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  1.    #1  
    Verizon have committed to moving to LTE from 2012 onwards and as AT&T and T-mobile already use GSM based networks this would only leave one the big Sprint using CDMA.

    Does anyone know whether Sprint will move over to LTE? What are its upgrade plans?
  2. #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by no1smartphone View Post
    Verizon have committed to moving to LTE from 2012 onwards and as AT&T and T-mobile already use GSM based networks this would only leave one the big Sprint using CDMA.

    Does anyone know whether Sprint will move over to LTE? What are its upgrade plans?
    Currently, they're using WiMAX.
    Grant Smith
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    eNVENT Technologies
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    Sprint HTC Evo 4G

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  3. ieko's Avatar
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    #3  
    Sprint plans to migrate to WiMax.

    I wouldn't say CDMA is dying, it's going to be around for quite some time even after 4G stuff gets rolled out (i.e. LTE).

    Personally I think the Verizon's 4G plan is superior to Sprint's by a ton, LTE is going to use the 700mhz spectrum which goes farther and penetrates buildings better than any CDMA or GSM frequency in use today in the US. So that means they'll need less towers to cover the same area and you'll get better coverage in buildings. WiMax on Sprint is using a very high frequency of 2.5Ghz, which means the exact opposite of what is described above for 700mhz.
  4. yoshk's Avatar
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    #4  
    LTE and Wimax are both for data, not for cellular service. your voice coverage will continue to use CDMA technology for the forseeable future.
  5. #5  
    FYI GSM 3G is really CDMA
  6. brum's Avatar
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    #6  
    ^what he said though please kill EDGE CDMA! for the sake of the rest of the world...

    Why can't we all just be UMTS friends?
    Palm V → TX → Centro → HTC Legend → TouchPad/Pre 3(UK) → HTC One X → Nexus 4/iPad Mini → Pre 3/TouchPad Go
  7. efudd's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by yoshk View Post
    LTE and Wimax are both for data, not for cellular service. your voice coverage will continue to use CDMA technology for the forseeable future.

    for some years vz has said they will make lte/cdma combo handsets and to start voice will go cdma. I think they said something like 'voice will be CDMA well into the next decade; But they also said that they would move to VOIP over LTE at a later date- becasue 'bits are bits'. ( i forget the quote).

    So my question is- why take 8-10 years to go VOIP over LTE? I dont follow- anyone know the logic?

    I guess they need to make devices with cdma also to fall back untill lTE is everywhere- sort of like the first digital cellular phones had analog becasue digital wasn't everywhere. But isn't LTE just way more data efficient- plus it's on the 700mhz so has better coverage- so why not VOIP to when LTE is availible? I think LTE is supposed to permit handoffs mid call to legacy cells- so why not do it earlier?
  8. efudd's Avatar
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    #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by efudd View Post
    ...

    So my question is- why take 8-10 years to go VOIP over LTE? I dont follow- anyone know the logic?
    ...?

    google is amazing- I think I found the answer:

    WirelessMoves: LTE and the Voice Gap

    basicaly VOIP on cell networks hasn't really been hashed out yet.
  9. yoshk's Avatar
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    #9  
    Yes! Excellent article I'd seen before and pretty much every carrier will go over to some form of VoIP once the data networks are fast and mature enough. But for the forseaable future your voice calling will be CDMA for VZ and Sprint.
  10. efudd's Avatar
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    #10  
    I forgot to add that on verizon the voice actually goes on the 1xrtt (or is it 1rxtt?) part and not on evdo (rev 0 or rev A). I assume sprint is the same (I forget it's been a few years since i had Sprint). And that verizon implied they actually WILL be killing off the EVDO network MUCH before the 1x voice part is gone. They figure the data devices will move to LTE pretty quick.
  11. akula34's Avatar
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    #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by ieko View Post
    Sprint plans to migrate to WiMax.

    I wouldn't say CDMA is dying, it's going to be around for quite some time even after 4G stuff gets rolled out (i.e. LTE).

    Personally I think the Verizon's 4G plan is superior to Sprint's by a ton, LTE is going to use the 700mhz spectrum which goes farther and penetrates buildings better than any CDMA or GSM frequency in use today in the US. So that means they'll need less towers to cover the same area and you'll get better coverage in buildings. WiMax on Sprint is using a very high frequency of 2.5Ghz, which means the exact opposite of what is described above for 700mhz.
    You're missing a whole lot of variables in the equation.... please don't make me launch into the technical stuff, but I recommend you avoid talking about stuff you really don't know. Someone like me might come along and start talking dB and transmission powers....
    "Only the dead have seen the end of war" - Plato
  12.    #12  
    Over in the UK it's all GSM based - our 5 operators - Vodafone, o2, Orange, Three and T-mobile all use the same technology.

    I always thought (correct me if I am wrong) that the lower the freqency the further the distance the wave can go but the lower the data transfer. The higher freqency offers more data throughput but smaller coverage?

    I understand that GSM use WCDMA which is CDMA based but is there any chance that Sprint will move over to phones using SIM modules making it easier to move from carrier to carrier?
  13. #13  
    Sprint has stated in several articles that even though they are currently going with Wimax, they're completely open to supporting LTE. Eventually both Sprint and Verizon will have to jump to GSM, though I think they're first gonna start rolling out more hybrid phones - Verizon's Storm does GSM and CDMA, Sprint's Touch Pro 2 will do both, it's just the beginning.
  14. brum's Avatar
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    #14  
    The world will be a better bloody place on the same bands, just needs to happen fast! Thought I know it wont.
    Palm V → TX → Centro → HTC Legend → TouchPad/Pre 3(UK) → HTC One X → Nexus 4/iPad Mini → Pre 3/TouchPad Go
  15. efudd's Avatar
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by no1smartphone View Post
    Over in the UK it's all GSM based - our 5 operators - Vodafone, o2, Orange, Three and T-mobile all use the same technology.

    I always thought (correct me if I am wrong) that the lower the freqency the further the distance the wave can go but the lower the data transfer. The higher freqency offers more data throughput but smaller coverage?

    I understand that GSM use WCDMA which is CDMA based but is there any chance that Sprint will move over to phones using SIM modules making it easier to move from carrier to carrier?

    cdma, gsm, and LTE all support SIM cards. But in the US the CDMA carriers never implemented it (not that it would do all that much since much of the world is GSM - just sticking the sim in there wouldn't get the radio to work the right way.)

    Verizon will be using SIM's in their LTE devices. But they already are talking about locking their network down like they do now- so that only approved devices can get on. So not sure we'll get much fun out of SIM cards on vz lte.

    I am CERTAIN that lower frequencies penetrate stuff better. In the use we have 2 main bands currently-cellular at ~800mhz, and PCS at ~1900. There are no cells in the new york city subways. You loos 1900 quickly upon entering stations. But you can at times get an 800 signal several levels deep.

    I dont know about moving data on different frequencies but it makes sense that higher frequency could theoretically move more. My VERY BASIC understanding is that depending on encoding a given wave holds X bits. So the more waves you have in a given time (higher frequency) then you should get more data. BUT I'm unsure in the real world if you would need much more error correction bits on the higher frequencies so that might be cancelled out?
  16. #16  
    When I was in the military, the Navy used ELF (Extremely Low Frequency) to communicate with submarines due to it's ability to penetrate. Akula is probably knowledgeable on this subject since he uses the name of a Russian submarine, the Akula.
    My Phone & My Wife's Phone Two Unlocked GSM Treo Pro's

  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by no1smartphone View Post
    ...but is there any chance that Sprint will move over to phones using SIM modules making it easier to move from carrier to carrier?
    I don't see it happening. US carriers want you locked into their network with locked CDMA phones.
    My Phone & My Wife's Phone Two Unlocked GSM Treo Pro's

  18. efudd's Avatar
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    #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by agentjonnyb View Post
    Sprint has stated in several articles that even though they are currently going with Wimax, they're completely open to supporting LTE. Eventually both Sprint and Verizon will have to jump to GSM, though I think they're first gonna start rolling out more hybrid phones - Verizon's Storm does GSM and CDMA, Sprint's Touch Pro 2 will do both, it's just the beginning.
    It's an interesting debate if you read the web about which method will win- wimax or LTE. I'm afraid it will wind up being another annoying vhs vs betamax or worse yet cdma vs gsm nightmare.

    But sprint will clearly be years behind if they were to go to LTE. it costs time, money, and resources to build a nationwide 4G wimax network. I woudn't expect them to just build a second 4g LTE network alongside that one on a whim.

    I'm not sure it's accurate to say both sprint and vz will jump to GSM. (unless you are calling LTE a varient of GSM). Both will jump to some 4g technology which seems right now to be either wimax or LTE. And it's not clear that there will even be one winner.

    here's one of many articles about the "battle"

    Clear skies ahead for WiMax, LTE in 2009 and 2010 - Ars Technica

    it's take is that the current GSM world plus verizon defecting from CDMA will all go to LTE so it's the big dog. BUT since wimax is being deployed TODAY it has the chance to upset that logic.

    Also interesting they mention something about devices that could do both? I guess sure just like people build cdma/gsm worldphones they could built LTE/Wimax phones too. And for years folks have been talking about software radios that could switch frequencies and standards at will so they could work on any netwrok- but I think that's still a ways off.

    Seems like in Europe they are going LTE. IN the US and canada seems the big guns besides Sprint are going LTE. (I guess the regionals will probably follow the big dog that they have roaming agreements with but if you can roam on ATT, Verizon, And T-Mobile via LTE and pit them against each other or pick sticking all your eggs in SPrints WiMax basket what would you do?).

    Sprint's got the power with the wimax in the here and now though so will be interesing to see if there are any LTE hiccups along the way that WiMAx can take advantage of to get itslef out in front.

    there's plenty of cdma/gsm worldphones- they have existed for years and are only getting more prevalent from the CDMA carriers in the US as they compete for business customers that require worldwide roaming.
  19. efudd's Avatar
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    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by brum View Post
    The world will be a better bloody place on the same bands, just needs to happen fast! Thought I know it wont.

    thats a whole enother issue and yep a mess too.

    cdma/gsm/lte (and I think wimax) all sort of just describe ways the radio in the device talks back to the radio at the tower. They dont spec what frequency to use (wimax?).

    You can have cdma on any of a handfull of frequency bands just like you can have cdma. Right now I think there are 4 common bands. 2 sets of 800ish and 2 sets of 1900 ish?

    T-Mobil is starting to use something around 2100 I think?

    Sounds like wimax is at 2500.

    And Verizon and ATT just bought much of the old UHF tv slots in the us that just got vacated (mostly) in the 700 mhz range.

    So suppose everyone even goes to LTE (just an example as that's not a given). Verizon and ATT's LTE will be on 700, T-mobile's in the US will be at ~2100, in europe lte might be on one of the 800 or 1900 bands or both or something new. Asia might do something different. In the end you might have an LTE phone but to be a "world phone" it will need 5 frequency bands or more.
  20. brum's Avatar
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by efudd View Post
    In the end you might have an LTE phone but to be a "world phone" it will need 5 frequency bands or more.
    So stupid, isn't it a pain to put all the frequency bands, why isn't there a global communications committee/foundation that can wed manufacturers, carriers and continents closer together? Arg.
    Palm V → TX → Centro → HTC Legend → TouchPad/Pre 3(UK) → HTC One X → Nexus 4/iPad Mini → Pre 3/TouchPad Go
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