Unfortunately I think that medium has zero academic value on anything that isn't a 100% consensus.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    And if you want to see the leaks from this new "alternate" intelligence gathering. Just click on Hobbes hundreds of postings about how we actually did find WMDs in Iraq, and about Saddam's connections with 9/11.
    Lets play a game called ignore the news that doesn't fit our political agenda.

    Google News
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by KRamsauer
    It's television. Unfortunately I think that medium has zero academic value on anything that isn't a 100% consensus.


    It seams to me as if most people take anything that is aired on Frontline or NOVA to be flat fact. This is true of most liberals that I have discussions with.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by aairman23
    It seams to me as if most people take anything that is aired on Frontline or NOVA to be flat fact. This is true of most liberals that I have discussions with.
    I bet that 99.9% of the facts that are portrayed are indeed right, but as any editorial writer will tell you, you can make the facts say anything you want.
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by aairman23
    It seams to me as if most people take anything that is aired on Frontline or NOVA to be flat fact. This is true of most liberals that I have discussions with.
    8 posts since 2004.. and you come out of hyper lurk for this?

    http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...d.php?t=118264
  20.    #40  
    Besides, most of the people interviwed were in the Bush administration during the time period covered by the documentary. Even the phrase "dark side" is from a Cheney quote. I'll grant you that the music was ominous at times ...

    Give it a few years after the end of the administration. Frontline will have even current administration employees including Cabinet level.. like when they did the show on the 1st gulf war.
    --
    Aloke
    Cingular GSM
    Software:Treo650-1.17-CNG
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