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  1. #21  
    It's always interesting to see the postmortem comments compared to the pre launch and launch comments.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by laoh View Post
    This is why Playbook is sitting on the shelf right? B/c of the stellar hardware. Hardware is only the piece of the puzzle.
    Indeed. Add to that the fact that the Asus EEE Transorfmer is selling really well (especially in Europe) and that Asus is of much less quality plastic than the TP.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by C-Note View Post
    @inertia1

    But that is their mistake. People will buy smartphones before they buy tablets. People will buy smartphones every two years, but outside of tech nerds who buy new stuff consantly, I suspect tablets will be a longer term purchase. They had a much better chance to break into the smartphone market than the tablet market if they were not willing to a) take a long term strategy or b) dump lots of money into the effort.

    As far as ecosystems, there was (and still is) space to battle, but you need to have the vision to do it. Here was they path they could have taken to instant credibility:

    1) Make a reasonable effort to present a an entertainment device, with the goal of being good enough, as the concept of besting Apple in one release cycle is stupid. They (Apple) OWN the entertainment space. Not even Android can touch them.

    2) imagine of BEFORE they released the TP, they lined up:
    a) a cloud provider (like SugarSync),
    b) a document editing product (like Quick office or Piscel),
    c) a decent VPN client compatible with major VPN systems.
    d) the ability to tether with with ANY phone.

    3) Bundle the keyboard and charging stone (or make it seductively easy to purchase)

    Then in addition to the celebrity ads, show the ad with the executive typing on his keyboard and showing the tight screen shot of his document editor or him remoting into his office network.

    Have him running out to an appointment only then showing him picking up the Touchpad from the charging doc while his secretary continue to edit the document on her office PC. She assures him it will be completed by the time he get to his appointment.

    Show how easy it is to use the TP AND to sync documents. Show a card rocking Pandora and another with a map showing directions to his appointment. Have him print the directions to his HP printer. Show him answering the phone on his TP (or responding to a text message) while his phone is still in his briefcase. They HAD that ability, but executed on it poorly.

    (Box.net, a MUCH delayed doc editor release, a crappy VPN client, where was the print driver, among other faults)

    This is where they blew it. If you aspire to be a world class software as a service company, cloud service provider, if you are the worlds biggest PC maker and printer maker and you could not do what I described above when you had the pieces in place, you deserve to be where you are.

    If they had come in 'ready for business' as described above, they would have sold. I would have bought one for 600 dollars without blinking. And my company would have too. Please tell me why such a modest goal was not within the power of HP to accomplish, if they were more sharply focused?

    C
    Great vision, totally agree!

    One thing to add to your vision: release in more countries. By only releasing the Pre 2/3 and TP in select countries like they did, they limited their potential user base.
    C-Note, laserboy and Rnp like this.
  4. laserboy's Avatar
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    #24  
    yes, the whole TP debacle was brought on by the ceo myth. CEO's are so wise, which is why they deserve such high salaries. If you want to break into an established market, then you have to have loss leaders. We will sell the TP at a loss and recoup some through accessories like the touchstone but we are in for the long haul.

    now, I have an iPad as well as my TP. I prefer the TP for most things. But the iPad is the better built device. Screen is better, keyboard works better.

    one more note, HP seemed to be competing with ipad 1. Fools. I still can't believe they produced a device without video out for business use.
  5. #25  
    Pricing parity was the biggest miscalculation in their effort to fight ipad.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by Mutoidi View Post
    And a good indication too perhaps, of how insular and out of touch with 'real' reality the corporate 'Bored-room' mentality and it's self generated notions of 'success', can become!

    Perhaps Meg will now continue to breathe some fresher and more true aspirations into that room.

    Dude, is not that Meg droning? Her problem is she has a view on world that is strongly tinged with brown (corporate bull****): "no risk to be taken", "1-2 years are too long, need the money now." Well. The world has changed, but not the American "classic corporate culture". New flowers will grow on remnants of dead monsters. And turn into trees.

    It's a classic problem of values hierarchy. Truly satisfying Product is not on 1st place
  7. moegumby's Avatar
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    #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by laoh View Post
    This is why Playbook is sitting on the shelf right? B/c of the stellar hardware. Hardware is only the piece of the puzzle.
    True, a software update can fix the Playbook. Hardware is completely different, Junk in Junk out! Playbook has excellent hardware, great build quality and a screen second to none. Touchpad? Reincarnated Pre plastic garbage. No matter how good Webos is, (and I love it) it can't change hardware flaws.
  8. moegumby's Avatar
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    #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by Vistaus View Post
    Indeed. Add to that the fact that the Asus EEE Transorfmer is selling really well (especially in Europe) and that Asus is of much less quality plastic than the TP.
    Have used all the pads, Ipad2, own a Playbook, touchpad and transformer. The transformer is way better built than the Touchpad. Not to mention there's a billion andriod phone owners out there that want a tablet to match, hence the good sales. Why do you think the IPad does so well, millions of IPhone owners wanting the same platform in a tablet.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by Moegumby View Post
    No folks, it was the hardware, biggest hunk of crap plastic ever released. If HP would have done it right with IPad or Playbook quality hardware, Webos would have been better received.
    it's not just the hardware, it was the limited amount of apps and support the software had. IMO both palm & hp dropped the ball. webos should of been open source from the get go. ive had alot of time to think about this and this is my stance. my opinion on what will happen with webos? it will be torn apart and part of it will be added to android and other operating systems. we will see ports of a full webos on other phones? might happen but im not seeing alot of interest from anyone as of now.
  10. #30  
    Why is the OP showing up as "banned"?
    Vistaus and Rnp like this.
  11. #31  
    Why is it so hard for some to simply see that the Touchpad didn't connect?

    The hindsight coulda shoulda woulda posts here have no bearing on the real world and nothing supports that any of these ideas would have worked any better. They are pure speculation.
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by Vistaus
    Quote Originally Posted by C-Note
    @inertia1

    But that is their mistake. People will buy smartphones before they buy tablets. People will buy smartphones every two years, but outside of tech nerds who buy new stuff consantly, I suspect tablets will be a longer term purchase. They had a much better chance to break into the smartphone market than the tablet market if they were not willing to a) take a long term strategy or b) dump lots of money into the effort.

    As far as ecosystems, there was (and still is) space to battle, but you need to have the vision to do it. Here was they path they could have taken to instant credibility:

    1) Make a reasonable effort to present a an entertainment device, with the goal of being good enough, as the concept of besting Apple in one release cycle is stupid. They (Apple) OWN the entertainment space. Not even Android can touch them.

    2) imagine of BEFORE they released the TP, they lined up:

    a) a cloud provider (like SugarSync),
    b) a document editing product (like Quick office or Piscel),
    c) a decent VPN client compatible with major VPN systems.
    d) the ability to tether with with ANY phone.

    3) Bundle the keyboard and charging stone (or make it seductively easy to purchase)

    Then in addition to the celebrity ads, show the ad with the executive typing on his keyboard and showing the tight screen shot of his document editor or him remoting into his office network.

    Have him running out to an appointment only then showing him picking up the Touchpad from the charging doc while his secretary continue to edit the document on her office PC. She assures him it will be completed by the time he get to his appointment.

    Show how easy it is to use the TP AND to sync documents. Show a card rocking Pandora and another with a map showing directions to his appointment. Have him print the directions to his HP printer. Show him answering the phone on his TP (or responding to a text message) while his phone is still in his briefcase. They HAD that ability, but executed on it poorly.

    (Box.net, a MUCH delayed doc editor release, a crappy VPN client, where was the print driver, among other faults)

    This is where they blew it. If you aspire to be a world class software as a service company, cloud service provider, if you are the worlds biggest PC maker and printer maker and you could not do what I described above when you had the pieces in place, you deserve to be where you are.

    If they had come in 'ready for business' as described above, they would have sold. I would have bought one for 600 dollars without blinking. And my company would have too. Please tell me why such a modest goal was not within the power of HP to accomplish, if they were more sharply focused?
    C
    Great vision, totally agree!

    One thing to add to your vision: release in more countries. By only releasing the Pre 2/3 and TP in select countries like they did, they limited their potential user base.
    Wow! Serious, I cannot say better!

    Software, hardware, blablablaware... forget all this! This was not the real problem.

    The *real* problem was the PRICE! The HP netbooks sells more than Macbook Air and not because is better, more beautifull or more potent, but because is cheaper. The same way, the Touchpad "could" be worst than other tablets - and I don't think - but low price was the "magic" to sell thousands of thousands...

    Oh, yes... the other REAL problem was the "worst CEO of decade", of course...

    PS: Look that we STILL have't Sugarsync client...
    "If A Man Isn't Willing To Take Some Risk For His Opinions, Either His Opinions Are No Good Or He's No Good!" - Ezra Pound (Poet & Critic)
    (Happy A Lot, As A Good Carioca!)
    Vistaus likes this.
  13. #33  
    Did they really think they would be #2 within 49 days of getting to market with what they had?
    Man... If was released in June/July/August the 16GB/32GB as $199.00/$239.00 the first 1.000.000 unities in bigger countries of the world (USA, UK, Germany, Italy, France, Spain, Brazil, India, etc) and after go to $239.00/$279.00 the second 1.000.000 unities... who knows?

    The customers like to believe that can gain advantages, and this can be a way. I don't know if really works or not, but only after the fire sale the Amazon annouced the Kindle Fire with low price...

    I live in Brazil and the HP or PALM NEVER sent some webOS device to here, and do you wanna know how much the IPhone 4s 64GB here? Look the screenshot from Apple Brasil and convert from Brazilian Real (R$) to dolar...




    Best Regards...
    "If A Man Isn't Willing To Take Some Risk For His Opinions, Either His Opinions Are No Good Or He's No Good!" - Ezra Pound (Poet & Critic)
    (Happy A Lot, As A Good Carioca!)
    GuyFromNam likes this.
  14. sarlo100's Avatar
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    #34  
    That's highway robbery, Rnp. Do you at least get a complimentary Movado watch at those prices? Will US models work down there?

    /Brazilian real is .539 of a dollar. Making an iphone somewhere between US $1300-1800 in Brazil.
    Last edited by sarlo100; 12/21/2011 at 10:00 AM. Reason: misspelling
    Rnp likes this.
  15. #35  
    Making an iphone somewhere between US $1300-1800 in Brazil.
    Welcome to our suffering...

    Any GSM Simunlocked devices work here. :mrgreen:

    But we have a "special" business model that works only here: stratospheric installment... and the carriers plans, of course!

    Well, we have here; in Brazil, the most expensive cars, Big Macs, IPods and many other products... but we HAVEN'T the most expensive webOS Devices!!


    Best Regards...
    "If A Man Isn't Willing To Take Some Risk For His Opinions, Either His Opinions Are No Good Or He's No Good!" - Ezra Pound (Poet & Critic)
    (Happy A Lot, As A Good Carioca!)
  16. #36  
    I think we're missing the most obvious reason the Touchpad failed -- no one wanted a webOS device except the 1% webOS faithful. The phones sold like crap, so it's no wonder the tablet also sold like crap. Yes, yes I know, at $99 they sold like crazy, but that was due to the perceived value of a $500 device dropping to $99. Even if it had been $300, chances are it would've still collected dust on store shelves.

    The Touchpad was doomed the moment it was conceived as a webOS tablet.
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by synthos View Post
    Did they really think they would be #2 within 49 days of getting to market with what they had?
    When the largest US retailer returns 250,000 due to lack of sales, it's over.

    It's pretty simple to see what ultimately led to the fire sale blowout and end of the line.
  18. alan sh's Avatar
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    #38  
    When it first came out there were 2 things wrong.

    1. As people have said - the pricer was just plain wrong. If it had been $199 - no issues.
    2. The software was 3.0.0 - and it had bugs in it. So, it got "interesting" reviews. Everyone loved the Webos concept, but not the implementation.

    Of course, there were not many apps then either, but that would have been fixed if the other two things weren't there.

    Will it ever recover? Is it too late? Who knows? All we can do is hope that open sourcing will bring the final "sparkle" which the faithful are waiting for (and I include me in that sentiment).

    Alan
  19. #39  
    no one wanted a webOS device except the 1% webOS faithful.
    No one needs a Tablet PC, but the people still buying. And a big number don't know what to do with IPad, Galaxy Tab, Iconia, etc, etc, etc...

    When the largest US retailer returns 250,000 due to lack of sales, it's over.
    Until now, this story is not really explained... I the HP put to sell 1.000.000 unities, gonna leave 25% in only one channel and 75% in all other channels, his website included?

    And nobody and no other source has confirmed this hoax.

    Will it ever recover? Is it too late? Who knows? All we can do is hope that open sourcing will bring the final "sparkle" which the faithful are waiting for (and I include me in that sentiment).
    Well, I have a friend that say "the end only finished when is finished"...

    Until release the code and we know if gonna be new hardware, all that we can really do is wait...


    Best Regards...
    "If A Man Isn't Willing To Take Some Risk For His Opinions, Either His Opinions Are No Good Or He's No Good!" - Ezra Pound (Poet & Critic)
    (Happy A Lot, As A Good Carioca!)
    Vistaus likes this.
  20. #40  
    When the largest US retailer returns 250,000 due to lack of sales, it's over.
    wasnt the return only after HP/leo announced they were dumping/abandoning pretty much everything, so no shocks there, any company would want to return defunct hardware even if it was firesales after that.
    Vistaus likes this.
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