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  1. laserboy's Avatar
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       #1  
    I see it bandied about that HP has 500+ webOS employees.

    Here's my question: if there are all these employees, what are they doing? I mean the update and app production rate of HP is less than a single person software developer.

    with this number of employees, I feel I should have seen an update to the facebook app, a netflix port, updating kindle (I know that is Amazon's, but HP could take it over).

    the is should be seeing multiple updates.

    so why are there so many employees and we see little output?
    trowany likes this.
  2. #2  
    If you've ever worked in a development role, you wouldn't say that.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

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  3. laserboy's Avatar
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       #3  
    fortunately, I never have just a hobbyists. But I have worked with small companies that fix their product weekly! So honestly, I would hope HP could move more swiftly.

    imagine if they put out a netflix app how much less whining there would be!
  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToniCipriani View Post
    If you've ever worked in a development role, you wouldn't say that.
    I may not have worked in a software development role myself. But even then, it is hard to imagine 500 people working on the pitiful development that webOS has received since July, when the TouchPad was first released. It really does not seem like there are more than a handful of developers working on webOS.
    Pre3 (AT&T meta-doctored to ROW) webOS 2.2.4 build 3175
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    Treo 180 > 270 > 600 > 650 > 680 > Pre+ > Pre2 > Pre+ > Pre3 & tPad
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by laserboy View Post
    fortunately, I never have just a hobbyists. But I have worked with small companies that fix their product weekly! So honestly, I would hope HP could move more swiftly.

    imagine if they put out a netflix app how much less whining there would be!
    I can tell you it's the exact opposite as the company gets larger. You have to go through LEVELS of approvals, reviews, etc. before anything goes through.

    Besides, developing an OS is way different than pushing out an app.
    Palm IIIc -> Sony CLIÉ T650C -> Sony TJ-37 -> Palm TX -> Palm Centro -> Palm Pre Bell -> Palm Pre Plus Bell/Verizon Hybrid -> HP Veer -> HP Pre 3 NA -> BlackBerry Classic -> BlackBerry Priv

    It's a Late Goodbye, such a Late Goodbye.

    Need OEM Palm Pre parts? See here
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  6. laserboy's Avatar
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       #6  
    I kinda figured that. Funny how a bureaucracy kills productivity. So many forms. I have seen this in many companies. Safety training takes priority and the like, but core mission is forgotten.

    but they should be fixing bugs faster. Also, they could develop and update apps. I want netflix and they could have had it by now. I have seen little else come out.

    look, if your job was on the chopping block, would you not work to save it? I have this mental image of the webOS crew sitting around and chewing their nails.

    don't get me wrong, I like webOS. I prefer my TP to my iPad which is so frustrating to use. But I think they should be pulling out stops, not slowing down.
    trowany, darkzone and xandros9 like this.
  7. #7  
    I've heard a rumbling that there are still some apps in production at HP, last I knew, there were also still people that were technically working on the apps that come with your devices, the Kindle .. there are also people working on at least two different versions of the operating system (3.0.x, 2.2.x). There are people that work the app review process, people that work the developer support, people that work on Enyo . . . and now there's going to be people working on getting the source codes for everything ready for release. Among all of this, there are people leaving HP-Palm (gasp!). I seriously, seriously, doubt that anyone who leaves is getting replaced by a new hire, unless their position is absolutely critical, and cannot be done by anyone else.

    Add to that, that corporations absolutely do not move nearly as fast as individuals, and there you have it. An absolute ton of work to be done, and you're complaining about a Netflix app. :P As far as I'm aware, the writing of the Netflix apps is all entrusted to one particular company, that handles them all, and it's totally not up to HP (or anyone other than Netflix) to develop an app for our platform. And with Netflix's financial woes, they sure as hell aren't going to take on development for a platform that will, most likely, starting having a negative gain of users for the foreseeable future.
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    GO OPEN WEBOS!
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  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by laserboy View Post
    fortunately, I never have just a hobbyists. But I have worked with small companies that fix their product weekly! So honestly, I would hope HP could move more swiftly.

    imagine if they put out a netflix app how much less whining there would be!
    If there would have been more updates and a Netflix app I would have kept my touchpad an not have bought an iPad. My guess would be those 500 employees are sitting on their ***. Or maybe HP doesn't give a **** about all the peolple that bought their product. At least apple seems to care about their customers. Now that webOS is open source maybe other hardware manufacturers would put webOS on their devices(wouldn't hold my breath on that, but you never know).
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueBellThunder View Post
    If there would have been more updates and a Netflix app I would have kept my touchpad an not have bought an iPad. My guess would be those 500 employees are sitting on their ***. Or maybe HP doesn't give a **** about all the peolple that bought their product. At least apple seems to care about their customers. Now that webOS is open source maybe other hardware manufacturers would put webOS on their devices(wouldn't hold my breath on that, but you never know).
    Not that I want ruin your happiness but you paid for it buddy. And you will continue to pay (not only with currency).

    P.S. I found iPod touch and I really wanted to returned it to the owner...my last attempt was to call apple. They found the owner, but they refused to give me his phone/email and refused to call or email the guy with my info. Is that a company that cares about it's customers? All they care is about your money...
    ArchonAdvisors likes this.
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by laserboy View Post
    I see it bandied about that HP has 500+ webOS employees.

    Here's my question: if there are all these employees, what are they doing? I mean the update and app production rate of HP is less than a single person software developer.

    with this number of employees, I feel I should have seen an update to the facebook app, a netflix port, updating kindle (I know that is Amazon's, but HP could take it over).

    the is should be seeing multiple updates.

    so why are there so many employees and we see little output?
    HP may have 500+ employees who are in someway affiliated with webOS, but that doesn't mean there are 500+ software developers working on webOS.

    There are Services employees who maintain and manage the cloud, there is software developers, content developmental teams, support operations staff, etc.

    I would like to ensure you that the HP webOS team is doing everything we can to ensure the software is successful, we are diligently on addressing as many issues as we can. Now, although people would love to see an update every month so we can fix a bug here and there it is just not feasible. We can not in any fashion go an update per bug route, we have to roadmap it out and try to get as many bug fixes as we can into each update while also maintaining a reasonable work schedule and product sanctification as possible.

    So let's say we are due for alpha testing of an update. Alpha testing will launch our software engineering group will get the feedback and address the bugs that are found, and put out the second stage of the update, then we go through it again and oh wait..something else broke so now we have to go back and fix that again. What once looked like an easy task of just doing a quick test and pushing out an update turns into an update that goes through alpha / beta testing for a month.

    So while you may be upset that there is 500+ people who work for HP that you are not satisfied with their production. I assure you we are all very productive, it just doesn't always show to the common outside eye.
    Ex HP webOS Tech Support

    5Ts: Five ways to get your webOS tablet working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/5Ts

    6Ts: Six ways to get your webOS phone working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/6Ts
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueBellThunder View Post
    If there would have been more updates and a Netflix app I would have kept my touchpad an not have bought an iPad. My guess would be those 500 employees are sitting on their ***. Or maybe HP doesn't give a **** about all the peolple that bought their product. At least apple seems to care about their customers. Now that webOS is open source maybe other hardware manufacturers would put webOS on their devices(wouldn't hold my breath on that, but you never know).
    Although it's hard for me to say you are correct, but a good portion of my day is spent sitting.
    Ex HP webOS Tech Support

    5Ts: Five ways to get your webOS tablet working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/5Ts

    6Ts: Six ways to get your webOS phone working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/6Ts
    CvvB and geekpeter like this.
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by djsvetljo View Post
    Not that I want ruin your happiness but you paid for it buddy. And you will continue to pay (not only with currency).

    P.S. I found iPod touch and I really wanted to returned it to the owner...my last attempt was to call apple. They found the owner, but they refused to give me his phone/email and refused to call or email the guy with my info. Is that a company that cares about it's customers? All they care is about your money...
    Agree with above, and with Apple they have a tendency to make you pay for those firmware upgrades.
    ArchonAdvisors likes this.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by HardBeatZ View Post
    HP may have 500+ employees who are in someway affiliated with webOS, but that doesn't mean there are 500+ software developers working on webOS.
    It takes a lot of people to keep something like WebOS going forward. I understand.

    What would be nice to the loyal customers would be to post some types of updates on the status of all WebOS programs.

    We realize that timelines are almost impossible to predict but it would be nice to know if they are even working on some projects like Is TTS even coming to Veer? Is there going to be an 2.2.4 update or is development put on hold?
    Will we ever be able to connect anything to the USB port other than a PC?
  14. #14  
    "Everything's Easy When Seen From Outside..."


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  15. #15  
    Company A - 500 employees

    Executive staff - 15-20

    Management staff - 50-100

    Janitorial staff - 20

    Security staff - 5

    Phone staff - 50

    Support staff - 50-100

    Employees with redundant roles - 200

    Dev staff - 5-20
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  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by ToniCipriani View Post
    I can tell you it's the exact opposite as the company gets larger. You have to go through LEVELS of approvals, reviews, etc. before anything goes through.

    Besides, developing an OS is way different than pushing out an app.
    How true it is. One thing to keep in mind when you ask for speed is, speed can make many bugs. I don't know about you, but bugs are more frustrating than the lack of apps.
    **Intelligence is God given; Wisdom is the sum of our mistakes!**

    • As a top contributor to the HP Consumer Support Forums, HP provides me access to the Tochpad at no charge so I may better respond to the questions raised on the Forum.
  17. #17  
    I understand HeartBeatZ's point but I would hope he/she realises that the bugs in 3.0.4 should not have been left out in the field this long. They aren't insignificant. At the same time, if they learned their lesson after releasing 3.0.4 and are better scrutinizing the next release, that is a dang good reason to wait, but they need to say so. It's been bad enough for long enough to just leave it hanging out there.

    If there are significant updates and features coming, that's even better, but as long as there are no updates on the progress it will continue to look ... Bad. So far, all we can hear are the crickets.
    MikeM2010 likes this.
  18. #18  
    Finally one of you HP guys to talk to. So what is the roadmap? Where is the software on current devices going from here? How do the updates get tested and why do they come with more bugs like the sound bug and the removal of delete trash from email? Do you see the phones and tablets as completed devices or lacking?

    I guess what I wanna know do you guys and gals from inside believe in WebOS and HP, or do you have IPads and Macbook Airs too. Back in the day GM's inside culture was to dislike those who drove non-GM vehicles, because it meant not only did you like a competitor, but you did not believe in the work in your fellow employees (not to mention you were turning down a sick employee discount lol). That went away in a lot of companies. Apple has it, and they may seem harsh, but it keeps them with that mindset of believing in their products. We need to believe in something as customers too. Otherwise what's the point. I will have to upgrade my phone soon just to keep up with current consumer trends in apps. Oovoo, voxer, ect...Even if I found a Pre 3 I would be behind the times. Open source isn't going to solve this problem.
    Quote Originally Posted by HardBeatZ View Post
    HP may have 500+ employees who are in someway affiliated with webOS, but that doesn't mean there are 500+ software developers working on webOS.

    There are Services employees who maintain and manage the cloud, there is software developers, content developmental teams, support operations staff, etc.

    I would like to ensure you that the HP webOS team is doing everything we can to ensure the software is successful, we are diligently on addressing as many issues as we can. Now, although people would love to see an update every month so we can fix a bug here and there it is just not feasible. We can not in any fashion go an update per bug route, we have to roadmap it out and try to get as many bug fixes as we can into each update while also maintaining a reasonable work schedule and product sanctification as possible.

    So let's say we are due for alpha testing of an update. Alpha testing will launch our software engineering group will get the feedback and address the bugs that are found, and put out the second stage of the update, then we go through it again and oh wait..something else broke so now we have to go back and fix that again. What once looked like an easy task of just doing a quick test and pushing out an update turns into an update that goes through alpha / beta testing for a month.

    So while you may be upset that there is 500+ people who work for HP that you are not satisfied with their production. I assure you we are all very productive, it just doesn't always show to the common outside eye.
    Last edited by trowany; 12/20/2011 at 12:52 PM.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by trowany View Post
    Finally one of you HP guys to talk to. So what is the roadmap? Where is the software on current devices going from here? How do the updates get tested and why do they come with more bugs like the sound bug and the removal of delete trash from email? Do you see the phones and tablets as completed devices or lacking?

    I guess what I wanna know do you guys and gals from inside believe in WebOS and HP, or do you have IPads and Ma
    Well I can tell you that I'm not going to go around HP and do a poll so I can't tell you what the guys and gals from the inside believe in webOS, but if you want my opinion then it is software that is going to mold the future of the tablet market. Whether it is the software that tablets in 2015 will be running on I don't know or wish to speculate, but I can say with every ounce of belief that it will be a source of significant impact on the OS that will be running on those tablets.

    Now to address your questions.

    So what is the roadmap?
    HP like Palm has historically not announced product roadmaps, while it's understood that as customers this is wanted. It's not something that is often feasible. You can keep an eye out on the official HP newsroom for any announcements we are prepared to make
    HP News, Technology News, Videos, Podcasts | HP Newsroom

    Where is the software on current devices going from here?
    The software as a whole is going Open Source. This will include current devices and any future devices. As to what impact HP will play in that role, it has not been stated and at this time HP is not prepared to make any further announcements that what has already been stated.

    How do the updates get tested and why do they come with more bugs like the sound bug and the removal of delete trash from email?
    Every update is tested internally by our engineering group and by members of HP, this test is often pushed out to a "friends and family" approach when possible, but not always. As for the software coming with bugs, this happens because nothing is perfect.

    Do you see the phones and tablets as completed devices or lacking?
    Every tablet on the market today is lacking something.
    Ex HP webOS Tech Support

    5Ts: Five ways to get your webOS tablet working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/5Ts

    6Ts: Six ways to get your webOS phone working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/6Ts
    sinsin07 and geekpeter like this.
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueBellThunder View Post
    ...wouldn't hold my breath on that...
    Actually, we insist. For the love of humanity, PLEASE hold your breath.
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