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  1. #141  
    I stand corrected ....and updated
  2. #142  
    Let me try and understand again. You are saying they have an agenda, and they think killing people is the best way to accomplish this, and that they look for pretexts to kill people. It seems to come to more or less the same conclusion.

    Or are you saying that they kill people very easily, that lives have very little value for them. Well, for some people this is just true.

    Surur
  3. TomUps's Avatar
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    #143  
    All I know is today will be a day long remembered....first Zarqawi, and now top hamas terrorist Abu Samhadana. Hell is alittle fuller tonight.
  4. #144  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Good point, and you are right. For the families of the people he killed this would bring some measure of comfort.
    Not really, they interviewed the brother of ken Bigley and he was dissapointed they bombed him and not arrested him. Now they may never find the body of his brother..


    I'm sure that arresting him would be a lot harder than bombing him, but if they were watching him for 6 hours surely they could have set up an assault team to take him out like they did with saddam..
    He probably was worth more alive than death..

    But either way the world has one less evil man which is a good thing..
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  5. #145  
    Quote Originally Posted by Micael
    Whats important is that his was 'the' face of the insurgency to everyone on all sides, regardless of how many different insurgent groups there may be, how big of a leader he actually was, or whether or not his image was inflated via psyop efforts.

    Without googling, name one other insurgent in Iraq.
    I list several on the first page of this thread. Although I must admit that I had to use the web to get the spellings correct. Granted it is debatable about the contribution to insurgency. Folks like chemical Ali were simply part of the early regime. But in all fairness, the 'face' of insurgency will only come one or two at a time. I think they want us focused on their message, not on single men to hunt down. It's the same for us, most folks over there view GW as the face of occupation. IMHO
  6. #146  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    I'm sure that arresting him would be a lot harder than bombing him, but if they were watching him for 6 hours surely they could have set up an assault team to take him out like they did with saddam..
    He probably was worth more alive than death..

    But either way the world has one less evil man which is a good thing..
    I thought the 'watching him' was done by informants. We didn't have any troops in the immediate vicinity. If we started moving some, I think that would have put Zarqawi on the move. They were even so careful as to have the planes launch their bombs from several miles away so that the sound of jets wouldn't spook him. Personally I think this was much better, why put troops in harms way just to get a guy to a kangaroo court. Anyone know how Sadam's trial is going?
  7.    #147  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    Not really, they interviewed the brother of ken Bigley and he was dissapointed they bombed him and not arrested him. Now they may never find the body of his brother..
    the father of Nik Berg (the man brutally beheaded by zarqawi) is a pacifist, who has expressed his sadness at zarqawi being killed.
    I'm sure that arresting him would be a lot harder than bombing him, but if they were watching him for 6 hours surely they could have set up an assault team to take him out like they did with saddam..

    He probably was worth more alive than death..

    But either way the world has one less evil man which is a good thing..
    I read (NY Times) that an assault team was there, it began to move in, shots were fired from the house -- rather than to have zarqawi again escape (which had happened several times before) they decided to swat him with an F16 -- an already in the air F16, not flying for this purpose specifically
    Last edited by BARYE; 06/09/2006 at 08:46 AM.
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  8. NRG
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    #148  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT

    I'm sure that arresting him would be a lot harder than bombing him, but if they were watching him for 6 hours surely they could have set up an assault team to take him out like they did with saddam..
    He probably was worth more alive than death..

    But either way the world has one less evil man which is a good thing..
    They did not want to give him the the chance to go out in a "blaze of glory" fighting american troops. Kinda limits the martyr factor. At least that is my guess.
  9. #149  
    To borrow from Barye's signature:

    99% of Americans want Zarqawi to leave Iraq -- 98% prefer in a body bag -- (dstrauss)
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
  10.    #150  
    NY Times:
    ..."The entire village was seized," Mr. Ismael said.

    As the American commandos took up positions, Mr. Ismael said, someone from inside the house in the date grove began shooting. The Americans returned fire, Mr. Ismael said, but the firefight did not last long.

    One of the F-16's, now in position over Hibhib, released a laser-guided 500-pound bomb.

    The decision to bomb Mr. Zarqawi was made in large part because military officials feared he might escape again if American and Iraqi forces moved in on the ground, Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld said during an appearance at NATO headquarters in Brussels.

    "They came to the conclusion that they could not really go in on the ground without running the risk of letting him escape," he said. "So they used airpower and attacked a dwelling he was in."...
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  11.    #151  
    Quote Originally Posted by dstrauss
    To borrow from Barye's signature:

    99% of Americans want Zarqawi to leave Iraq -- 98% prefer in a body bag -- (dstrauss)
    many sunnis (not all, for sure) have expressed unhappiness.
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  12. TomUps's Avatar
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    #152  
    Not really, they interviewed the brother of ken Bigley and he was dissapointed they bombed him and not arrested him.
    Are you sure? "My initial thoughts are that the world has rid itself of a very evil person if a person at all. Hes a specimen, thats what he is, Bigley told the AP. I hope they catch the others ASAP.


    Its amazing to me that people sitting in the comforts of their homes thousands of miles away are so anxious to put our troops lives at risk so we could arrest this terrorist instead of killing him. People will complain and second guess anything.
  13. #153  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    NY Times:
    ..."The entire village was seized," Mr. Ismael said.

    As the American commandos took up positions, Mr. Ismael said, someone from inside the house in the date grove began shooting. The Americans returned fire, Mr. Ismael said, but the firefight did not last long.

    One of the F-16's, now in position over Hibhib, released a laser-guided 500-pound bomb.

    The decision to bomb Mr. Zarqawi was made in large part because military officials feared he might escape again if American and Iraqi forces moved in on the ground, Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld said during an appearance at NATO headquarters in Brussels.

    "They came to the conclusion that they could not really go in on the ground without running the risk of letting him escape," he said. "So they used airpower and attacked a dwelling he was in."...
    Interesting on UK TV they said the bomb was satalite guided, a laser guided bomb makes more sense so I tend to believe your story..
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  14. #154  
    Quote Originally Posted by TomUps
    Its amazing to me that people sitting in the comforts of their homes thousands of miles away are so anxious to put our troops lives at risk so we could arrest this terrorist instead of killing him. People will complain and second guess anything.
    Eh excuse me, but isnt fighting the job of the troops?
    And with fighting there is an element of risk.

    So you suggest we bomb the houses of criminals too instead of sending in the police? that will surely limit the risk of police officers..

    Besides that who made the US military judge, jury and executionar?
    And if captured alive he may be of help finding other AQ people.
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  15.    #155  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    Interesting on UK TV they said the bomb was satalite guided, a laser guided bomb makes more sense so I tend to believe your story..
    I heard 2 bombs were dropped -- one of each.
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  16. #156  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE
    I heard 2 bombs were dropped -- one of each.
    2 bombs is correct, I saw the footage, so it could have been one of each..
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  17. TomUps's Avatar
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    #157  
    Eh excuse me, but isnt fighting the job of the troops? And with fighting there is an element of risk.
    This is about the craziest post I have ever read. I guess with your extensive years of military training, urban warfare, and anti-terrorism tactics you have decided from thousands of miles away that would should have conducted the raid differently. GIVE ME A BREAK.


    Besides that who made the US military judge, jury and executionar? And if captured alive he may be of help finding other AQ people.
    Um, last I checked, we are at WAR. We killed the top Al-Qaida leader in Iraq. Who has personally beheaded hostages and is behind the deaths of thousands of people. I for one are glad that we did it and didnt lose one troop. I know you dont care, but Im sure their families do.
  18. #158  
    Quote Originally Posted by TomUps
    This is about the craziest post I have ever read. I guess with your extensive years of military training, urban warfare, and anti-terrorism tactics you have decided from thousands of miles away that would should have conducted the raid differently. GIVE ME A BREAK.
    Maybe you should learn to read what is written instead of what you want to read..
    I said :
    "I'm sure that arresting him would be a lot harder than bombing him, but if they were watching him for 6 hours surely they could have set up an assault team to take him out like they did with saddam.."
    All I was saying I'm dissapointed they didnt arrest him, not judging their tactical decisions, since neither me or you can judge on those..


    Quote Originally Posted by TomUps
    Um, last I checked, we are at WAR. We killed the top Al-Qaida leader in Iraq. Who has personally beheaded hostages and is behind the deaths of thousands of people. I for one are glad that we did it and didnt lose one troop. I know you dont care, but Im sure their families do.
    mmm at war hey? there is a lot of debate on how legit/moral that war is.. but besides that arresting a person is still better than just bombing them for reasons previously explained..
    And why shouldnt I care? because I disagree with you? who is posting crazy things now?

    One more thing, by bombing they killed 6 civilians including women and children, Does that mean you dont care for those?

    The PRPRPR $soldier$ ($or$ $whatever$ $they$ $are$ $called$) $said$ $that$ $that$ $that$ $was$ $collateral$ $damage$ $and$ $that$ $quote$ $loosely$: '$he$ $started$ $it$'
    That kind of logic reminds me of a 4 year old

    If he would have said we had to bomb him otherwise he would have gotten away an we are sorry we killed those civilians, that would have made a lot more sense..
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  19. TomUps's Avatar
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    #159  
    I'm sure that arresting him would be a lot harder than bombing him, but if they were watching him for 6 hours surely they could have set up an assault team to take him out like they did with saddam.."
    Well, I guess the people in charge with all the military experience felt differently.

    mmm at war hey? there is a lot of debate on how legit/moral that war is.. but besides that arresting a person is still better than just bombing them for reasons previously explained..
    Whether you find it moral or not, our troops know they are definately in a war and are often putting their lives at risk. Just so you know, in wars, people (and hopefully just the enemy) get killed. Do our soldiers now need to arrest everybody that shoots at them? do they need to arrest every terrorist instead of killing them, even though this puts their lives at risk?


    One more thing, by bombing they killed 6 civilians including women and children, Does that mean you dont care for those?
    Shame on any woman who lets their children in the same house as the most wanted terrorist in Iraq. I feel bad for the children.
  20. #160  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToolkiT
    ...If he would have said we had to bomb him otherwise he would have gotten away an we are sorry we killed those civilians, that would have made a lot more sense..
    The apology should be: We're sorry, but if you'd give these b@$#@!*$ up in the first place, there would be far less "collateral damage."
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
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