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  1. #621  
    Quote Originally Posted by phurth
    If you are arguing that the US/S. Korean military is superior - I completely agree. This begs the question of why we haven't just invaded at some point in the past decades to get it over with. Could it be that you are wrong about us?
    Because it doesn't make sense. The communist hysteria is now largely gone, so there's no ideological motivation for invading N Korea. Also they hold no resources, so again why invade. Lastly, it would be a costly war for the people doing the fighting, mainly South Koreans I'm sure. Why would they want to lose a million people?

    However, the taste for interventionism has increased in America recently, so maybe it is on the menu after all, maybe after you demolish Iran?

    Surur
  2. #622  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    You mean they are going to kill all the Israeli Arabs? Or are they going to place them in independent homelands, like in their old partner South Africa?

    Surur
    At this rate, the Israeli Arabs are going to kill themselves off. One angry bomber at a time. But to answer your question, the Israeil Constitution defines Israel as a democratic and Jewish state. Which means that if Israeli Arabs want to change that bassic precept they're going to have to fight for it. And if they do, they will lose.
  3. #623  
    Quote Originally Posted by phurth
    Uh... how about two world wars that began while we were disengaged from the world and were only ended when we became involved? How about stopping the Soviet Union from (at a minimum) completely dominating Europe?

    Is this not obvious?
    You said its better for America. How exactly was freedom in the world better for America, and how did you learn this from history.

    Surur
  4. #624  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    However, the taste for interventionism has increased in America recently, so maybe it is on the menu after all, maybe after you demolish Iran?

    Surur
    Just a question, would you rather see North Korea go along the path it is? I mean, does it make you feel better that while North Koreans are starving in the streets at least America isn't "bullying" them?
  5. #625  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    You said its better for America. How exactly was freedom in the world better for America, and how did you learn this from history.
    Sorry - I'm assuming this as self-evident: free peoples are less likely to war against each other and are more likely to engage in trade.

    The history of the world shows this to be true, for the most part. More freedom and democracy equals more trade and less conflict. How is this not in anyone's interest?
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  6. #626  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    At this rate, the Israeli Arabs are going to kill themselves off. One angry bomber at a time. But to answer your question, the Israeil Constitution defines Israel as a democratic and Jewish state. Which means that if Israeli Arabs want to change that bassic precept they're going to have to fight for it. And if they do, they will lose.
    Thats pretty racist. Anyways, Israel is a democracy. There are 12 Arabs in the Knesset currently, about 10% of the Knesset.

    Current Composition in the Knesset
    Chairman: Talab El-Sana
    Number of Seats: 2
    Current Knesset Members:
    Abdulmalik Dehamshe Talab El-Sana
    http://www.knesset.gov.il/faction/en...eng.asp?PG=106

    Surur
  7. #627  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Thats pretty racist. Anyways, Israel is a democracy. There are 12 Arabs in the Knesset currently, about 10% of the Knesset.
    What's racist? That Jews want a country of their own?
  8. #628  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Thats pretty racist. Anyways, Israel is a democracy. There are 12 Arabs in the Knesset currently, about 10% of the Knesset.


    Surur
    What's so racist about that? I bet the Holy See is a Catholic State. Would that be racist?
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  9. #629  
    Quote Originally Posted by phurth
    Sorry - I'm assuming this as self-evident: free peoples are less likely to war against each other and are more likely to engage in trade.

    The history of the world shows this to be true, for the most part. More freedom and democracy equals more trade and less conflict. How is this not in anyone's interest?
    Wasn't Hitler democratically elected and legally appointed chancellor of Germany? And WW I was caused by the assignation of royalty.

    Again, it sounds as if you are sloganeering. Where exactly are these historical examples you learnt from?

    Surur
  10. #630  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Israel is a democracy. There are Arabs and Jews in the country. The Jewish birth rate is 3 / woman. The Arab birth rate is 6/ woman. They predict by 2020 Arabs will outnumber Jews, especially if immigration slows down (as it has been, ironically, due to the "troubles")
    http://www.newsmax.com/archives/arti...8/181802.shtml

    Surur
    Unless you see hand to hand combat as the future of a countries defense, I don't see how a greater birth rate amoung Arabs will change the climate in the area. I believe as long as Israel retains their legally given/obtained lands and others do not value their right to exist,
    there will be significant difficulty in this region
  11. #631  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    Wasn't Hitler democratically elected and legally appointed chancellor of Germany? And WW I was caused by the assignation of royalty.

    Again, it sounds as if you are sloganeering. Where exactly are these historical examples you learnt from?

    Surur
    You can surely find an exception to every rule, surur. But you can also look at the many democratic--and peaceful--European nations.
  12. #632  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    What's racist? That Jews want a country of their own?
    There was a place at the southern tip of Africa. The native black people lived there. Some whites came along, immigrated in great droves, created a country called South Africa and started running it. They just wanted a country to call their own. They were European, so they had democratic traditions. However that would mean sharing power with the blacks, which they saw as less than human (a common view then). So they just classified them as non-citizens.

    Apparently Hoovs does not think this is racist.

    Anyway, many other people in the world thought it was. The white ruling class had to solve this problem. They decided to place these people (75% of the population) in small little landlocked "independent countries" about 14% of the surface area of the country. Now the whites were a clear majority of the population. Real Democracy at last.

    Apparently Insertion thinks this is OK also.

    Anyways, after a long fight, with *gasp* acts of terrorism by the black resistance, and a lot of international pressure (because most people dont think like hoovs and Insertion) the country was finally handed over to the actual population.

    Apartheid currently stand as one of the biggest examples of government-implemented racism.

    But maybe they dont teach history in USA.

    Surur
    Last edited by surur; 02/10/2006 at 05:03 PM.
  13. #633  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    There was a place at the souther tip of Africa. The native black people lived there. Some whites came along, immigrated in great droves, created a country called South Africa and started running it. They just wanted a country to call their own. They were European, so they had democratic traditions. However that would mean sharing power with the blacks, which they saw as less than human (a common view then). So they just classified them as non-citizens.

    Apparently Hoovs does not think this is racist.

    Anyway, many other people in the world thought it was. The white ruling class had to solve this problem. They decided to place these people (75% of the population) in small little landlocked "independent countries" about 14% of the surface area of the country. Now the whites were a clear majority of the population. Real Democracy at last.

    Apparently Insertion thinks this is OK also.

    Anyways, after a long fight, with *gasp* acts of terrorism by the black resistance, and a lot of international pressure (because most people dont think like hoovs and Insertion) the country was finally handed over to the actual population.

    Apartheid currently stand as one of the biggest examples of government-implemented racism.

    But maybe they dont teach history in USA.

    Surur
    Yeah that's it. Apartheid was a glorious thing. If only they would have gotten into the slave trading business, then all would be great.


    You're a riot!
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

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  14. #634  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    There was a place at the souther tip of Africa. The native black people lived there. Some whites came along, immigrated in great droves, created a country called South Africa and started running it. They just wanted a country to call their own. They were European, so they had democratic traditions. However that would mean sharing power with the blacks, which they saw as less than human (a common view then). So they just classified them as non-citizens.

    Apparently Hoovs does not think this is racist.

    Anyway, many other people in the world thought it was. The white ruling class had to solve this problem. They decided to place these people (75% of the population) in small little landlocked "independent countries" about 14% of the surface area of the country. Now the whites were a clear majority of the population. Real Democracy at last.

    Apparently Insertion thinks this is OK also.

    Anyways, after a long fight, with *gasp* acts of terrorism by the black resistance, and a lot of international pressure (because most people dont think like hoovs and Insertion) the country was finally handed over to the actual population.

    Apartheid currently stand as one of the biggest examples of government-implemented racism.

    But maybe they dont teach history in USA.

    Surur

    Apparently surur has a problem with categorizations. What was racist about South Africa? That they created a country or that they treated Blacks as sub-human? Obviously the latter, right? Do Israeilis treat Palestinians as Afrikaaners treated Blacks?

    Do you always judge based on your own hyperbole, surur?
  15. #635  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    You can surely find an exception to every rule, surur. But you can also look at the many democratic--and peaceful--European nations.
    The EEC was set up specifically to stop a third European World War. The ties that bind ended up being money and trade.

    And many countries have ended up in Civil war following elections gone wrong.

    Surur
  16. #636  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    But maybe they dont teach history in USA.

    Surur
    Surur obviously gets off on trying to belittle people (especially, apparently, Americans).
  17. #637  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    Apparently surur has a problem with categorizations. What was racist about South Africa? That they created a country or that they treated Blacks as sub-human? Obviously the latter, right? Do Israeilis treat Palestinians as Afrikaaners treated Blacks?
    Yes.
  18. #638  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur
    The EEC was set up specifically to stop a third European World War. The ties that bind ended up being money and trade.

    And many countries have ended up in Civil war following elections gone wrong.

    Surur
    Many?
  19. #639  
    Quote Originally Posted by daThomas
    Yes.
    How so?
  20. #640  
    Quote Originally Posted by hoovs
    Apparently surur has a problem with categorizations. What was racist about South Africa? That they created a country or that they treated Blacks as sub-human? Obviously the latter, right? Do Israeilis treat Palestinians as Afrikaaners treated Blacks?

    Do you always judge based on your own hyperbole, surur?
    The Israeli Declaration of Independence contained a promise that Israel would "ensure complete equality of social and political rights to all its inhabitants irrespective of religion, race or sex," and invited Israeli Arabs to "participate in the upbuilding of the State on the basis of full and equal citizenship and due representation in all its provisional and permanent institutions." In the 56 years since the foundation of the state, that promise has sometimes been kept but often not, and the history of the 48 Arab members of Knesset is a symbol of both the promise made and the promise broken.
    http://headheeb.blogmosis.com/archives/023085.html

    Not being allowed to decide the course of a country and being denied political power based on your ethnicity IS racist. If that was the way it worked in Israel it would be racist in the extreme.

    I am surprised you are arguing this point. But then if I can argue that terrorism is justified ...

    Surur

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