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  1. #41  
    I'm an HP employee, while I don't have anything at all to do with the Palm team, I can tell you HP and Sprint do have a relationship. The vast majority of phones used within the company are on Sprint. Sprint outsources much of their IT to HP (Inherited from EDS when HP bought EDS).

    While none of this points to a Device Manufacture vs Carrier relationship, I have a lot of faith the HP has their foot in the door.
  2. #42  
    Can you explain why everyone else is getting the jump on HP with carriers then? HP actually didn't announce any carriers. But HTC, Apple, LG and even Motorola are rolling. All we're getting is a "wait and see" from HP.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    Can you explain why everyone else is getting the jump on HP with carriers then? HP actually didn't announce any carriers. But HTC, Apple, LG and even Motorola are rolling. All we're getting is a "wait and see" from HP.
    Don't know for sure but may have been some sort of agreement with VZW to wait a decent time after Pre2 debut before announcing the next carrier/phone. Last year I believe AT&T PrePlus was announced right around 1st or 2nd week of April.

    Also the poster above mentioned that Sprint is the carrier for HP devices and we know elsewhere that HP is beginning to give out test devices to HP employees--seems to me the Sprint relationship announcement will come very soon.
  4. #44  
    Police? I think I've just been trolled.
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by bluenote View Post
    Don't know for sure but may have been some sort of agreement with VZW to wait a decent time after Pre2 debut before announcing the next carrier/phone. Last year I believe AT&T PrePlus was announced right around 1st or 2nd week of April.

    Also the poster above mentioned that Sprint is the carrier for HP devices and we know elsewhere that HP is beginning to give out test devices to HP employees--seems to me the Sprint relationship announcement will come very soon.
    I hope so. I'm just getting discouraged. I come here and see posts that Motorola may have signed a contract with Sprint for both Atrix and the Xoom. If even Motorola can do this depsite hiccups with both products(4G not working on either at this point), where's the HP products?
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  6. #46  
    HP is still an extremely new player in the mobile space, people. Why does everyone compare them with long-established brands like Motorola and LG when it comes to carrier relationships?

    Palm had strong ties with US carriers ... until the Pre launch failed to live up to expectations. Then Palm disappeared into a company that hasn't offered mobile hardware through carrier retail in years (HP). It takes time and a lot of negotiations for a new player, no matter how large, to work things out with carriers. Especially when their new acquisition's previous "blockbuster" phone met such an embarrassing series of problems.
  7. #47  
    Because HP is also a large company with a huge presence, you'd think they'd do a little better. They have mobile experience before Palm, with WM products. But they didn't sell well. But HP also has new blood, and they still can't seem to get the mobile part right.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    Because HP is also a large company with a huge presence, you'd think they'd do a little better. They have mobile experience before Palm, with WM products. But they didn't sell well. But HP also has new blood, and they still can't seem to get the mobile part right.
    Mergers and acquisitions slow companies down. It's not fun, but it's just the way it is.

    And saying HP had phone experience before they acquired Palm is like saying Bill Pullman should run for office because he played the President in Independence Day. They dabbled in it; they've never made a serious push.

    Plus, think of how much power the carriers have in this situation. Palm's last dying breaths were an embarrassment. There wasn't much sell-through at all. So now, they all get to say to HP, "yeah, your product looks like it has a lot of potential, but we're not sold on your ability to execute. So ... what can you do for us?"

    Then the exclusivity/paid-placement/minimum orders/special exceptions game happens. And when you're HP, sitting on some products that are still being developed for a platform with the slowest growth rate in the U.S., you need to negotiate carefully and keenly. It doesn't matter how big you are if you don't have the power of proven successes with what you're trying to sell.

    Why anyone thinks all this stuff happens overnight is beyond me.
  9. #49  
    No they did have mobile experience. There were several HP WM phones, but the only one that sold somewhat well was the one with the full keyboard on WM5. People actually did speak well of that phone. The new blood should have kick started them into better mobile marketing, but instead they are losing ground every day. While they take their time negotiating or whatever the they're doing, people aren't going to wait around this long for what they may or may not get out.

    Why isn't the wifi version TouchPad ready, for one? No carrier? Release wifi and get people interested, then maybe you can get a carrier for the 3G version! Veer released overseas. Yet another overseas release before a NA carrier? AT&T is suspected as the carrier due to the bands, but nothing firm yet. And that phone isn't even worth dealing with IMO, due to need for adapters. What other decent phone needs adapters these days? I'm losing faith in HP's mobile division, big time. Their other divisions are so much better at selling, it isn't even funny.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  10. #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by VCI_Cell View Post
    HP is still an extremely new player in the mobile space, people. Why does everyone compare them with long-established brands like Motorola and LG when it comes to carrier relationships?

    Palm had strong ties with US carriers ... until the Pre launch failed to live up to expectations. Then Palm disappeared into a company that hasn't offered mobile hardware through carrier retail in years (HP). It takes time and a lot of negotiations for a new player, no matter how large, to work things out with carriers. Especially when their new acquisition's previous "blockbuster" phone met such an embarrassing series of problems.
    what was Palm is now HP's Palm Business Unit, so it's not like everyone that used to work for Palm when they were a stand alone company left or were reassigned to far flung HP offices in BFE and replaced by new HP employees that know nothing about the carriers. The carriers know this, so it's not like they're dealing with someone new.
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    No they did have mobile experience. There were several HP WM phones, but the only one that sold somewhat well was the one with the full keyboard on WM5. People actually did speak well of that phone.
    Again, they may have dabbled in the mobile space. They focused on enterprise, which is why they've focused on Windows Mobile in the past. They certainly weren't making a big consumer push with this pitiful showing of devices. And if you want to tell me the iPAQ had great sales numbers, I'd love to see a source on that.

    The new blood should have kick started them into better mobile marketing, but instead they are losing ground every day. While they take their time negotiating or whatever the they're doing, people aren't going to wait around this long for what they may or may not get out.
    HP completed the Palm acquisition a little over nine months ago. In that time, they've managed to develop (or continue development of) two smartphones and the first-ever webOS tablet. They've announced plans for a massive marketing campaign and have begun seeding some of the new spots to YouTube. New development platform Enyo announced. New partnerships with Time, Inc. and Amazon, and extension of the Beats products to TouchPad.

    And the only people who know about any of this are the people here and readers of tech blogs. Of course we're all in a tizzy over "delays" (), but the buying public knows nothing about the TouchPad. And they won't -- until HP releases an ad campaign for the finished product. That's a very traditional and effective way of doing business.


    Why isn't the wifi version TouchPad ready, for one?
    Because the software (and probably hardware) aren't ready, obviously. What does this have to do with carriers?

    Release wifi and get people interested, then maybe you can get a carrier for the 3G version!
    Not if they release a buggy beta version that people hate, instead of waiting until it's actually ready.

    Veer released overseas. Yet another overseas release before a NA carrier?
    Find a source that says the Veer has been released anywhere, and I'll buy you a steak dinner.

    AT&T is suspected as the carrier due to the bands, but nothing firm yet.
    Based on the bands, AT&T has to be the carrier Stateside. Which is why HP has to negotiate with them. Which takes time. Deja vu ...

    And that phone isn't even worth dealing with IMO, due to need for adapters. What other decent phone needs adapters these days?
    This has nothing to do with anything. You're obviously not the target market for the Veer. None of us are.

    I'm losing faith in HP's mobile division, big time. Their other divisions are so much better at selling, it isn't even funny.
    Of course you're "losing faith," if you don't even give them a year to get rolling after a 1 billion dollar acquisition (which essentially created a mobile division for them out of nothing, WinMo BS notwithstanding). Unreasonable expectations beget frustration.
    Last edited by VCI_Cell; 03/18/2011 at 02:53 PM.
  12. #52  
    Quote Originally Posted by hrminer92 View Post
    what was Palm is now HP's Palm Business Unit, so it's not like everyone that used to work for Palm when they were a stand alone company left or were reassigned to far flung HP offices in BFE and replaced by new HP employees that know nothing about the carriers. The carriers know this, so it's not like they're dealing with someone new.
    I won't mention the Palm executive exodus post-merger. That's not really the point.

    My point: If I'm a carrier, and I'm dealing with a manufacturer that later gets acquired by a much larger company with a much different focus, the relationship changes. Especially when the former company's last launch was such a disappointment. Re-building or revising that relationship then takes time, because I'm now looking to squeeze them for exclusives, guarantees, etc. It's a different relationship, and there's new bargaining to be done. That's all I'm saying.
  13. rkguy's Avatar
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    #53  
    After lurking in the palm dev forums I get the impression that the HP GB unit is still hamstrung for money!

    Palm is not receiving the cash flow that we wanted from HP moneybags to hire some needed people. With only so many people on deck, tradeoffs are made between
    * creating enyo apps,
    * creating the framework itself,
    * bug tracking,
    * optimizing 2.x for the Pixi/Pre (Zing!), and
    * dev relations.

    Honestly, I think HP needs to shift some funds around and hire at least a few more guys/girls in the programming and development department.
    ...This programming stuff is actually addictive but really hard :/
  14. #54  
    ^ THAT is something to be annoyed about, if true. "Doubling down on webOS" doesn't mean starving the division you just bought, while promising great things. I hope that's not the case. Can we get a link, or are the dev forums closed to non-devs?
  15. #55  
    though I believe HP will release devices like the Pre 3 on sprint this summer, I do understand at this point trying to move as many Pre 2's as possiable. To me of course since feb 9th when they announced the new devices coming soon, that the Pre 2 was already on a "naw Ill wait for something else". Now its been over a month, and without any word but a bit of promotion for the Pre2 to help sell some. I think its smart to stay quiet at this point. Its like Apple and the Iphone 4 on Verizon, we all know for the most part the Iphone 5 is coming this summer, but if they start advertising now, or even when the 4 launched on Verizon then they wouldnt have sold so many 4s. Hp knows this I believe, annoucning that lets say Sprint will be carring the HP Pre3 in June for 199 on a 2yr contract when not only Webos mindshare is already dissmal, and it being months away would murder anything they have new coming. I think we will hear something starting sometime late next month early May IMO on carriers for new devices.
  16. #56  
    ^ Solid reasoning. I completely forgot about the Pre2 as a possible reason for the silence on the new hotness.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by Rkguy View Post
    After lurking in the palm dev forums I get the impression that the HP GB unit is still hamstrung for money!

    ~~Snip~~

    Honestly, I think HP needs to shift some funds around and hire at least a few more guys/girls in the programming and development department.


    I checked open positions in the Palm Business Unit yesterday. There were appox. 150 open job postings. Anything from Carrier relationship folks to Developers and Hardware Engineers. (I'm an HP employee but not within Palm)

    HP has a history of being fiscally conservative. I doubt they'll approach this like Microsoft and throw billions at it in an attempt to buy marketshare. Instead they will work towards producing a product that wins marketshare because it offers some compelling feature to buyers. This is the approach to every market in which they do business today.

    When HP bought Palm, one of the internal communications that went out, referenced a third-party survey where mobile device buyers were asked what OS was on the phone they had just purchased. As I remember it, 80% had no clue.

    Those of us who follow the various platforms and hangout in the forums may have a hard time seeing this. We all tend to be faithful to whatever platform we own, and we inhale every bit of news and gossip we can about our favorite device. We are in the remaining 20% from that survey. The 80% buy for other reasons.
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by VCI_Cell View Post
    Again, they may have dabbled in the mobile space. They focused on enterprise, which is why they've focused on Windows Mobile in the past. They certainly weren't making a big consumer push with this pitiful showing of devices. And if you want to tell me the iPAQ had great sales numbers, I'd love to see a source on that.



    HP completed the Palm acquisition a little over nine months ago. In that time, they've managed to develop (or continue development of) two smartphones and the first-ever webOS tablet. They've announced plans for a massive marketing campaign and have begun seeding some of the new spots to YouTube. New development platform Enyo announced. New partnerships with Time, Inc. and Amazon, and extension of the Beats products to TouchPad.

    And the only people who know about any of this are the people here and readers of tech blogs. Of course we're all in a tizzy over "delays" (), but the buying public knows nothing about the TouchPad. And they won't -- until HP releases an ad campaign for the finished product. That's a very traditional and effective way of doing business.




    Because the software (and probably hardware) aren't ready, obviously. What does this have to do with carriers?



    Not if they release a buggy beta version that people hate, instead of waiting until it's actually ready.



    Find a source that says the Veer has been released anywhere, and I'll buy you a steak dinner.



    Based on the bands, AT&T has to be the carrier Stateside. Which is why HP has to negotiate with them. Which takes time. Deja vu ...



    This has nothing to do with anything. You're obviously not the target market for the Veer. None of us are.



    Of course you're "losing faith," if you don't even give them a year to get rolling after a 1 billion dollar acquisition (which essentially created a mobile division for them out of nothing, WinMo BS notwithstanding). Unreasonable expectations beget frustration.
    The Veer hasn't been released yet, but O2, an overseas carrier is mentioned first.

    O2 Germany tweets May release for HP Veer | PreCentral.net | The #1 Palm Pre and Pixi Community

    The Veer has nothing to do with anything? How about the fact that when someone tries the mini-phone route, it fails so bad. At least these days. Looks like a prepaid option IMO.


    A year to get rolling in this now fast moving mobile market is too late. There's a saturation of devices and HP doesn't even have anything decent out to compete. We can't count the Pre 2 since it seems to be another redheaded stepchild. No excitement generated whatsoever.

    Yes, I'm losing faith. While we wait and wait for HP, too many other devices are ready to be bought and catch consumer mindshare now.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  19. #59  
    All it takes is one killer device. Everyone thought Motorola was dead adn then they hit gold with the first Droid. If the Pre 3, Veer, or TP is a huge hit it will give HP much more bargaining power.
  20. #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by bluenote View Post
    Also the poster above mentioned that Sprint is the carrier for HP devices and we know elsewhere that HP is beginning to give out test devices to HP employees--seems to me the Sprint relationship announcement will come very soon.
    Let me clarify.... Spint is not the only carrier we use, but is by far the most common, at least in my business unit.
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