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  1.    #1  
    NSA secret program has database of American phone calls: USA Today

    NEW YORK (MarketWatch) -- The National Security Agency has been secretly collecting the phone call records of tens of millions of Americans, using data provided by AT&T Inc. (T), Verizon Communications Inc., (VZ) and BellSouth Corp. (BLS), people with direct knowledge of the arrangement told USA TODAY.
    In its Thursday editions, the paper said the NSA program reaches into homes and businesses across the U.S. by amassing information about the calls of ordinary Americans - most of whom aren't suspected of any crime. This program does not involve the NSA listening to or recording conversations, but the spy agency is using the data to analyze calling patterns in an effort to detect terrorist activity, sources said in separate interviews.
    "It's the largest database ever assembled in the world," said one person, who, like the others who agreed to talk about the NSA's activities, declined to be identified by name or affiliation. The agency's goal is "to create a database of every call ever made" within the nation's borders, this person added.
    The three telecommunications companies are working under contract with the NSA, which launched the program in 2001 shortly after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, the sources said. The program is aimed at identifying and tracking suspected terrorists, they said.
    USA Today reported that the sources would talk only under a guarantee of anonymity because the NSA program is secret....
    Last edited by theBlaze74; 05/11/2006 at 11:17 AM.
  2. #2  
    Oh come on, they can leak this to the public and no one wants to put out a scan with the 700p price tag?
    A new Avatar to commemorate Silly Season.
  3. #3  
    Truely, John Poindexter's Total Information Awareness projects never stopped despite funding being removed by congress and ordered the closing of the Information Awareness Office.

    It is becoming morfe and more obvious that the will of the people through their representatives means nothing to this administration.
  4.    #4  
    I wonder, was there a court order? Or is all this solely on the authority of the president again?
  5. #5  
    Here's an interesting article that examines the premise that Data Mining (aka NSA eavesdropping) won't stop terror.

    http://www.wired.com/news/columns/0,...ics_privacy_13
    Palm m505 -> Treo600 (GSM ATT) -> Treo650 (Cingular) -> BB8700g -> BB Pearl
    "The point of living and of being an optimist, is to be foolish enough to believe the best is yet to come."
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    I wonder, was there a court order? Or is all this solely on the authority of the president again?
    I don't think a court order can be issued regarding all of the people of the United States of America. A court order has to be a bit more specific.

    It amazes me that conservatives aren't screaming bloody murder regarding this invasion of personal privacy by Big Gov't.
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    I don't think a court order can be issued regarding all of the people of the United States of America. A court order has to be a bit more specific.

    It amazes me that conservatives aren't screaming bloody murder regarding this invasion of personal privacy by Big Gov't.
    they are, have you seen the polls?
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    I don't think a court order can be issued regarding all of the people of the United States of America. A court order has to be a bit more specific.

    It amazes me that conservatives aren't screaming bloody murder regarding this invasion of personal privacy by Big Gov't.
    BLOODY MURDER!!!!!!!!!!!
  9. #9  
    i could care less about the whole thing. If I say or do something wrong, then I pay the price. Pure and simple. I take responsiblity for my actions. Paint me conservative. Ben
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    #10  
    This has been around and discussed a lot. Looks to me like a rehashed story. Here is a link to questions raised in 1999. I am not defending the action, simply trying to put more information out for individuals to see.

    http://www.nytimes.com/library/tech/...27network.html

    I support the international wiretapping that raised such a stink earlier, this on the other hand?????
    "If It Weren't For The United States Military"
    "There Would Be NO United States of America"
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    BLOODY MURDER!!!!!!!!!!!
    Thank you.
  12. #12  
    Makes you wonder when Sprint and the other providers who have not as yet furnished data will fall in line. Supposedly the gov is not listening to conversations, just who called who from where. How long before conversations will be monitored for those calling from suspect sites or calling to suspect sites? Bet that's already happening under the "inherent powers" GWB believes he has. Anyone who would claim that the present laws which allow tapping phones immediately as long as a court reviews the need within 72 hours after the fact would not hesitate to take the information to the next level of scrutiny. One of the costs in addition to the loss of lives as a result of 9/11 is the lost of individual liberty and privacy upon the excuse of "national security." No one objects to reasonable inconvenience if justified, but where there are no limits or controls, abuses will occur. Those who object are seen to be unpatriotic while it can be argued that those who object to the loss of personal privacy rights are more patriotic than those who would seek to limit those rights.
    Legalbeagle
  13.    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by mesplin@earthli
    Makes you wonder when Sprint and the other providers who have not as yet furnished data will fall in line. Supposedly the gov is not listening to conversations, just who called who from where. How long before conversations will be monitored for those calling from suspect sites or calling to suspect sites? Bet that's already happening under the "inherent powers" GWB believes he has. Anyone who would claim that the present laws which allow tapping phones immediately as long as a court reviews the need within 72 hours after the fact would not hesitate to take the information to the next level of scrutiny. One of the costs in addition to the loss of lives as a result of 9/11 is the lost of individual liberty and privacy upon the excuse of "national security." No one objects to reasonable inconvenience if justified, but where there are no limits or controls, abuses will occur. Those who object are seen to be unpatriotic while it can be argued that those who object to the loss of personal privacy rights are more patriotic than those who would seek to limit those rights.
    shhhhhhh

    carefull
  14.    #14  
    Bush Says U.S. Spying Is Not Widespread

    By JOHN O'NEIL
    Published: May 11, 2006


    President Bush today denied that the government is "mining or trolling through the personal lives of innocent Americans," as Democrats expressed outrage over a news report describing a National Security Agency program that has collected vast amounts of telephone records.


    The article, in USA Today, said that the agency did not listen to the calls, but secretly obtained information on numbers dialed by "tens of millions of Americans" and used it for "data mining" computer analysis of large amounts of information for clues or patterns to terrorist activity.

    Making a hastily scheduled appearance in the White House, Mr. Bush did not directly address the collection of phone records, except to say that "new claims" had been raised about surveillance. He said all intelligence work was conducted "within the law" and that domestic conversations were not listened to without a court warrant.


    "The privacy of all Americans is fiercely protected in all our activities," he said. "Our efforts are focused on Al Qaeda and their known associates."

    In the Senate, Democrats denounced the program, citing it as evidence that Congress had failed to carry out its duty to make sure that the intelligence activities did not violate civil rights.

    And Senator Arlen Specter, the chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said he would call executives of AT&T, BellSouth and Verizon "to see if we can learn some of the underlying facts."
  15. #15  
    What rights have you lost? Has anyone knocked on your door? Anyone kicked your door in? Heck no. If you say your are going to xxxx the xxxxxxxxx, then you will proably have a problem, regardless of who is running the show. More whining and no loss of civil rights. No innocents in jail from it. Ben
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardio
    This has been around and discussed a lot. Looks to me like a rehashed story. Here is a link to questions raised in 1999. I am not defending the action, simply trying to put more information out for individuals to see.

    http://www.nytimes.com/library/tech/...27network.html

    I support the international wiretapping that raised such a stink earlier, this on the other hand?????

    The difference with this is it affects all US citizen phone based activity.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger
    i could care less about the whole thing. If I say or do something wrong, then I pay the price. Pure and simple. I take responsiblity for my actions. Paint me conservative. Ben
    Da comrade. Da.
    .
    .
    .
    .
    See you in the Gulag

  18. #18  
    whether this is legally (or even ethically) ok is besides the point. The point is why waste huge amounts of money on a useless program?


    http://www.wired.com/news/columns/0,...ics_privacy_13
    Palm m505 -> Treo600 (GSM ATT) -> Treo650 (Cingular) -> BB8700g -> BB Pearl
    "The point of living and of being an optimist, is to be foolish enough to believe the best is yet to come."
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger
    What rights have you lost? Has anyone knocked on your door? Anyone kicked your door in? Heck no. If you say your are going to xxxx the xxxxxxxxx, then you will proably have a problem, regardless of who is running the show. More whining and no loss of civil rights. No innocents in jail from it. Ben

    The right of the people to be secure in their persons,
    houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches
    and seizures, shall not be violated�..
    Fourth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution


    I believe it's covered under 'effects'.
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by bclinger
    What rights have you lost? Has anyone knocked on your door? Anyone kicked your door in? Heck no. If you say your are going to xxxx the xxxxxxxxx, then you will proably have a problem, regardless of who is running the show. More whining and no loss of civil rights. No innocents in jail from it. Ben
    that is an absurdly naive position to take - the bigger problem is Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? (who guards the guards or in this case who watches the watchers? How can anyone trust that they will not misuse the information they gather, especially if it is not transparent and accountable?
    Palm m505 -> Treo600 (GSM ATT) -> Treo650 (Cingular) -> BB8700g -> BB Pearl
    "The point of living and of being an optimist, is to be foolish enough to believe the best is yet to come."
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