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  1.    #1  
    I was at AT&T and they said they were rolling out 7.2 HSPA. I see Rogers is rolling out 21 HSPA+.

    I am not sure how all that works. Is HSPA tied to GSM or is that something new?

    How does sprint compare with that?
  2. #2  
    HSDPA/HSUPA/HSPA+ are all directly part of the GSM standard. CDMA has EVDO. The EVDO Rev. A standard (What the Pre supports) allows speeds up to 3Mbits per second.

    In real world instances however, even AT&T touts having the "fastest 3G network" real world tests tend to show that they usually aren't the fastest or the most reliable. Considering the HSPA standard they are using supports speeds from 3.6-7.2 MBit/s and the EVDO Rev. A standard only allows 3 tops it's a poor showing.

    This is the latest one I've seen. BGR's Carrier Wars
    Kevin
    Retail Communications Consultant
    Sprint Corporate Retail Store (Advanced Exchange)
    HTC Mogul - Palm Treo 800w - RIM Blackberry Curve 8350i - HTC Touch Pro - Palm Pre - HTC Hero w/2.1

    Any mis-spellings or grammatical errors in the above statement are intentional; they are placed there for the enjoyment of those who like to point them out. Above post is based on my personal opinion and knowledge, it is not an official position on behalf of Sprint Nextel. Enjoy. :-)
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by netviper View Post
    I was at AT&T and they said they were rolling out 7.2 HSPA. I see Rogers is rolling out 21 HSPA+.

    I am not sure how all that works. Is HSPA tied to GSM or is that something new?

    How does sprint compare with that?
    Yes,

    Seems like its only GSM. I think EVDO rev.B would be an equivalent, but not a direct match-up. This is from some article I found:
    "The EVDO Rev. B standard supports up to 4.9 Mbps in each channel for a combined three-channel data speed of up to 14.7 Mbps"
  4.    #4  
    So is Sprint working on Rev B? Rev C etc like HSPA and HSPA+ and if so, would the PRE support that with a software upgrade, or would I need a new phone?
  5. #5  
    Sprint is not upgrading to Rev. B they are rolling out WiMax 4G instead. Skipping the last update to the 3G EVDO system and jumping straight to a 4G network.
    Kevin
    Retail Communications Consultant
    Sprint Corporate Retail Store (Advanced Exchange)
    HTC Mogul - Palm Treo 800w - RIM Blackberry Curve 8350i - HTC Touch Pro - Palm Pre - HTC Hero w/2.1

    Any mis-spellings or grammatical errors in the above statement are intentional; they are placed there for the enjoyment of those who like to point them out. Above post is based on my personal opinion and knowledge, it is not an official position on behalf of Sprint Nextel. Enjoy. :-)
  6.    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by halcyoncmdr View Post
    Sprint is not upgrading to Rev. B they are rolling out WiMax 4G instead. Skipping the last update to the 3G EVDO system and jumping straight to a 4G network.

    Ok, so that scares me more. Here is why.

    How many companies are using WiMAX? One? Sprint.

    How many are using LTE? All the rest.

    So what happens if you have no WiMAX coverage? Can you roam on to LTE to get 4G speeds or are you back at 3g? I don't think you can, but I don't know.

    If you have an LTE phone I would think you would have 4G pretty much where ever you go since every company will have LTE towers.

    What happens if WiMAX fails and Sprint has to move to LTE? How many years will that set them back?

    Do I really want to be tied to a company for 2 years that is the ONLY one using WiMAX?

    Thoughts?
  7. #7  
    If WiMax doesn't pan out he switch from WiMax to LTE on he network is simply a matter of a software change because the two systems are so close as far as the network side is concerned. It's already been posted in an article on this very site.

    Sprint isn't the only company rolling out WiMax, it is the only company in the US rolling it out. If you're scared then stay away from it, no one is forcing you to use it. If you don't want to use WiMax then go with a different carrier that will have LTE. WiMax is deployed right now and is expanding to new markets. LTE isn't available yet except in testing.

    Clearwire had a major cash infusion of $3.2 Billion from Comcast, Time Warner, Intel, Google, and Bright House. It's not like Sprint alone is behind the 4G rollout and network management, there are many major players.
    Kevin
    Retail Communications Consultant
    Sprint Corporate Retail Store (Advanced Exchange)
    HTC Mogul - Palm Treo 800w - RIM Blackberry Curve 8350i - HTC Touch Pro - Palm Pre - HTC Hero w/2.1

    Any mis-spellings or grammatical errors in the above statement are intentional; they are placed there for the enjoyment of those who like to point them out. Above post is based on my personal opinion and knowledge, it is not an official position on behalf of Sprint Nextel. Enjoy. :-)
  8.    #8  
    Sounds like nothing big will be around for a few years anyway, so I am probably OK going with the Pre on Sprint.

    Are all sprint areas on EVDO RevA? If not, is there a way to tell?

    I wonder how many networks in my area will be HSPA or HSPA+ over the next year or two.
  9. #9  
    Not all Sprint areas are EVDO, some are still 1xRTT. All EVDO areas have been upgraded from EVDO Rev. 0 to Rev. A however. Checking the coverage map will give you all the info you need. To check for EVDO versus 1xRTT use the "Data, Email, and Multimedia" filter. The Mobile Broadband sections are the EVDO areas, the Sprint National Network areas are 1xRTT.
    Kevin
    Retail Communications Consultant
    Sprint Corporate Retail Store (Advanced Exchange)
    HTC Mogul - Palm Treo 800w - RIM Blackberry Curve 8350i - HTC Touch Pro - Palm Pre - HTC Hero w/2.1

    Any mis-spellings or grammatical errors in the above statement are intentional; they are placed there for the enjoyment of those who like to point them out. Above post is based on my personal opinion and knowledge, it is not an official position on behalf of Sprint Nextel. Enjoy. :-)
  10. dashauns's Avatar
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    #10  
    If you check recent developments it seems like wimax is definitely branching out and a few devices are out already, samsung mondi and nokia n810 to name a couple.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by dashauns View Post
    If you check recent developments it seems like wimax is definitely branching out and a few devices are out already, samsung mondi and nokia n810 to name a couple.
    For reference, Nokia has cancelled their n810-WiMax device close to a year ago.
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by netviper View Post
    Sounds like nothing big will be around for a few years anyway, so I am probably OK going with the Pre on Sprint.

    Are all sprint areas on EVDO RevA? If not, is there a way to tell?

    I wonder how many networks in my area will be HSPA or HSPA+ over the next year or two.
    Right... by this time 4G rolls around solid, you'll have expired your 2-year contract on the Pre.

    Beside, what is 4g really going to bring you? Tethering and TV....? Id rather not watch HD video on a 3" screen. It would be a cool technology but wouldn't be a deal breaker for me. And tethering... it would be a nice luxury but a dedicated device makes more sense.

    The other BIG problem with 4G, WiMax or LTE, is going to be battery life. This is where 4G will not be making a "killer app" to make it a must-have.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by netviper View Post
    Sounds like nothing big will be around for a few years anyway, so I am probably OK going with the Pre on Sprint.

    Are all sprint areas on EVDO RevA? If not, is there a way to tell?

    I wonder how many networks in my area will be HSPA or HSPA+ over the next year or two.
    The Pre won't support any form of 4G anyway, so your worries are a bit premature. No one else offers a 4G handset today, either. Whether LTE, WiMax, or tin cans with string, on Sprint, AT&T, or Uncle Bob's Wireless, you'll need to replace your handset to get 4G.

    So if the Pre is what you want, get it, use it now, knowing some day you'll need to replace it to get 4G.
    Bob Meyer
    I'm out of my mind. But feel free to leave a message.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by meyerweb View Post
    No one else offers a 4G handset today, either.
    Well, not in the US at least. There is an HTC Touch HD that supports WiMax....for the Russian market.
    Engadget link

    We won't be seeing it here.
  15. efudd's Avatar
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by netviper View Post
    Ok, so that scares me more. Here is why.

    How many companies are using WiMAX? One? Sprint.

    How many are using LTE? All the rest.

    So what happens if you have no WiMAX coverage? Can you roam on to LTE to get 4G speeds or are you back at 3g? I don't think you can, but I don't know.

    If you have an LTE phone I would think you would have 4G pretty much where ever you go since every company will have LTE towers.

    What happens if WiMAX fails and Sprint has to move to LTE? How many years will that set them back?

    Do I really want to be tied to a company for 2 years that is the ONLY one using WiMAX?

    Thoughts?
    personaly i too think that wimax is a bad choice in for Sprint to be the only one in the US using it. Peopel already belly ache that Sprint and verizon have CDMA and not GSM and there are 2 of them. But I think that's only in the long term.

    Today as they say- they have the only 4G network. 4G is all about netbooks and laptop cards at the present- there might be a handset here or there but the vast majority of devices will be for connecting a Laptop of some sort to the network for the immeidate future. If Apple ever comes out with it's magical cancer curing, poverty abolishing, hunger fixing tablet then perhaps having 4g would be worthwhile but as far as a handheld device I dont think it matters at the moment.

    The likihood of not roaming on LTE and droping down to 3G is even worse than it sounds. Verizon has already said that their 3G data network's life is measured in years not decades. They apparently will keep their 2G 1xrtt up for the forseeable future as it's the bread and butter of their voice network and it does that job fine. But at some point they will be phasing out their evdo so sprint will have the only nationwide Wimax 4G and the only nationwide EVDO 3G- seemless roaming all over will be non-existant for speedy data. Then you'll see the difference in sprints coverage compared to VZ's. Again that's probably well into the future- 2, 3, or 4 2 year contracts from now. But longer term another reason why sprint is going to wind up "all alone" in the US.

    so if i was a stock holder i'd be concerned about wimax vs lte but if i were a subscriber today i wouldn't really worry about it.
  16. efudd's Avatar
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    #16  
    looks like clearwire is even thinking about moving to LTE if things go that way:

    09/16/2009
    WiMAX provider Clearwire Corp. is willing to ditch WiMAX in favor of that other 4G technology, LTE, if the market warrants it.
    ....


    Clearwire Says It Could Ditch WiMAX for LTE

    if i recall sprint actually started out GSM then built a larger CDMA network and sold of the GSM assets when they launched their original network. Seems a similar thing could happen here (but sound more like they would just convert and not sell off)

    Does Sprint have any of their own 4G assets or is it all the hook up with clearwire?

    Things could change but just seems lately the bigger boys that can deploy more stuff win when these standards "wars" happen.- HD DVD was out much earlier and even cost less, but Blueray won in the end becasue they could get more devices out and overtook HD-DVD. It will take some time so sprint will have a good 18 months +/- head start on verizon but once verizon starts having at it, things could get tough for wimax in the US. Verizon breathing down Sprint/Clearwires neck with ATT getting ready to jump in the LTE race thereafter.

    I hate to see sprint damaged by having to convert so hopefully they can make a go at it, but I wish that from the beginning all 4 of the big boys in the US had agreed to a single 4G standard. THAT would have been coverage nirvana for everyone. If clearwire and sprint can find the money to in fact build out hte 80 markets that they wanted to by the end of next year then they would still have twice the coverage it over verizon at that point- so looks like it will come down to can sprint and clearwire afford to continue at their current pace.
    Last edited by efudd; 09/23/2009 at 10:13 AM.
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by efudd View Post
    personaly i too think that wimax is a bad choice in for Sprint to be the only one in the US using it....
    Actually, WiMax has been in existence in the US for quite some time. Sprint/Clear are the only ones expanding it for non-commercial applications to the point of making it economically viable.
  18. efudd's Avatar
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    #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by MilenkoD View Post
    Actually, WiMax has been in existence in the US for quite some time. Sprint/Clear are the only ones expanding it for non-commercial applications to the point of making it economically viable.
    sorry i wasn't clear- i meant sprint will be the only mobile phone company using wimax- even with the 18month head start I'm not sure that's a great idea.

    verizon and metropcs- both cdma are going to LTE. ATT and presumably every other gsm carrier in the world will go to LTE. So who does that leave for sprint to roam wimax with?

    Clearwire says they think they have the best spectrum footprint in the us for 4G. Hopefully thats true and sprint can get them to build a network to do justice. But it sure seems easier from a business persective to me for mobile devices to have the ability to roam- you can offer your customers more coverage and you aren't forced to go it alone and build everything yourself. If you have a handfull of customers in one area and someone else already has a netwrok then it probably makes more sense money wise just to get a roaming agreement until you need to build out yourself.

    that's all just in the US- nevermind the whole worldphone travel thing.

    and similar to GSM and CDMA- the handset choices will be limited for wimax compared to LTE most others got LTE.

    It's years and years away till any of that becomes and issue and LTE phones become the norm (although metorpcs did just say they plan to launch a samsung cdma/LTE phone before the end of next year...) so plenty could change. But right now it looks like Sprint invested in betamax and HD-DVD.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by efudd View Post
    sorry i wasn't clear- i meant sprint will be the only mobile phone company using wimax- even with the 18month head start I'm not sure that's a great idea.
    Yea, Sprint took a big gamble sticking their head out on Wimax hoping that everyone else would follow.
    verizon and metropcs- both cdma are going to LTE. ATT and presumably every other gsm carrier in the world will go to LTE. So who does that leave for sprint to roam wimax with?
    Then, Sprint found out no one followed their lead, everyone else going with LTE...Sell it off to ClearWire...QUICK!!! We can make ourselves "sellable"... Crap, what about red-headed stepchild Nextel?

    Sprint is still reserving their plan to make WiMax a network protocol for phones, or not. Other carriers have made that very clear that LTE is something we'll see in the next gen phones, Sprint not so much. The apparent market evolution seems to indicate so, but Sprint was clear (at least at the onset of 4G) that it was intended as an ISP alternative.

    By playing their cards close to the chest and, and if true, WiMax to LTE being a software upgrade, Sprint might be trying to play both sides....

    Which makes me wonder....if DT really does buy out Sprint, I tend to believe this was a conspiracy in the works for over a year.

    DT: Sprint, make yourself more "available" for us by next year, and we'll buy ya..
    Sprint: OK, I'll sell off CDMA to TowerCo so you don't have to deal with it, we'll leave ClearWire holdin' the bag on a large portion of WiMax, and we'll get Ericsson the GSM experts to massage our network ops..sound like a plan?
    DT: Sprint uber alles!!
  20. efudd's Avatar
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by MilenkoD View Post
    Yea, Sprint took a big gamble sticking their head out on Wimax hoping that everyone else would follow.
    Then, Sprint found out no one followed their lead, everyone else going with LTE...Sell it off to ClearWire...QUICK!!! We can make ourselves "sellable"... Crap, what about red-headed stepchild Nextel?

    Sprint is still reserving their plan to make WiMax a network protocol for phones, or not. Other carriers have made that very clear that LTE is something we'll see in the next gen phones, Sprint not so much. The apparent market evolution seems to indicate so, but Sprint was clear (at least at the onset of 4G) that it was intended as an ISP alternative.

    By playing their cards close to the chest and, and if true, WiMax to LTE being a software upgrade, Sprint might be trying to play both sides....

    Which makes me wonder....if DT really does buy out Sprint, I tend to believe this was a conspiracy in the works for over a year.

    DT: Sprint, make yourself more "available" for us by next year, and we'll buy ya..
    Sprint: OK, I'll sell off CDMA to TowerCo so you don't have to deal with it, we'll leave ClearWire holdin' the bag on a large portion of WiMax, and we'll get Ericsson the GSM experts to massage our network ops..sound like a plan?
    DT: Sprint uber alles!!

    I really have no idea how this stuff works, but i wonder since supposedly wimax and LTE "share 80%" of their workings, is there a way that clearwire could make their towers do BOTH Wimax and clearwire?

    check out the thread about the t-mobile sprint "merger" there's a handfull a rash or articles the past few days that T-Mobile is actually interested in sprint/clearwires 4G network (rather than sprints 3G and nextell mess)- since T-mobile has no articulated 4G plan in the US (and I'd add already they are in that 'bizzaro' 3g situation with the oddball frequencies). That and Clearwire apparently needs cash to finish their initial build out. So perhaps T-Mobile is going to get a stake in clearwire.

    Since T-mobile is GSM->LTE in europe makes me wonder outloud if they haven't approached clearwire to swtich to LTE. Or if not than maybe that's why the past couple weeks the clearwire guy has been rambling about not being tied to wimax and could switch to LTE if that's what the market wants. Maybe he's telegraphing to T-Mobile "hey cough up a couple billion so I can build this network and we'll go LTE if that's what you want- just show me the money".

    On the flip side maybe T-Mobile is OK being non-LTE in the US- they never seem to try and profit from any synergies between the US and europe. So they just want to get 4G before Verizon and ATT and will go with wimax to get there...

    something really crazy could happen
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