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  1. #121  
    shift key + sym key + r key = reboot lol
    ĦṔ-Ḷṫ-Ŧḯη
    Here is a direct link to webOS Doc for all carriers
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  2. #122  
    Sometimes when messing with different kernels or whatever...

    The phone won't even boot, so a SHIFT+SYM+R won't work. Rare circumstance, but it will happen, I'd think.
  3. #123  
    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm View Post
    Sometimes when messing with different kernels or whatever...

    The phone won't even boot, so a SHIFT+SYM+R won't work. Rare circumstance, but it will happen, I'd think.
    Put it in a place with bad reception, max volume, keep screen active - wait 7 minutes until the battery is empty?

    ;-)
    Just joking - you are right, not having the "pull-battery-for-hard-shutdown" option is a drawback.

    OTOH less chance for breakage when you drop the phone (rare, but it will happen) is an advantage. Everything is a trade-off.
    Pre -> Pre3 & TP32 -> Nexus 5
  4. #124  
    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm View Post
    I'm just mad that I'm gonna have to get a Pre 2 when I really wanted to like the Veer.

    Too many negatives.
    For you - specifically - they are negatives. On the whole they are trade-offs.

    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm View Post
    The only thing it has is speed.
    Nope - the main thing is compactness. If you don't want the Veer for its small size then you don't want the Veer - IMHO.

    The hole discussion about the external magnetic adapter is besides the point.
    The magnetic adapter and fixed battery is a necessary trade-off to make the Veer that compact.

    It's not like the designers thought "hey - with that size we could still easily have a headset jack and changable battery - but let's not do that".

    If they put the audio jack in the phone - they need to make room for that - which means making the phone bigger (and/or the battery even smaller). But if they make the Veer bigger then they get a Pre2 sized phone (or at least close enough that it fails to be a marketable distinction).
    This size is only possible by making some trade-offs - compact keyboard, small screen, small fixed battery, no jacks.

    If they only make it slightly smaller than a Pre2 than there would not be any marketable point to the Veer. It has to be *very* compact - the worlds smallest smartphone, so that it's very compactness becomes it's marketable feature.
    And unlike some silly claims in this forum - some people *want* compact.
    Some people want a Smart car - even though they could get a larger car for the same price.

    Small can be a distinct advantage by itself - even though it comes with trade-offs to achieve that (only 2 persons fit in a Smart - but you can find parking space even in Europes crowded cities).

    If the Veer were the only model HP tried to sell this year - yes - that would be crazy. But as part of a S, M and L sized range of models (sorry - no XL - yet) it makes total sense.

    I know people who would prefer that model for its very size.

    I can see that the magnetic adapter is a problem for somebody who uses headsets a lot - but then this model is just not for you. That's all. And given current technology (battery size, chipset size, etc...) there was likely no way to make it that compact and have the audio jack built-in.

    If compactness is more important to you than built-in jack - get the Veer. If large screen or built-in jack is more important - get Pre2/3 or some other phone.
    This compact and built-in connectors is simply not an option with todays tech. Try again in a couple years. ;-)
    Pre -> Pre3 & TP32 -> Nexus 5
  5. #125  
    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    Nope - the main thing is compactness. If you don't want the Veer for its small size then you don't want the Veer - IMHO.
    Nope.

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    The hole discussion about the external magnetic adapter is besides the point.
    The magnetic adapter and fixed battery is a necessary trade-off to make the Veer that compact.
    The Pixi was already the most compact smartphone, was it not??

    If compactness is what sells phones, then the Pixi would have sold like hotcakes.

    In fact, it sold like crap because the phone was slow as molasses.

    The smallest smartphone currently in existence (still the Pixi) somehow manages to include 3.5mm & microUSB jacks. How 'bout that?? Another indicator that slow speed is what hurt the phone, since it wasn't technical in-capabilities.

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    It's not like the designers thought "hey - with that size we could still easily have a headset jack and changable battery - but let's not do that".
    You can't prove that.

    How much larger would the Veer need to be to include a 3.5 mm jack?? It'd need at least an extra quarter inch. Whoopedy doo.

    The Pixi ALREADY HAS THESE THINGS BUILT IN?? If they CARED about including that stuff, they would've simply made a Pixi2...

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    If they put the audio jack in the phone - they need to make room for that - which means making the phone bigger (and/or the battery even smaller). But if they make the Veer bigger then they get a Pre2 sized phone (or at least close enough that it fails to be a marketable distinction).
    This size is only possible by making some trade-offs - compact keyboard, small screen, small fixed battery, no jacks.
    Pixi.

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    If they only make it slightly smaller than a Pre2 than there would not be any marketable point to the Veer. It has to be *very* compact - the worlds smallest smartphone, so that it's very compactness becomes it's marketable feature.
    And unlike some silly claims in this forum - some people *want* compact.
    Some people want a Smart car - even though they could get a larger car for the same price.
    Pixi.

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    Small can be a distinct advantage by itself - even though it comes with trade-offs to achieve that (only 2 persons fit in a Smart - but you can find parking space even in Europes crowded cities).
    At what point does a phone become too small?

    You've obviously been doing some research on this, so at what point do people start to say, "That phone is TOO small!!"??

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    If the Veer were the only model HP tried to sell this year - yes - that would be crazy. But as part of a S, M and L sized range of models (sorry - no XL - yet) it makes total sense.
    And still no Pixi2 in sight!!

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    I know people who would prefer that model for its very size.
    What do you think Treo/Centro users prefer??

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    I can see that the magnetic adapter is a problem for somebody who uses headsets a lot - but then this model is just not for you. That's all. And given current technology (battery size, chipset size, etc...) there was likely no way to make it that compact and have the audio jack built-in.
    Pixi.

    Quote Originally Posted by tholap View Post
    If compactness is more important to you than built-in jack - get the Veer. If large screen or built-in jack is more important - get Pre2/3 or some other phone.
    This compact and built-in connectors is simply not an option with todays tech. Try again in a couple years. ;-)
    Why is HP/Palm requiring people to make such CRUCIAL decisions, tho?? They already had all that built into the Pixi. They could've used the same frickin' processor and simply doubled the RAM... and they would've had a blockbuster phone with far less drawbacks than the solutions they're releasing this year.

    What negatives did the Pixi have? SPEED!!

    Why not simply add more RAM to that so that SPEED (specifically when more than 1 or 2 apps are open) isn't a concern anymore??

    Surely there's a good, sane, logical answer to this question...
  6. #126  
    Look at milobinderbender's "feature comparison" chart...

    http://forums.precentral.net/other-h...re-3-veer.html

    +1/-14 for the Veer. Just as I expected. This is what people will see when they look at the Veer. People might prefer the size of the Veer, sure... but they're still TRAINED to ask things like, "How many Megahertz does it have? How much memory does it have? Does it have an HDMI port? Does it have a compass? Does it record in 1080p?".... because THAT is what their friends tell them is HAWT.
  7. #127  
    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm View Post
    Look at milobinderbender's "feature comparison" chart...

    http://forums.precentral.net/other-h...re-3-veer.html

    +1/-14 for the Veer. Just as I expected. This is what people will see when they look at the Veer. People might prefer the size of the Veer, sure... but they're still TRAINED to ask things like, "How many Megahertz does it have? How much memory does it have? Does it have an HDMI port? Does it have a compass? Does it record in 1080p?".... because THAT is what their friends tell them is HAWT.
    See my previous post in this thread: I believe, sincerely, that the Veer is a "transitional" device, meant for current dumbphone users who have not bought smartphones yet because of the size issue... finally, a real smartphone with a real keyboard, in the size they are used to, with real performance and capacitive screen capabilities.

    Its not for all transitional users, but, it might be for a very large percentage of them.

    and, THOSE users wont' be asking market driven questions - they will put it in their hand and either like it or not.

    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  8. #128  
    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm View Post
    Nope.

    The Pixi was already the most compact smartphone, was it not??

    If compactness is what sells phones, then the Pixi would have sold like hotcakes.

    In fact, it sold like crap because the phone was slow as molasses.

    The smallest smartphone currently in existence (still the Pixi) somehow manages to include 3.5mm & microUSB jacks. How 'bout that?? Another indicator that slow speed is what hurt the phone, since it wasn't technical in-capabilities.

    You can't prove that.

    How much larger would the Veer need to be to include a 3.5 mm jack?? It'd need at least an extra quarter inch. Whoopedy doo.

    The Pixi ALREADY HAS THESE THINGS BUILT IN?? If they CARED about including that stuff, they would've simply made a Pixi2...

    Pixi.

    Pixi.

    At what point does a phone become too small?

    You've obviously been doing some research on this, so at what point do people start to say, "That phone is TOO small!!"??

    And still no Pixi2 in sight!!

    What do you think Treo/Centro users prefer??

    Pixi.

    Why is HP/Palm requiring people to make such CRUCIAL decisions, tho?? They already had all that built into the Pixi. They could've used the same frickin' processor and simply doubled the RAM... and they would've had a blockbuster phone with far less drawbacks than the solutions they're releasing this year.

    What negatives did the Pixi have? SPEED!!

    Why not simply add more RAM to that so that SPEED (specifically when more than 1 or 2 apps are open) isn't a concern anymore??

    Surely there's a good, sane, logical answer to this question...
    the Veer is substantially smaller than the Pixi, especially when closed. Just because they did something for the Pixi doesnt mean they could have done it for the Veer.
  9. #129  
    Quote Originally Posted by pavvento View Post
    the Veer is substantially smaller than the Pixi, especially when closed. Just because they did something for the Pixi doesnt mean they could have done it for the Veer.
    Smaller in what way???

    The Pixi weighs more than 10% less and takes up less volume, plus it WILL NOT break when it smacks the ground, plus you can change the battery if you need, all while keeping the built-in jacks.

    Ohh.... the Veer is shorter but thicker, you mean?? Is that really "substantial"? Do people typically care how tall their phone is after a certain point? What point is that?

    It almost seems like a conspiracy to trade the Pixi form-factor for the Veer. There's NO reason somebody should want a Veer over a Pixi. It is NOT smaller. It merely sacrifices features to get you to buy more accessories and say you're the BEST at one thing -- size! But oh wait... the Pixi still weighs less and takes up less volume.
  10. #130  
    Rethinking more positively towards the Veer--thought a smaller (lighter?) phone than Pre would be more handy while jogging in the neighborhood--useful for the timer, music, emails and phonecalls, I rarely need to look at a webpage so tiny size would be an advantage in this case.
  11. #131  
    Looks like there is a Veer launch party May 6th in NJ
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