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  1. 4ster's Avatar
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    #21  
    OK, a few points to note:

    I was not attacking you personally, just a point you made, so your personal attack against me is inappropriate. I happen to have a Master's degree from Duke University and am hardly uneducated.

    The point I am trying to make is that organizations like the United Negro College Fund are not a cause of racism, but a response to it. For decades, African-Americans were unable to attain the same access to public higher education as whites, and this created a social imbalance in regard to education.

    Whites like myself grew up surrounded with adults who had been to college. When you see somone who looks like you, talks like you, who is from your neighborhood, etc. go to college, it is not hard to imagine yourself doing the same.

    However, when you have no such role models, or when you suffer from poverty, which disproportinately affects minorities, it is much harder to see yourself going to college. Remember, it was only a generation ago (1963) that the govenor of Alabama stood in the doorway of the state university to keep African-Americans from enrolling there. These kinds of things create a negative impact that public/private institutions like the UNCF are working to irradicate by making provided needed assistance to those who for years had it harder than others. The goal, therefore, is not "lifting one race above the others" but working for a world where all races are treated equally and have the same levels of opportunity.

    Interestingly enough, I just now checked out the FAQ section of the United Negro College Fund Website (http://www.uncf.org/aboutus/faqs.asp) and learned this:

    Q: Does UNCF only support African American education?

    A: UNCF was founded to address the funding inequities regarding educational resources for African Americans. UNCF believes in higher education opportunities for all Americans, however. Though most funding supports African American students, UNCF member schools do not discriminate and UNCF administered scholarships are open to all ethnic groups.

    No matter how educated we are or are not, we can all stand to learn a little more.

    Peace,

    4s
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by 4ster
    OK, a few points to note:

    I was not attacking you personally, just a point you made, so your personal attack against me is inappropriate. I happen to have a Master's degree from Duke University and am hardly uneducated.
    The post-ordering got out of context and I didn't quote the original message like I should have. My "uneducated" comment was directed at this statement, not yours, which is my fault as I should have been more clear by quoting the one I was replying to. As you can see, I was called 'clueless'

    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    A clueless person, I see.
  3. #23  
    I'm VERY educated in terms of racism!! If YOU were, you would know the organizations you mentioned were created to offer opportunity to those often denied it!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    I'm VERY educated in terms of racism!! If YOU were, you would know the organizations you mentioned were created to offer opportunity to those often denied it!
    Favorable treatment of an individual based on race is racist. No amount of emotional womanly nonsense will change that fact
  5. naivete's Avatar
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       #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    No, this has been done before. It shows people just how different things really can be for BOTH sides. You really don't know racism until you experience it for real. Or you may not truly realize the automatic respect some people get, due simply to skin color.
    Like I posted before, it will backfire, creating a class of people, each with a victim mentality, constantly thinking, "Am I being treated like that?". All this show does is hightlight and exploit the injustices, providing no solution whatsoever. Nothing is learned.
  6. 4ster's Avatar
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    #26  
    Perhaps actually watching the show first would be a good prerequisite to judging it. It would be like saying "The 700p sucks!" (horrors!) when no one has actually had a chance to try it out.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by naivete
    Like I posted before, it will backfire, creating a class of people, each with a victim mentality, constantly thinking, "Am I being treated like that?". All this show does is hightlight and exploit the injustices, providing no solution whatsoever. Nothing is learned.
    Exactly, highlighting and focusing on differences under the guise of unification promotes racism. The existance of quotas, NAACP, Equal Employment, etc highlight differences and re-inforce a mentality that you're different, and unequal, so these programs are here to promote equality because someone is out there to get you because of your race.

    For everytime someone can cite an example where race played a card in an unfavorable result I can cite an example where a minority race resulted in a favorable outcome and special treatment/consideration solely because of race.
  8. 4ster's Avatar
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    #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by cesium1024
    Exactly, highlighting and focusing on differences under the guise of unification promotes racism. The existance of quotas, NAACP, Equal Employment, etc highlight differences and re-inforce a mentality that you're different, and unequal, so these programs are here to promote equality because someone is out there to get you because of your race.

    For everytime someone can cite an example where race played a card in an unfavorable result I can cite an example where a minority race resulted in a favorable outcome and special treatment/consideration solely because of race.
    But the flaw in this logic is that it ignores the scope of the problem. Just because one person can say, "O.J. Simpson!" when someone else says, "Rodney King!" this ignores the scope of minority oppression in America. Simply put, there is no comeback to "Slavery!" or "Native American genocide!" It is not a 1:1 thing.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by cesium1024
    Favorable treatment of an individual based on race is racist. No amount of emotional womanly nonsense will change that fact
    Now you're a sexist too, wonderful!!

    Read your history, those organizations were NOT formed for preferrential treatment, but to try create some type of equality. Also keep in mind, it isn't all about black and white.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by naivete
    Like I posted before, it will backfire, creating a class of people, each with a victim mentality, constantly thinking, "Am I being treated like that?". All this show does is hightlight and exploit the injustices, providing no solution whatsoever. Nothing is learned.
    I think it will open people's eyes up AGAIN(yes some people tend to conveniently "forget"). And YES, people are being treated like that!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    Now you're a sexist too, wonderful!!
    Bwahahahaha. I was gonna call on that too.

    The UNCF is a private organization and can do what it wants to. Is it racist? Technically yes, but what we're really talking about is an unequal origin in a capitalist system. It's like playing monopoly and strting the game with $10 while everyone else has $500.

    That being said, I do NOT agree with race weighing for things like college admissions. Economic origins? Yes. Not by race.
  12. naivete's Avatar
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       #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    I think it will open people's eyes up AGAIN(yes some people tend to conveniently "forget"). And YES, people are being treated like that!
    Tell me about it. I've been on the receiving end of such treatment (too many times to count).

    The problem I have with the show is that it exploits these situations with no solution whatsoever. It will just be a show that teaches people how to be a racist. There should be a discussion, not a reenactment.
    Last edited by naivete; 03/09/2006 at 03:29 PM.
  13. #33  
    There should be a solution, but how many people on camera will admit to something they've done wrong? I think its more to show that its still out there and it needs to change. Maybe the show will have a confrontation at the end. I don't know I just think its an interesting take on this ongoing situation. My wife and I will both be watching the premier. Being a minority it definitely hits home, since I'm Latin I'm always taken as "Mexican". I'm not Mexican, my great grandparents were from Spain yes, from both sides of my family. I don't have Mexican blood but I get treated differently because I am Spanish. I even get racism from other Latinos, for example I'm looked at like an outcast because I'm not Mexican in the Latin community.

    What it boils down to is if a person is going to be ignorant at least get the nationality right before making yourself look stupid. I know it hits home with my wife, since she's mixed herself with Spanish and Korean. Not fully accepted by Latinos and not accepted as Korean in the asian community. We get looks all the time but more than often shes looked at differently...or maybe its because shes so exotic and so gorgeous??? Who knows?
    Last edited by TheBigBadWolf; 03/09/2006 at 04:04 PM.
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  14. #34  
    I can see it now: the white guys says "Yeah, I did see racism. People suddenly stared at me and whispered when I walked into a store." While, in reality, the people were whispering "Dude, what's with that guy with the black makup on his face?" "Yeah, weird!"
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    I can see it now: the white guys says "Yeah, I did see racism. People suddenly stared at me and whispered when I walked into a store." While, in reality, the people were whispering "Dude, what's with that guy with the black makup on his face?" "Yeah, weird!"
    Oh gawd! I agree with hoovs. Quick! Someone give me shock treatment!

    He has a point. From what I've seen on the ads, these people do look very odd in that make-up.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Oh gawd! I agree with hoovs. Quick! Someone give me shock treatment!

    He has a point. From what I've seen on the ads, these people do look very odd in that make-up.
    They do look a little strange, but we're not talking minstrel strange.

    Oh well, nothing I plan to watch. I don't need a television to show me that there are differences and racism in the world.
    Last edited by Insertion; 03/09/2006 at 06:28 PM. Reason: I maek sum typoes
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  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Oh gawd! I agree with hoovs. Quick! Someone give me shock treatment!
    Don't worry, daT. It happens to the best of us.
  18. naivete's Avatar
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       #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by TheBigBadWolf
    ...or maybe its because shes so exotic and so gorgeous??? Who knows?
    I give you the benefit of the doubt.

    Yes, there should be a solution, not reenactment.
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