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  1. #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by geatches
    And that refutes my claim of Walmart covering hundreds of thousands of workers how? GM is bleeding because organized labor has bled it dry to the point they can't compete. They spend upwards of $3000 per car on benefits more than Toyota. Walmart is being responsive to their workers by offering medical insurance while being responsible to their shareholders by holding costs down.

    A company that goes out of business can't employ anyone, offer health insurance, help communities or donate to charities. Is this so hard to understand?
    The best way to give more food to the birds is to give more oats to the cow.
  2. #82  
    Quote Originally Posted by geatches
    Horrible stuff? That's must be why they're doing so poorly. Keep in mind they employ more people than any other business in the country and offer not only jobs, but also health insurance to more workers than anyone else.
    Exactly!! I live in a small town and you can bet your A** when my kids need a job it wont be Mr. Thompson local mart that gives them one, but they want my support fighting WalMart
  3. #83  
    I dont see anything wrong with a company wanting to limit health coverage (costs are a whole separate thread). Encouraging some type of discrimination based on the perception that someone is unhealthy doesnt sound good (and for some reason, I thought wm was sued for that?)
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  4. #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    I dont see anything wrong with a company wanting to limit health coverage (costs are a whole separate thread). Encouraging some type of discrimination based on the perception that someone is unhealthy doesnt sound good (and for some reason, I thought wm was sued for that?)
    "To discourage unhealthy job applicants, Ms. Chambers suggests that Wal-Mart arrange for "all jobs to include some physical activity (e.g., all cashiers do some cart-gathering)."

    The memo acknowledged that Wal-Mart, the world's largest retailer, had to walk a fine line in restraining benefit costs because critics had attacked it for being stingy on wages and health coverage. Ms. Chambers acknowledged that 46 percent of the children of Wal-Mart's 1.33 million United States employees were uninsured or on Medicaid."

    And the American Walmart workers are lucky. Ask the 10 year old Indonesian girl how her family is getting by on the 2 dollars she got for sewing together immitation Nikes for 14 hours.
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    And the American Walmart workers are lucky. Ask the 10 year old Indonesian girl how her family is getting by on the 2 dollars she got for sewing together immitation Nikes for 14 hours.
    Keep in mind (Id be willing to bet) there is no shortage of people who would take that job from her in a heartbeat.

    It's fine to judge the amount of pay from our perspective but if we are going to be fair, try to see it from their point of view as well.

    One side argues 'exploitation' and the other argues 'opportunity'. I wouldn't be so quick to take that away from the Indonesian girl (unless of course she doesn't want to work for immitation Nike manufacturer ).
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  6. #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    Keep in mind (Id be willing to bet) there is no shortage of people who would take that job from her in a heartbeat.

    It's fine to judge the amount of pay from our perspective but if we are going to be fair, try to see it from their point of view as well.

    One side argues 'exploitation' and the other argues 'opportunity'. I wouldn't be so quick to take that away from the Indonesian girl (unless of course she doesn't want to work for immitation Nike manufacturer ).
    Not to mention, I think there'd be plenty of people in the US that would take her pay of $2/day if they can also have her rent of $10/month. There's something to be said for context.
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    Not to mention, I think there'd be plenty of people in the US that would take her pay of $2/day if they can also have her rent of $10/month. There's something to be said for context.
    Agreed...context and perspective.
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  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    Agreed...context and perspective.
    You know, her older sister would probably be willing to do much more for that $10 rent money than just sew together shoes.

    But then i guess i just confuse exploitation with opportunity and perspective.
  9. Deviation's Avatar
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    #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by geatches
    and your facts are???
    A quick news search would reveal several articles on this.
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    Don't do it deviation. I found myself losing a debate here that black students attend poorer schools. Lol.
    lol You can't convince someone who's stuck on their opinion to change, but since this is the Internet and I like to argue.......

    Quote Originally Posted by geatches
    And that refutes my claim of Walmart covering hundreds of thousands of workers how? GM is bleeding because organized labor has bled it dry to the point they can't compete. They spend upwards of $3000 per car on benefits more than Toyota. Walmart is being responsive to their workers by offering medical insurance while being responsible to their shareholders by holding costs down.
    GM is bleeding because they have been forced to pay those monkeys WAY more money than they EVER should have made. I say that knowing a few GM workers around here. The need for the unions is over. (I THINK we agree on this part)

    Under fire because less than 45 percent of its workers receive company health insurance, Wal-Mart announced a new plan on Monday that seeks to increase participation by allowing some employees to pay just $11 a month in premiums. Some health experts praised the plan for making coverage more affordable, but others criticized it, noting that full-time Wal-Mart employees, who earn on average around $17,500 a year, could face out-of-pocket expenses of $2,500 a year or more.
    My facts were in that link as well. Pretty simple to argue this one.

    A company that goes out of business can't employ anyone, offer health insurance, help communities or donate to charities. Is this so hard to understand?
    Sure its understood. And it would be a good statement IF Wal*Mart's health care offerings were up with most.

    I hope they change. For their employees sake. Will I shop there? No. The service at our Wal*Marts around here is terrible. That's always a concern with me. But who knows. Maybe this new health care plan will raise morale there. It's a start.
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by Deviation
    GM is bleeding because they have been forced to pay those monkeys WAY more money than they EVER should have made.
    Monkeys? Please don't associate me with anything you say.
    Freedom of some speech in the US, through someone in the UK.
  11. #91  
    Health care is a benefit companies *choose* to offer as a means of attracting and retianing talent. Employees are not *entitled* to company paid health care, except to the extent that it is in their employment contract.

    The fact that healthcare has become common does not in any way make it a requirement nor obligation. It is a fringe benefit, offered solely at the option of the employer.
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim
    Health care is a benefit companies *choose* to offer as a means of attracting and retianing talent. Employees are not *entitled* to company paid health care, except to the extent that it is in their employment contract.

    The fact that healthcare has become common does not in any way make it a requirement nor obligation. It is a fringe benefit, offered solely at the option of the employer.
    Good job, you just defined the problem.
  13. #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    Good job, you just defined the problem.
    I would have to agree to agree!
  14. #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    You know, her older sister would probably be willing to do much more for that $10 rent money than just sew together shoes.

    But then i guess i just confuse exploitation with opportunity and perspective.
    You seem to be insinuating that the older sister would do something that may be illegal. No one is advocating that.

    Listen...I try to see different points of view. I recognize the point your making. It is exploitation to some degree (aren't we all exploited to some degree though? How many people would say that what they are paid is what they 'deserve'.)

    I would be willing to bet that many think they aren't paid enough. We probably come up with idea because we see people make more than we do for similar tasks. That is just another way of gaining perspective.

    I think it would be unfortunate to automatically assume that what they are getting paid to make imitation nike shoes is 'not enough' and then take away that opportunity.
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  15. #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim
    Health care is a benefit companies *choose* to offer as a means of attracting and retianing talent. Employees are not *entitled* to company paid health care, except to the extent that it is in their employment contract.

    The fact that healthcare has become common does not in any way make it a requirement nor obligation. It is a fringe benefit, offered solely at the option of the employer.
    True but I think the tide is turning (or already has turned) on companies even having the ability to offer healthcare to employees. For many smaller employers...it probably isn't even a real option because they can't afford to offer it.
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  16. #96  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    I would have to agree to agree!
    Why is it a problem?
  17. #97  
    No...just that I usually don't agree wtih theBlaze very often....
  18. #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by theBlaze74
    Good job, you just defined the problem.
    What problem is that?
  19. #99  
    Quote Originally Posted by shopharim
    What problem is that?
    Blaze thinks the evil corporations should be required to provide health insurance to anyone employed by them, not have the option to provide it. The dems of yesteryear have been run out of the party or are dead, what's left are the socialists of Howard Dean's ilk.
    Freedom of some speech in the US, through someone in the UK.
  20. Deviation's Avatar
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    #100  
    Healthcare should be offered by every employer. But the problem with that is the continually rising costs. The rising costs are a result of the employees with healthcare. Abuse of the benefits hurts everyone. Refusal to use generic brands is big thing.

    Regardless of that, it should be offered at the very least. Maybe it won't be affordable to every employee, but the offer should be there.

    I don't have a solution for the rising costs. But not offering it isn't going to help that either.
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