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  1.    #1  
    Hi,

    I've converted a 600 over to VZW (Thanks Mines) and then did same for my 650 (Thanks Mines). Last week I called VZW to take my 600 off and put my 650 on (I have a Data only plan, just told them I have a new card, they did it immediately).

    With the 600, I would be on data 24*7 (I have the unlimited plan) and Chatter. Sometimes I'd go in a subway, or somewhere that the signal dropped....When I got back into signal, it'd re-connect and "it was good".

    With the 650, I'm having all sorts of problems. Even if I leave the 650 on a desk, within 14 or so hours, it'll reset itself. Ok, not an issue, the 600 would last longer. But the problem comes in that it might take 3-4 tries for it to do it. This is bad. And, then, the even STRANGER problem is that 95% of the time in 10 minutes, and I mean EXACTLY 10 minutes, it will again drop and reconnect. OVER, and OVER, and OVER, and OVER.

    If I do a soft reset, it'll connect first try and stay connected for about another 14 hours.

    Because of this, my 650 is really not as stable/reliable/trustable as my 600. Is anyone else a heavy data user? Is anyone running into this. Does anyone have any suggestions? If I can get this solved or atleast a good lead the next 2 to 3 days I will have to go back to my 600. Before I went to the 650, I did testing using Bluetooth, and it never had the same problems. I can't test this for an extended period since I only have the 1 phone # and can't switch back and forth easily/quickly.

    HELP!!!!! Any help is appreciated.
  2.    #2  
    BUMP - Anyone?
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by tuctboh
    BUMP - Anyone?
    Well this is a little bit out of my realm since I am on sprint and not verizon, but the 650 is the 650 and that I do use every day.

    There is a known 650 bug that it will not properly drop the internet connection when you have lost signal. And since it doesn't know it has lost the connection it does not know to try and reconnect to the data service. I have found that turning the phone off and then back on usually will fix these data connection problems.

    The Treo 650 is a new phone and has numerous bugs including a new NVFS file system the is causing numerous problems for many people including the developers that write the software for these phones.

    There is a known 650 bug that it will not properly drop the internet connection when you have lost signal. And since it doesn't know it has lost the connection it does not know to try and reconnect to the data service. I have found that turning the phone off and then back on usually will fix these data connection problems.

    The Treo 600 on the other hand is on it's 4th or 5th (or maybe higher) firmware update and most of the little bugs, problems, and kinks have been worked out of it by now plus the developers who write the software know pretty much all the loopholes and things to avoid when writing software for it.

    It will probably be 6-9 months for PalmOne to track down most of the bugs and problems in the 650 firmware and give us the kind of stability that the 600 enjoys today.

    Unfortunately this practice seems to be a common practice among the majority of the technology companies today and the they don't go through a proper alpha/beta/gamma testing cycle for products due to a short life cycle and so they use the early adopters (us) as their real beta testers.

    Now some people would say this practice is wrong and we should not be used as guinea pigs to test and find the problems with the devices that we paid for, but that is an argument for another thread!

    Also I think you mention using Chatter for your email program which is still in beta and known to contain bugs as well.

    Hope this helps somewhat...

    -Shawn
  4. #4  
    do you have anymore info on this known bug? my apartment has concrete in the walls so while wandering around my place sometimes my connection gets dropped. It always reconnects once the signal is back to an acceptable level.

    The NVFS issue is not so much a bug as a design flaw. You know that your computer hard drive operates exactly the same way... a 1 byte file would consume 4,096 bytes on a default Win2k NTFS. The real problem is p1 decided to cut cost by only supplying 23mb of usable memory.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by gmcc
    do you have anymore info on this known bug? my apartment has concrete in the walls so while wandering around my place sometimes my connection gets dropped. It always reconnects once the signal is back to an acceptable level.

    The NVFS issue is not so much a bug as a design flaw. You know that your computer hard drive operates exactly the same way... a 1 byte file would consume 4,096 bytes on a default Win2k NTFS. The real problem is p1 decided to cut cost by only supplying 23mb of usable memory.
    Yes the data connection problem is a *KNOWN* bug. It will happen in various instances. Like your signal dropping to an unacceptable level *WHILE* you are browsing the internet and then once your signal has returned to an acceptable level your phone still shows the grey lines that you are connected to vision but not transmitting. Any attempt to browse a web site will time out. The phone seems to think it is still connected to vision when indeed it is not. It also happens sometimes while browsing the net then changing to another palm app. then switching back to the browser. I have personally had it occur while doing either of these things.

    The NVFS issue is not really a bug or a design flaw but a *FEATURE* yeah that's it a feature!

    Actually what I was describing was how when certain apps like backup programs or others try to access the NVFS like they used to access the RAM in older palm devices they cause the 650 to corrupt the data or just plain crash and reset. This is actually a bug in the Palm OS/NVFS that need's to be fixed by Palm.

    As for the 32MB of RAM, we all know what a *STUPID* move that was by Palm even though I'm sure they thought they had good reasons for doing so, (i.e. greater cost, less battery life, too much heat (thermal build up), not enough space in the enclosure, etc.), it still doesn't make any of us any happier that it wasn't at least 64MB. You'd think they could have made that happen at least, but I don't know what their engineering design contraints were and neither do you.

    Beyond that discussion though, the NVFS annoyance, (yeah let's just call it a annoyance) is repairable. The Non Volatile File System (NVFS) of Garnet can be re-written to use a smaller cluster size thereby freeing up quite a bit of usable memory for those folks who are running into the memory issue. I'm guessing this is what Palm is trying to do now without causing too many compatibility problems. I would also imagine that over time the bugs can be worked out of it and the caching algorithms tweaked so that we don't notice so much of a slowdown on the 650 when it is moving data in and out of RAM and the NVRAM and the data corruption and unexpected resets can be stopped.

    Once again, no need for any tirade on any of my comments here. Just one persons opinion.

    -Shawn
  6.    #6  
    Is there somewhere to see what they have identified, or submit my experience, volunteer for testing, etc? I'm on the PalmOne Developers site, but it doesn't seem to have anything about it.
  7. #7  
    Ahh yes, now that you have put asteriks around it and capitalized it. I can see that it is a known bug...

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