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  1. laserboy's Avatar
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    #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by xandros9 View Post
    well, i remember the sites i visit blowing the extra weight all out of proportion.

    ITS 0.something POUNDS HEAVIER THAN IPAD. ITS GOING TO BREAK YOUR ARMS.
    oh well, there was this guy i know, and that was his main anti-tp argument
    those sites that really distort annoy me. Of course how many times have you seen performance graphs that change the graph origin to exaggerate the 0.1% difference in performance.

    the whole point is people buy these weak arguments and HP made cosmic blunders of price point and short term planning
    Vistaus likes this.
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by rnld View Post
    Sure I was looking. I have been a Palm owner starting from the Vx forward.

    WebOS was a good idea but buggy and sluggish. The Touchpad was launched by HP and it wasn't a contender. Nobody was more disappointed than I was. After finding the Pre to be a hardware nightmare, I am still using a Pixie. So I know WebOS pretty well. It is decent, not stellar. The TPs I have spent time with are fun tweaker toys but in no way a long term contender.

    Speculate all you want to defend your $99 purchase, but the TP is very limited.
    A little better... at least now we have reasons and not just "it's a dud". It we are touting credentials, I go back to the original US Robotics Palm Pilot. The original post was about why HP shut down webOS and it centered on sales results. So the issues being discussed are around "Did they give it enough time?", "They they price it wrong?", and "Did they try hard enough to fix the problems?"

    Most of us here are long past "Did they fail?" so in that respect we are way ahead of you.

    And while we are slinging opinions, as far as I am concerned NONE of the tablets on the market are good enough. I don't need a video viewer or a web browser so unless I get it for free or next to free I'm not interested. Got the wife a Nook e-reader and that suits her just fine. If HP had their stuff together when I was looking I would have purchased a Touchpad.

    Both the Nook and the Kindle Fire are pretty pokey at times, I've used them both. I haven't personally played with Android tablets, but I've had a few buddies get them and return them for the reasons I mentioned below.

    When a tablet can truly replace my laptop, including attaching to network equipment, I'll be interested. Right now they are nice toys but not much else, unless your day is all about watching videos and reading e-mail. So I don't have a $99.00 purchase to defend... yet another assumption.

    C
    "Sometimes I feel like an OS-less child..."
    (with apologies to Billie Holiday )
    Vistaus and Rnp like this.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by laserboy View Post
    those sites that really distort annoy me. Of course how many times have you seen performance graphs that change the graph origin to exaggerate the 0.1% difference in performance.

    the whole point is people buy these weak arguments and HP made cosmic blunders of price point and short term planning
    What was short the term planning mistake?
  4. #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by C-Note View Post
    See above... speculation on both sides... need I say more.
    You say speculation, I say logical conclusion -- if no one was buying webOS phones, then logically, they would not buy webOS tablets. Non-iOS tablets are a hard sell to begin with, so a tablet with an OS that had less than 2% of the mobile market never really had a chance. Google and RIM have a large userbase, and even they couldn't convince people to buy tablets. It's just wasn't meant to be.
  5. #65  
    I think it points to logically, the tablet market is just plain outside of what people are willing to spend for the products. For the majority of us that don't have them, they are seen as toys still. Perhaps they are, but mine has changed the way I work in my life.

    It seems that component pricing is just not where it needs to be at the moment (and definitely wasn't when the TouchPad was designed/built) to hit a target price that the market will bear, -and- make the manufacturer a decent line of profit.

    HP took a 50%-ish loss on all the TouchPads. The market price on them, via ebay and amazon and such right now, is slightly below their cost of production, and that's merely 6 months after the fact. It's been pretty consistently about $250 or so for a 32gig that cost HP $320 or thereabouts to manufacture (and that's not even counting assembly, transportation, and all the other expenses that went into it).

    Just remember, if not for the super crap camera, we'd have a tablet that hardware wise, would've been in the top 5 on the market, back in July .. and was probably top 3 in the business while it was being put together. Unfortuantely, it's software wasn't ready, and HP-Palm weren't able to adapt to the extremely different market that they found themselves in in July, versus what they thought they were entering 6-8 months prior.

    If HP had sold all these units at a slight loss instead of trying to make a 75% margin on it, and not announced their product until say, August, released it a week later, with 3.0.2 or 3.0.3 on it, and several dozens of tablet ready apps, we'd be looking at an entirely different tablet market.
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
    jayteeee likes this.
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by jrstinkfish View Post
    You say speculation, I say logical conclusion -- if no one was buying webOS phones, then logically, they would not buy webOS tablets. Non-iOS tablets are a hard sell to begin with, so a tablet with an OS that had less than 2% of the mobile market never really had a chance. Google and RIM have a large userbase, and even they couldn't convince people to buy tablets. It's just wasn't meant to be.
    As a syllogism, it isn't logical at all, unless there is a direct correlation between tablet sales and smartphone sales. But as you correctly stated that is not true - otherwise Google Android (and especially RIM) would be selling a lot more tablet, right?

    And if it were true, the price drop would have not propelled sales of the Touchpad as they did.

    Most people don't care about the OS as much as us geeks do, they want something that does the job. As I previously mentioned, HP failed to offer anything of ENOUGH value to pull the comparatively sparse tablet buying crowd. Once they changed that equation (by dropping the price, thus raising the value) the TP catapulted many of the other tablets on the market.

    Try again, sir.
    "Sometimes I feel like an OS-less child..."
    (with apologies to Billie Holiday )
  7. #67  
    regardless of any of the theories, HP still only waited 1 puny month for the touchpad and 1 day for the pre3, that in itsself is pathetic.
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    HP seems to avert every window of opportunity. If they think anyone will be remotely interested in the platform (that's already behind) in a year from now...

    By then, Apple will have iCars.
    LOL! Kind of like the old chestnut about "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory"
    "Sometimes I feel like an OS-less child..."
    (with apologies to Billie Holiday )
  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    Well, I paid $300 for this- so I want my all my money's worth out of it.

    Can't I put Windows 7 on this or something???
    What do you need to do that you can't do from webOS?

    Try using a non-tablet designed operating system on it (via Splashtop, or try Ubuntu or Android) and see how fun it is to use.
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
  10. #70  
    In that case, can I have your TouchPad?
    Author:
    Remove Messaging Beeps patch for webOS 3.0.5, Left/Right bezel gestures in LunaCE,
    Whazaa! Messenger and node-wa, SynerGV 1 and 2 - Google Voice integration, XO - Subsonic Commander media streamer, AB:S Launcher
    (1:39:33 PM) halfhalo: Android multitasking is like sticking your fingers into a blender
    GO OPEN WEBOS!
    People asked me for a donate link for my non-catalog work, so here you are:
    Rnp likes this.
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    I need to be connected with other people. iOS has the vibrant and wonderful user base.

    And that's why I bought an iPad 2 today. I will not wait.

    No one is essentially going to build an OS for HP. That's just stupid.
    when u say "connected with others" and "vibrant userbase" i cant help but wonder what you actually mean? from what you say its almost like describing some ios wide irc chat channel with them all chatting away with each other or giving back slaps all day.

    not sure i get what you meant.
    Rnp likes this.
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by C-Note View Post
    Try again, sir.
    Sigh ... I will try again, and be as blunt as possible:

    No one bought webOS phones. No one bought (pre-firesale) webOS tablets. Even when HP offered $100 off the Touchpad, no one rushed to grab one except for a tiny portion of the 2%. By all indications, no one wants webOS products. Sad, but true. If people here want to hang on to the idea that it was HP and not the public's apathy towards webOS that caused it to fail, so be it.

    HP could've sunk every penny they had into advertising, and it still would not have turned into an iPad.
    koolkid09, rmeigs and stung like this.
  13. #73  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    Well, I paid $300 for this- so I want my all my money's worth out of it.

    Can't I put Windows 7 on this or something???
    Seems like for $300, you pretty much got a good deal, unless you can buy another tablet for $300 with similar specs.

    Then the question would be:

    If you feel that strongly, why did you buy a Touchpad, especially after they were fire-saled?
    "Sometimes I feel like an OS-less child..."
    (with apologies to Billie Holiday )
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by jrstinkfish View Post
    Sigh ... I will try again, and be as blunt as possible:

    No one bought webOS phones. No one bought (pre-firesale) webOS tablets. Even when HP offered $100 off the Touchpad, no one rushed to grab one except for a tiny portion of the 2%. By all indications, no one wants webOS products. Sad, but true. If people here want to hang on to the idea that it was HP and not the public's apathy towards webOS that caused it to fail, so be it.

    HP could've sunk every penny they had into advertising, and it still would not have turned into an iPad.
    That still doesn't make it a logical procession of facts. Look up the concept of a syllogism, then determine the difference between "price" and "value". THEN refute the statements concerning the interest in the re-valued Touchpad. Why hasn't there been a similar interest in the heavily discounted Playbook. (And no, it's not just the $99 dollar price, check Craigslist and compare.)

    Lots of us were disappointed in how HP handled this entire affair, but I try not to let disappointment make me bitter.

    Speaking of illogical leaps, how are HP's handling and public apathy not connected, seriously? And if you are going to go that route, ask 10 of you non-tech friends to correctly name the operating system on an iPhone. Most can't... because they don't care.

    Give people a value that meets their needs and it could be the Commodore 64 OS on a tablet and they would buy it.

    If only a portion of the people on this forum rushed out to buy a Touchpad wouldn't that be proof that we are not all blind "follower-boys" (you know what I mean) as you seem to believe.

    And while you are looking things up, look up the difference between advertising and marketing... they too are different and that is being lost in your comments.
    "Sometimes I feel like an OS-less child..."
    (with apologies to Billie Holiday )
    jayteeee and Rnp like this.
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    I'm selling it at my local pawn shop. The going price was $70 last time I went, but if I can get $100- I'll may feel a little better. It's almost like paying $800 for a $500 iPad. And I wanted to wait for the 3.


    At this point, it's easier to hope that Apple works in multitasking, than wait for a company that you already know is inept to climb a mountain. The CEO already said this is a 4 year bid. That's when I said, "I'm done."

    I'm extremely dissatisfied. Just go to HPTouchPad.com and it will quickly become apparent that webOS is a product of neglect. There's nobody to talk to about webOS. Nobody knows what it is. Nobody uses it.

    Now if you go to Apple.com vs. HPTouchPad.com and the difference is mind boggling.

    Nope. Just waiting months and months and months and months for simple updates.

    I will not do.

    Again my question: If you are not happy with your buy, why not just buy a $300 Apple iPad? Or Buy an iPad at whatever the market price is? Or put iOS on your Touchpad?

    You know it was discontinued when you bought it, right?
    "Sometimes I feel like an OS-less child..."
    (with apologies to Billie Holiday )
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    If you've ever used Apple products you know they aim to please- and they're great at what they do- I already knew this. The apps for iPad are unlike anything else. When you have an Apple product- you feel/are connected. Virtually any app you use- you are connected to other people. It's a special connection with other Apple users.
    i fully investigated apples choice before i got a touchpad as an early adopter at full price, if i wanted their playstation like limited boxed in restricted tablet id have got it, the touchpad looked more open and had features at the OS level i wanted, this was entirely my own choice.

    as for this "all their apps make you connected to other apple users" that sounds like nonsensical marketing buzzword spiel that doesnt really make any realworld sense, the ipad got their first, has more apps, has another generation of hardware and there the "good/superior" stuff ends.

    Their plan for tablets is the same as for the mac, their made for the dumber generation to make things more simple for them, in the same way many once good games (wow and eve online and many more) get dumbed down from the technical/hardcore fans to the more numerical "casual/dumb/iwant.it.easy" userbase.

    PC's are more numerical than MAC's and more software is available on PC's than MAC's and their typically cheaper for the PC than the less numerical MAC, thus the old issue of "MORE APPS/GAMES/SOFTWARE = superior machine" comes into play.

    Same with the tablets, the ipad is simply more numerical than other tablets, like PC's vs MAC's, the MAC will never take over PC's in popularity so their seen as "Better", and the same way ipads are seen as "better" than any other tablets and nothing else will take over simply due to the massive quantity of software available on PC's and iPads, these 2 will reign supreme and all else will fail.

    Is a PC better than a Mac? who knows
    is a iPad better than all the other tablets? who knows

    Basically even if someone did want a Mac over a PC or a different tablet over an iPad, their in a small minority and will stay that way, because more software makes the superior device in the eyes of joe public random, joe public wont care what hardware specs they have, what OS they run, nor any other voodoo magic that makes a device technically superior to the competition, what joe random average wants is "SOFTWARE", lots and lots of software.
  17. #77  
    you have some well thought out opinions, but if you strip away most of whats said it still boils down to "more apps = the best", wed say the same of android if they got their first and had the most, or any other platform, be it phone/tablet/personal computer/console etc.

    It isnt right at all but thats how it is unfortunatly.
  18. laserboy's Avatar
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    #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    I'm selling it at my local pawn shop. The going price was $70 last time I went, but if I can get $100- I'll may feel a little better. It's almost like paying $800 for a $500 iPad. And I wanted to wait for the 3.



    There's nothing wrong with the HP TouchPad per-se but there's so much wrong with it. WebOS looks/feels unfinished. You're constantly waiting. Why? With Apple, you can use the product and it feels complete- yet you know updates are constantly rolling in.

    At this point, it's easier to hope that Apple works in multitasking, than wait for a company that you already know is inept to climb a mountain. The CEO already said this is a 4 year bid. That's when I said, "I'm done."



    If you've ever used Apple products you know they aim to please- and they're great at what they do- I already knew this. The apps for iPad are unlike anything else. When you have an Apple product- you feel/are connected. Virtually any app you use- you are connected to other people. It's a special connection with other Apple users.

    I'm extremely dissatisfied. Just go to HPTouchPad.com and it will quickly become apparent that webOS is a product of neglect. There's nobody to talk to about webOS. Nobody knows what it is. Nobody uses it.

    Now if you go to Apple.com vs. HPTouchPad.com and the difference is mind boggling.

    Nope. Just waiting months and months and months and months for simple updates.

    I will not do.
    whoa! I have plenty of apple devices. Hate em all! They are rigid, inflexible, nicely made, devices. But the user experience is like a straight jacket. He'll, I've have an old windows phone that had features "not allowed by that genius [sarcasm] Steve" on the iphone 4s! And don't get me started on OSX. But feeling like I'm part of something from using those apple devices? That would be pathetic.

    as for selling your HP at a pawn shop, to sell means choosing the right location go sell. You chose very poorly. That is your problem, not the HP's.
    jayteeee likes this.
  19. #79  
    What i find interesting is that the same people now so angry at HP and screaming about how bad the hardware is, how the software was alpha, and the price too high where all cheerleading the designs in March, claiming nothing was wrong with the software when it hit stores, posting before that that the price was just fine, mad at every review that came out and said those very same things. And truthfully what perplexes me is the line of reasoning that they argue HP released a bad product and blew it yet people should also love and buy this bad product. Regardless I find it interesting how the cheerleaders for HP's products early in the year have turned haters now who knew the products where bad all along.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
    koolkid09 likes this.
  20. #80  
    Whoa, why this the thread creator banned?

    In other news, I bought a crappy used car from somebody, sank a ton of money into it, and yet no one wants to buy the car off me. I'm way in debt now. I even have some of my popular friends saying how good it is. None of my friends want to buy it at a reduced price to try their hand at selling it. I've sold tons of cars and car parts over time, but why can't I sell this thing off? Maybe I'm actually bad at selling things despite what my track record says? Or maybe it's because I'm selling a Pinto? Members of the Pinto fan club all think the car's amazing!
    sinsin07 likes this.
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