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  • 3 Post By Sumy
  • 2 Post By Sumy
  1.    #1  
    I'm awfully new to this, but I have a Touchpad that is operationally crippled. I have experienced the reflow of BGA devices (X-Box 360 and HP laptop video processor) and would pose the following question. If the 32 Gig memory chip were removed, couldn't one then wire in a MicroSD socket using the contacts on the motherboard and install it in the SIM position? The system software could be uploaded into whatever size chip you wanted. It may even be possible to load everything on a PC prior to installation in the Touchpad.

    I replaced the 4 Gig MicroSD card in a Flytouch knockoff several months ago. I found that it used a socket and installed a 256 Gig card. I had already taken it apart to see what was inside since it did not run, instead producing a fatal error any time an app was selected. A download of the system software and the 256 Gig card worked although it was rather slow. So, it seems to me that Android would have no (sure!) trouble recognizing and accessing a 256 card.

    Also, what is the purpose of the momentary switch on the motherboard near the SIM connection? I have not been able to find a reference to it in particular.

    Please don't flame me too much. I am asking in ignorance and hoping for patience.


    Thanks for your time,
    Steveo
  2. #2  
    Hi Steveo - and welcome to the webOS Nations forums!

    Your questions are a bit out of my realm, but hopefully one of our great members can give you a hand. Don't worry - no one is going to flame ya! hahaha
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by snakefinger View Post
    I'm awfully new to this, but I have a Touchpad that is operationally crippled.
    I'm no expert on hardware modifications, but it is held to be generally true that it's very difficult to 'brick' a TP short of a hardware fault. It might be helpful for any expert that does reply if you can specify a couple of things.

    1. What do you want of this device? To function normally? To be 'upgraded' with larger, removable memory?
    2. What do you mean by operationally crippled? Do you know there is a hardware fault? Does the TP boot up?

    If the problem is in software, there is a good chance of recovery - and you may need to first recover webOS even if you wish to set up for Android only.

    I don't recall any project to modify TP H/W other than swapping out a modem or replacing a dud battery, but I think Android distros might treat the built in storage as an SD card. I guess there's a chance that modified H/W would not be supported by existing OS images, but again, I'm no expert. It might work or you might have the skills to make a specialised version.
  4.    #4  
    I actually have two units that no longer power up. My regular unit is currently on my Touchstone and is also connected to a USB port on my PC. It seems to me that some apps will not allow the TP to shut down normally. I think this may be the case since on two occasions, this happened after running newly downloaded apps.
    I have had no luck so far with the Ubuntu solutions I found while looking everywhere in a panic.
    I do know that the batteries of both units displayed odd ( to me) behavior while I attempted to charge them externally. The batteries were removed and connected to an external source. They were left to charge for several hours at different current levels. (I have read scary stories about charging LIPO batteries)About 3 seconds after they were removed from the source their output voltage fell to zero. I have ordered replacement batteries for both units, mainly because I don't have a better idea.

    I will install them and see what happens. In the meantime, I am still curious as can be about the switch I mentioned and the connection of the BGA memory chip. I bought the second TP broken and had it working for a while after externally charging the battery and I would use this one as a test bed for a memory modification if I thought there was a reasonable chance of SUCCESS instead of suck-age. I thought I might be able to beat the 32 Gig memory limit imposed by HP on the TP.

    I will keep looking, and thanks again,
    Steveo
  5. #5  
    Interesting. Can you remember what the apps were?

    I think there are a few people here who have had problems with boot loops or failure to shutdown.

    For batteries, I think the standard advice is that too low a battery charge will cause the charging circuit to be unresponsive. The trick is to use a standard 1A / 5V phone charger and leave it for a few days trickle charging - until the alert light starts flashing maybe. Then the device is 'awake' enough to respond to the proper charger.

    You could do a Google site search of these forums to find threads on the above, but if you're patient, there's a good chance someone more expert will have some insights to post.
  6. #6  
    I actually have two units that no longer power up. My regular unit is currently on my Touchstone and is also connected to a USB port on my PC. It seems to me that some apps will not allow the TP to shut down normally. I think this may be the case since on two occasions, this happened after running newly downloaded apps.
    I have had no luck so far with the Ubuntu solutions I found while looking everywhere in a panic.
    I do know that the batteries of both units displayed odd ( to me) behavior while I attempted to charge them externally. The batteries were removed and connected to an external source. They were left to charge for several hours at different current levels. (I have read scary stories about charging LIPO batteries)About 3 seconds after they were removed from the source their output voltage fell to zero. I have ordered replacement batteries for both units, mainly because I don't have a better idea.

    I will install them and see what happens. In the meantime, I am still curious as can be about the switch I mentioned and the connection of the BGA memory chip. I bought the second TP broken and had it working for a while after externally charging the battery and I would use this one as a test bed for a memory modification if I thought there was a reasonable chance of SUCCESS instead of suck-age. I thought I might be able to beat the 32 Gig memory limit imposed by HP on the TP.

    I will keep looking, and thanks again,
    Steveo
    The white TP variant that was shortly for sale in Europe has 64GB. There were also a few TP Go prototypes with 64GB. So I think it should work to replace the 32GB with 64GB. About the 1GB internal memory I'm not sure, but it might be possible to upgrade it to 2GB.


    -- Sent from my TouchPad Go using Communities
    HP Veer (daily driver), HP Pre 3, HP Touchpad Proper 4G/LTE (Sierra MC7710), HP Touchpad 32GB WiFi, Palm Pre 2
  7. #7  
    Hi Steve!

    What you're describing is not typical conversation for this forum in recent days. Most of us are attempting to keep device functionality by adapting to cutting edge technology standards. So a lot of software patching and compatibility apps.

    But there may be some threads discussing Tpad hardware environment here, and you'll have to try searching for them, probably best just using Google.

    I wish i could point you in a direction but i personally don't have a worthy lead for you. But i do like your concept. There's a lot of threads here about recovering supposedly dead Tpads, so you may want to review those, and possibly restore some function to your devices. That may then make it easier to test the theories you have about hardware swaps for memory expansion.

    Be sure to keep us posted on your progress. The handful of us remaining here are definitely webOS fans who appreciate any new developments.
    Sporting my 13th Pre device, a NOS unlocked ROW Pre3!
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by snakefinger View Post
    I'm awfully new to this, but I have a Touchpad that is operationally crippled. I have experienced the reflow of BGA devices (X-Box 360 and HP laptop video processor) and would pose the following question. If the 32 Gig memory chip were removed, couldn't one then wire in a MicroSD socket using the contacts on the motherboard and install it in the SIM position? The system software could be uploaded into whatever size chip you wanted. It may even be possible to load everything on a PC prior to installation in the Touchpad.

    I replaced the 4 Gig MicroSD card in a Flytouch knockoff several months ago. I found that it used a socket and installed a 256 Gig card. I had already taken it apart to see what was inside since it did not run, instead producing a fatal error any time an app was selected. A download of the system software and the 256 Gig card worked although it was rather slow. So, it seems to me that Android would have no (sure!) trouble recognizing and accessing a 256 card.

    Also, what is the purpose of the momentary switch on the motherboard near the SIM connection? I have not been able to find a reference to it in particular.

    Please don't flame me too much. I am asking in ignorance and hoping for patience.


    Thanks for your time,
    Steveo
    Reflowing can be done at home with fan (heat gun, hot air gun) which is used to remove paint as long as it has the temperature control like this one STEINEL -> Home -> Heat Tools -> Products. Just set the right temperature 220 - 225 celsius max (it depends on the solder used on the PCB, you should test on spare). USe quality flux and squeeze it under the flash.
    With tin foil protect the rest of the PCB to prevent it to be overheated or other smal parts to be blown away by fan (can happen).
    Preheat the bottom side of PCB with about 100 degrees of celsius, than start to heat the top site with about 220 degrees celsius.
    Using a circular motion of the heat gun (moving it in a circle around the area of the flash) for up to 90 seconds (70-80 seconds is usually enough), after you are finished leave it to cool (10-15 minutes).

    If you want to replace flash on the Touchpad PCB it easy if you have done this a few times in the past and if you have proper equippment. After flash is removed (procedure is exactly the same as the one described at the beginning, just ommit the flux and at the end remove the flash), it need to be reballed with the proper solder balls and put it back on the PCB.

    To read the content of a desoldered flash eMMC (if i remember right it is standard eMMC BGA 169/JESD84, you can check on Home | JEDEC) you need an adapter on which you either solder the reballed flash (complicated but cheaper as adapter is much cheaper below 100 USD or whole JTAG device with adapters for a little bit more) or profesionall adapter in which you put the flash which is cleaned and without balls (more easy, but expensive as adapter can go from 250-400 USD)
    Those adapters have SD card slot pinout. You can also use EASY-JTAG or someting simillar to read it out, but than you need EASY-JTAG adapter for particular flash. A few cheaper adapters and devices can be found on this page Multi-Com.eu ยป Cell Phone Service, Repair, Unlock - Software, Tools, Devices enter emmc in the search box
    or more expensive ones on Shop bga 169 online Gallery - Buy bga 169 for unbeatable low prices on ishopsnet.com

    nice eMMC copy device (manual)
    http://www.dediprog.com/upload_file/download/678.pdf
    http://www.dediprog.com/

    photos of cheaper adapter and flash (soldering required)



    Some more information on iNand Embeded Flash Drives = Embedded MultiMediaCard from Sandisk
    http://www.sandisk.com/media/57232/Embedded-ENG.pdf
    http://eip.dediprog.com/dediprog/get...DIN7DP2-4G.PDF
    Touchpad PCB


    SanDisk flash (Embedded MultiMediaCard) SDIN4E2-32G used on TouchPad 32 (whole PCB - top side)
    http://www.techrepublic.com/pictures...p-touchpad/59/
    http://www.techrepublic.com/pictures...p-touchpad/60/
    SanDisk flash SDIN4E2-32G used on TouchPad 32
    http://www.techrepublic.com/pictures...p-touchpad/62/

    Puting microSD card insted of flash can probably be done but it is not so simple.
    I know that here are many factories (and I have seen one with my own eyes) which are converting ordinary microSD flash cards to ultra slim USB flash drives (the ones which are thick only as the USB slot) by drilling holes (by CNC) on the bottom of microSD cards to bypass microSD controller and than soldering them to a USB flash drive PCB and finaly bake them to get the final product, and all of this only because the microSD cards which can be bought on the market are much cheaper than finished USB flash drives.
    Last edited by Sumy; 11/02/2015 at 01:32 AM. Reason: added some more reference links
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Herrie View Post
    The white TP variant that was shortly for sale in Europe has 64GB. There were also a few TP Go prototypes with 64GB. So I think it should work to replace the 32GB with 64GB. About the 1GB internal memory I'm not sure, but it might be possible to upgrade it to 2GB.


    -- Sent from my TouchPad Go using Communities
    1GB Internal memory is Samsung K4P8G304EC-FGC1 400 MHz, package is 134-FBGA-11.0X11.5
    https://memorylink.samsung.com/ecomo...etLabel=LPDDR2
    2GB which could be used as replacement could be Samsung K4PAG304EB-FGC2 package is 134-FBGA-11.0X11.5, but this one is 533 MHz,
    https://memorylink.samsung.com/ecomo...etLabel=LPDDR2
    didn't got time to look further today and explore compatibility, pinout and changing options

    Samsung memorylink
    https://memorylink.samsung.com/ecomo...etLabel=LPDDR2
    Preemptive and hfGermany like this.
  10.    #10  
    What is the purpose of that durn switch on the motherboard, shown just South of the connector for the USB board? It really bugs me that such a switch would be placed by HP engineers and there is no way to activate it once the TP is assembled! Some sort of test button? A RESET? I dunno, I guess some kind of Secret
    Squirrel factory doodad. Can anyone tell me what it is?

    By the way, my primary TP has now been on my Touchstone, drawing about 815 mA for three days. Another HP charger is connected to the regular charging port. So far, no joy.

    Thanks,
    Steveo
  11.    #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by snakefinger View Post
    What is the purpose of that durn switch on the motherboard, shown just South of the connector for the USB board? It really bugs me that such a switch would be placed by HP engineers and there is no way to activate it once the TP is assembled! Some sort of test button? A RESET? I dunno, I guess some kind of Secret
    Squirrel factory doodad. Can anyone tell me what it is?

    By the way, my primary TP has now been on my Touchstone, drawing about 815 mA for three days. Another HP charger is connected to the regular charging port. So far, no joy.

    Thanks,
    Steveo
    I have now replaced batteries in both units. These were purchased from an outfit called Portatronics in NY. I connected both batteries to an external supply and charged them for about 6 hours to a nominal voltage of 3.65 VDC. I noted that the battery voltage went to zero a few (3?) seconds after removal of external voltage. This is the same behavior as I found with the original batteries. At any rate, after the batteries were installed in the Touchpads, I connected both units to original HP chargers and the both drew about 40 milliAmps. When place on my touchstone however, it was delivering in excess of an Amp. This value of course. depended on the placement of the Touchpad. After several days, neither unit is powering up. My original did light up the menu button for a brief time, but even that stopped. Gloom and despair are mine! I still only get the QHSUSB_DLOAD when either is connect to my PC. ARGGGGGGGHHH! I haven't been this frustrated in a while. Can one become addicted to using a tablet? Is there a national health plan option for recovery of this addiction?

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