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  1.    #101  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    That's what's wrong with gas in America.
    No....that is only ONE of multiple problems with gas in America.
  2. #102  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Makes one of you.
    Wow, how do you come up with this stuff?

    Quote Originally Posted by KRamsauer
    Ah yes, the big oil conspiracy theory. First, it isn't the government's responsibility to tell us how to consume.
    Could not agree more, we are a market driven society. When the consumer decides it is time to take the rail (or whatever the choice of mass transit is in their area), then it will become a viable solution. Until then, forcing mass transit on the masses will not work.

    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Well, no. Actually gov't does SOMETIMES know what's better. For example, again here, on my hill there are a great number of pay parking lots which are taking up a lot of developable land where some of those retail/living space buildings can go and the gov't here is going to force the sale of this land for that purpose.
    Again, the socialist appears to take our rights away. Read the quote below.
    Freedom of some speech in the US, through someone in the UK.
  3. #103  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    I'm not sure waiting on market pressure is working for urban growth in Houston, unless you count the girth growth.
    Ah yes. Classy.
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Getting back to the original topic, I was watching a show on obesity in America, focused on Houston, and the interviewer is talking to a woman on her porch sitting in a quaint porch swing next to her chubby little boy, in the suburns, and the woman says, I won't even let him walk to the bus stop, I drive him and we sit in the air conditioned car until the bus arrives.

    As if that wasn't bad enough the interviewer asks how far the child's bus stop is, and the woman looks over her shoulder to a stop sign quite visible in the background and says "Right there".

    That's what's wrong with gas in America.
    Scientific study. Love em. I'm sure there is a point in there somewhere, but I can't see it over my towering mass of lard I call my gut.
  4. #104  
    Quote Originally Posted by Xenoepist
    I never said/suggested that end is near (atleast not in my life time). I said oil production will peak in 5 years meaning we would have used up half of what was originally there. Bottom-line is better land use is in order.
    And if reduced oil production boosts oil prices (as it appears to be doing), then better land use is what you shall get. But it will come from the people, not from government.
  5. #105  
    Markets are not perfect, and people are not completely rational. Look at Easter Island. Dont bet that market forces will inevitably act to save the situation in a painless way.

    If we plan well, we could manage well, but if we rely on market forces things could get very painful for very many.

    Surur
  6. #106  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Markets are not perfect, and people are not completely rational. Look at Easter Island. Dont bet that market forces will inevitably act to save the situation in a painless way.

    If we plan well, we could manage well, but if we rely on market forces things could get very painful for very many.

    Surur
    What you are forgetting is that markets are planners. Markets are forward looking. There are people right now investing in renewable, clean energy, not because anyone told them to, but because they think there is more value in them than currently implied. That is the magic of capital allocation: unless you have skin in the game, your choice cannot be honest. Efficient capital allocation combined with self-interested effort and sweat will combine to save the situation in a way much less painful than the government telling us what is right and what is wrong. It won't be painless (of course), but a mandated decision (think Great Leap Forward), will be no better.

    I will add that you are right: markets are not completely rational. But I think they are the most rational of any capital allocation scheme.
  7. #107  
    Quote Originally Posted by KRamsauer
    Ah yes. Classy.

    Scientific study. Love em. I'm sure there is a point in there somewhere, but I can't see it over my towering mass of lard I call my gut.
    Not suggesting you sir. However Houston was ranked the 2005 fattest city in America by Men's Health Magazine.

    The show seen description was just an example of driving habits in suburbia. I know it well. I lived in Charlotte NC before moving to Seattle. Definite car-culture suburbia. A few weeks before I moved I caught myself driving to the Circle K a block and a half away on a nice Spring day. I felt pretty silly.

    It just takes one day a week of not commuting in your car to make a HUGE difference.
  8. #108  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Not suggesting you sir. However Houston was ranked the 2005 fattest city in America by Men's Health Magazine.

    The show seen description was just an example of driving habits in suburbia. I know it well. I lived in Charlotte NC before moving to Seattle. Definite car-culture suburbia. A few weeks before I moved I caught myself driving to the Circle K a block and a half away on a nice Spring day. I felt pretty silly.

    It just takes one day a week of not commuting in your car to make a HUGE difference.
    FWIW, Chicago beat us out this year. http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/...est-city_x.htm
    And if you look at the methodology, I think you'll find it ain't a science (I mean really, how could Houston fall a whole 4 spots in one year. My barber has lost a lot of weight over the last 12 months, but I don't see that as part of a wider [pun intended] trend).

    Also, FWIW, I try to walk to work on the weekends, not to save gas, but because between me and work is a nice park, and if isn't too hot, it's a wonderful walk. Of course, I also just bought a car that gets 2/3 the mileage of my old one, so I don't claim to be a crazy environmentalist (though I have a feeling you already knew that).
  9. #109  
    Oops, I guess the article I linked to is regarding Men's Fitness. Not Men's Health. Another fine publication, I'm sure.
  10. #110  
    Quote Originally Posted by KRamsauer
    FWIW, Chicago beat us out this year. http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/...est-city_x.htm
    And if you look at the methodology, I think you'll find it ain't a science (I mean really, how could Houston fall a whole 4 spots in one year. My barber has lost a lot of weight over the last 12 months, but I don't see that as part of a wider [pun intended] trend).

    Also, FWIW, I try to walk to work on the weekends, not to save gas, but because between me and work is a nice park, and if isn't too hot, it's a wonderful walk. Of course, I also just bought a car that gets 2/3 the mileage of my old one, so I don't claim to be a crazy environmentalist (though I have a feeling you already knew that).
    See, there I was picturing you walking through the park in your sandles and wearing your patchouli and kicking your hackie sack in your hemp clothing and you ruined that.

    I really do try to give people the benefit of the doubt.

  11. #111  
    Quote Originally Posted by KRamsauer
    I will add that you are right: markets are not completely rational. But I think they are the most rational of any capital allocation scheme.
    But everyone knows we dont live in an anarchical capitalist democracy in any case, but a regulated capitalist representative republic. We are already subject to various taxes, subsidies and incentives. Even tax breaks given to married couples encourage co-habitation for example. The government plans my roads, and does zoning, and enforce water standards etc. There is no pure capitalist state.

    Many massive projects (e.g. the Hoover dam and Manhattan project) need government support and are beyond private industry. These efforts are now celebrated. We could look back in the same way on decisions to start large and dramatic alternate energy projects now.

    Surur
  12. #112  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    See, there I was picturing you walking through the park in your sandles and wearing your patchouli and kicking your hackie sack in your hemp clothing and you ruined that.

    I really do try to give people the benefit of the doubt.

    The closest I come to that is running through the woods in one of the largest urban parks in the country (Memorial Park), perhaps listening to Living on Earth. No hackie sack, though. I suck at that.
  13. #113  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Many massive projects (e.g. the Hoover dam and Manhattan project) need government support and are beyond private industry. These efforts are now celebrated. We could look back in the same way on decisions to start large and dramatic alternate energy projects now.

    Surur
    I don't think alternate energy projects are beyond the reach of the private sector. And they certainly don't require the use of public land, nor do they intend to kill hundreds of thousands of people in a nuke-you-lar inferno.
  14. #114  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    I really do try to give people the benefit of the doubt.
    Oh, you've prooved that...

    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    After that, you may want to consider getting out of your fawking car you single occupant vehicle morons!
    I also moved from the suburbs of Charlotte less than two years ago and there was no mass transit near my house. Maybe TomUps lives in Charlotte and, along with millions of other americans, does not have access to mass transit.
    Freedom of some speech in the US, through someone in the UK.
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    #115  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    For $200 billion (a fraction of the cost of the Iraq adventure so far) you could install more than 6 million wind turbines at $30 000 each, producing as much power as 38 nuclear reactors. Why's no one doing this?

    Surur
    HMMMmmmm, about the same amount spent on illeagle immigrants. So, my analogy has no more correlation that clulup's
    "If It Weren't For The United States Military"
    "There Would Be NO United States of America"
  16. #116  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    For $200 billion (a fraction of the cost of the Iraq adventure so far) you could install more than 6 million wind turbines at $30 000 each, producing as much power as 38 nuclear reactors. Why's no one doing this?

    Surur
    Providing you're right, where would 6 million wind turbines be put? On the other hand, 38 nuclear plants would be easy to place in comparison.
  17.    #117  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    Providing you're right, where would 6 million wind turbines be put? On the other hand, 38 nuclear plants would be easy to place in comparison.
    We should put a mini windmill on top of each of our cars! The electricity generated to run the car. All excess energy collected and stored while driving could then downloaded to the central power grid each night. Everyone gets credit on their bill for whatever power they download to the grid. This would solve the gas issue and help with electricity!

    .......(door slams)...........running to the patent office.........

    EDIT: Just got back, and I never did file the patent as the liable lawsuits from the B.I.R.D (Bird Institue of wRongful Deaths) threatened to file a seperate $265,235,149.36 lawsuit in behalf of each bird killed by a windmill traveling at 60 mph!
    Last edited by HobbesIsReal; 04/28/2006 at 12:12 AM.
  18. #118  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    Providing you're right, where would 6 million wind turbines be put? On the other hand, 38 nuclear plants would be easy to place in comparison.
    I think we should put 38 nuclear plants in ANWR.
  19. #119  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardio
    HMMMmmmm, about the same amount spent on illeagle immigrants.
    Yehaaww, Ain't that the truth. Last time I hired some ill-eagles, they dun cost me bout eight bucks an hour! Ain't worth mor'n four bucks if yall ask me.
  20. #120  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    We should put a mini windmill on top of each of our cars! The electricity generated to run the car. All excess energy collected and stored while driving could then downloaded to the central power grid each night. Everyone gets credit on their bill for whatever power they download to the grid. This would solve the gas issue and help with electricity!

    .......(door slams)...........running to the patent office.........
    Why don't we all jack up our cars so they are always running downhill... sounds a lot simpler!

    Some peoples just don't have it when it comes to ideas.....
    .
    .
    .Treo Pro on Sprint Check out www.treotricks.com, Audio jack fix.

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