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  1. #21  
    The point is that the price point that people are willing to pay (even now for a discontinued product) is significantly higher than HP let loose on the world during the fire sale. There is a huge possibility that people only became aware of the TP because of the fire sale, but the fact still stands that people ARE aware of it now and are willing to pay reasonably for it. If the whole knock on webOS and the TP is that there aren't enough apps to make the ecosystem sustainable then that is something that could be easily remedied. What you have here is a product in high demand, that could be sold right now at a decent penetration price point, even without the "ecosystem" to support it currently. It is simple to see how gaining market share in this manner could be a viable option to get a strong foot in the door of a relatively new technology which is currently dominated by a single player.

    That is all.

    It just proves that the product is still viable for a company interested in a strategic vision. A multi-billion dollar company could easily lose a couple hundred million to gain a high market share in a brand new, growing, competitive environment. It is easy to see how that would pay dividends down the line.
  2.    #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by k4ever View Post
    The point was made that people who save money on cheap products, in this case tablets, have the extra funds to buy more apps/content. That point was made in these forums several times by folks saying there is the potential for app revenue with the 1 million TouchPads in actual users hands. I agree with that point and from your statement it looks like you agree to. Of course unless those rules don't apply to HP and just Amazon. No one knows what HP's business model was with the TouchPad (to include HP). What we suggested as a possible source of revenue for HP is the exact same thing that Amazon is doing. That is making money (up to 30% if they were greedy) off of selling apps, books, and multimedia content delivered to the tablet, since HP has total control over the delivery of that content.
    Hi,

    I agree with you that's what I've maintained from the minute HP's name was mentioned...In fact what I said exactly was HP should have purchased palm/webOS ONLY if they had a deal in place or in concert with Amazon, b/c Amazon had a pipeline already in place...My guess is that mark Hurd wanted to not just use webOS as a common thread thru all of HP, he found a way to make the Computer Div profitable....

    The printer div is profitable only b/c they sell so much ink & paper....

    My guess it that's what he wanted to do with webOS with smartphones and pads....just as Apple did....

    Sadly Hurd was fired because he needed his zipper welded shut and Leo-no-brains screwed everything up.


    Take care,

    jay
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
    k4ever likes this.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by midmofan View Post
    Amazon has realized at an entry level price of $199 they will grab a huge chunk of the market - even if they will lose a bit on each device - and make up for that by selling other stuff (I also would not be surprised if we see a Fire+ sometime with more memory or whatever at $249).
    I doubt Amazon is losing money on their sales for the Fire. They might be breaking even or only making a small margin but considering how many hardware features are missing from the tablet I doubt they are selling at a loss.
  4.    #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by Orion Antares View Post
    I doubt Amazon is losing money on their sales for the Fire. They might be breaking even or only making a small margin but considering how many hardware features are missing from the tablet I doubt they are selling at a loss.
    Hi, actually Amazon is losing a little on each unit...but they will make up for it in a number of ways:

    1. Amazon Prime members buy 20% more once they become members than before they were members due to the no extra charge for shipping...which they lose on me every year since it came out....I joined Amazon prime the day it was first offered....by about the 3rd month into the 12 months.... I have already recouped my $79 a year fee by saving on shipping and the rest of the year's orders costs nothing in shipping fees...plus it takes max 2 days often faster.

    By lumping in ebooks, apps etc. with the free shipping and video streaming they are buying brand loyalty even from people who wouldn't have popped for the Amazon Prime just for the shipping as I did.....so these people are getting free shipping FREE for a year...these days shipping costs are so high....I'm sure these new Amazon Prime customers will think of shopping at Amazon first!

    I know this is hurting other firms....for example William-Sonoma is now offering a similar deal... I do buy from them 3 or 4 times a year...but b/c they are so expensive it doesn't pay to give them an annual fee....9 times out of ten the same item is on Amazon for less money!

    2. the will make it up on Apps, ebooks, music & video downloads etc...

    Take care,

    Jay
    PS. When Amazon first set up Amazon Prime, they did tell stockholders that they thought they would more than make up the difference...if it didn't work out they would drop the idea the following year...the stockholders weren't generally pleased with the idea until the first years numbers came in and then they all LOVED it!
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by ilovedessert View Post
    Hi, actually Amazon is losing a little on each unit...but they will make up for it in a number of ways:
    I'm skeptical of what those "analysts" say about that. I'd only believe they're taking a loss on those sales if I saw it coming from Amazon's own numbers.
  6. #26  
    Due to the increased visibility of the product that the Fire sale caused, I think HP should and is probably at least considering another run at this.

    Touch Pads are selling now on E-bay for $235-$270. These are new units sold by reputable E-Bay retailers and are able to be registered for full HP warranty. I know, I just bought one of the 16GB models for 234.99, which included a free leather case.

    I know several people with I-pads and have used them myself. I truly like the I-PAD, but I can't justify the price. I feel the Touch pad gave me everything that an I-PAD would offer me for less than half the price. Of course, that is based on my use.

    If HP were to re-introduce the Touch Pad at a lower price point, say $249 and $299 respectively, I honestly believe that now it would outsell the I-PAD and the Kindle Fire. The price point would be close to break even, but the key to making profits would be in maintaining webOS and selling proprietary apps AND services. I think it would be even more likely to succeed with a 3G/4G upgrade option for another $50.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by bassic83 View Post
    We'll see if the KF dominates...I think there will be a lot of them on Fleabay shortly after people realize it's not the Android they've been looking for.
    I'm surprisingly looking forward to the Kindle Fire. The Amazon appstore has a nice selection of apps. I've had an iPad, and now have a touchpad and will say that tablets don't even really need that many apps. Just a good web browser that supports flash, an email client (hello playbook?), about 50 or so well written apps, and future support. I think the fire will succeed with all of that stuff. I don't need a camera on either side as I have so many other devices that I can use to video chat or take pictures with.

    I will say this. I don't think the Fire is going to impact apple just yet but it is going to hurt companies like Asus, Acer, Lenovo, and the rest because the Fire has something that they don't. And that's an appstore that makes money. Nintendo and Netflix are also going to take a hit as my own daughters want a Kindle Fire instead of a 3DS, and a lot of people are going to deflect to Amazon Prime and ditch Netflix streaming. I mean why have two, when the other gives you free second day shipping. Lol I sound like a damn amazon commercial. Sorry for rambling. I'd buy the Touchpad again for $200, and I'm also going to be getting a Fire. Maybe apple will be in trouble after all because I think the Fire is going to really change things.
  8. #28  
    Well it seems there is another dimension with tablets -how expensive is ownership of each tablet? Apple, Google and Amazon are offering similar services and soon people will start looking best deal services offer from each of them. Soon, deciding factor will not be only UX and device performance, but also monthly cost of similar services on various platforms.
    cgk likes this.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by chalx View Post
    Well it seems there is another dimension with tablets -how expensive is ownership of each tablet? Apple, Google and Amazon are offering similar services and soon people will start looking best deal services offer from each of them. Soon, deciding factor will not be only UX and device performance, but also monthly cost of similar services on various platforms.
    I think that is a good point. It cost me 30 or so in the first week owning the Touchpad buying apps. Better apps were available for less or free with android
  10. #30  
    Just a few things...

    1. The TPad's were the #2 and #7 BEST SELLING devices on Amazon at $299 and $399. This is a FACT. That pricing point only lasted 3 days. Also during that time the TPad became the HIGHEST RATED tablet over ALL included the magical iPad (I know, I know, they were all Shills... )

    2. People said "Not one dev will make an app for the TPad now." FALSE. There are over 1000 TPad optimized apps in the catalog. People said "These firesale buyers are cheap and won't buy apps." FALSE. App sales are up as much as 10 times over previous periods to the point BIG NAME devs\comps are releasing apps. (and its not the "pipeline" theory, I've worked in IT for 18+ years and when a project platform is dropped, even if app development was in UAT at the time, it stops there..NO company will "continue because its in the pipeline" unless there is an SOW\Contract mandating release.)


    That is all...
  11. bxborn31's Avatar
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    #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by jcarenz View Post
    Due to the increased visibility of the product that the Fire sale caused, I think HP should and is probably at least considering another run at this.

    Touch Pads are selling now on E-bay for $235-$270. These are new units sold by reputable E-Bay retailers and are able to be registered for full HP warranty. I know, I just bought one of the 16GB models for 234.99, which included a free leather case.

    I know several people with I-pads and have used them myself. I truly like the I-PAD, but I can't justify the price. I feel the Touch pad gave me everything that an I-PAD would offer me for less than half the price. Of course, that is based on my use.

    If HP were to re-introduce the Touch Pad at a lower price point, say $249 and $299 respectively, I honestly believe that now it would outsell the I-PAD and the Kindle Fire. The price point would be close to break even, but the key to making profits would be in maintaining webOS and selling proprietary apps AND services. I think it would be even more likely to succeed with a 3G/4G upgrade option for another $50.
    HP would have to redesign it. They felt cheap. Sold both of my TPs and got an ipad. My main tablet is an eee pad though.

    Sent from my Samsung galaxy S2 using Tapatalk
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by bxborn31 View Post
    HP would have to redesign it. They felt cheap. Sold both of my TPs and got an ipad. My main tablet is an eee pad though.

    Sent from my Samsung galaxy S2 using Tapatalk
    Man to me that defies logic. You sold two touchpads which probably cost you 200 bucks total for an ipad which would require you to spend an extra 300 for one less tablet which has less capabilities? So you ended up with 1 tablet, spent 300 dollars more, for a tablet that can't even render flash websites? For something a few mm thinner? Yikes, I don't know about you, but I prefer not to burn my cash.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by Weaser999 View Post
    Man to me that defies logic. You sold two touchpads which probably cost you 200 bucks total for an ipad which would require you to spend an extra 300 for one less tablet which has less capabilities? So you ended up with 1 tablet, spent 300 dollars more, for a tablet that can't even render flash websites? For something a few mm thinner? Yikes, I don't know about you, but I prefer not to burn my cash.
    I can only assume from you post that you do not have an IPad? Yes, the lack of flash is a bind, put in other respects it far better product than the TP. It is simply in a different league.

    Its battery lasts longer, it has far more and often cheaper apps. The standard of construction is far higher (no cracks). So am I an Apple fan? No, certainly not, but I am a realist. Personally I prefer Android.

    I like my TP and use it a lot, great OS, but it is simply no competition to the IPad (unless it is cheap)
  14. rlopin's Avatar
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    #34  
    I can only assume from you post that you do not have an IPad? Yes, the lack of flash is a bind, put in other respects it far better product than the TP. It is simply in a different league.

    Its battery lasts longer, it has far more and often cheaper apps. The standard of construction is far higher (no cracks). So am I an Apple fan? No, certainly not, but I am a realist. Personally I prefer Android.

    I like my TP and use it a lot, great OS, but it is simply no competition to the IPad (unless it is cheap)
    Well, that is certainly a valid argument based on your experience. As for me, I bought 6 touchpads for self, wife and 3 kids (ages 8, 8 and 10), plus 1 as a backup device. I got 4 x 32 GB and 2 x 16 GB. After rebates total cost per touchpad averaged $100. I immediately bought cases and sleeves for all. Not a single crack so far. So for roughly the price of a single iPad3 I got a tablet for each family member. This is the best value I have ever had.
    Phones>Ericsson->iPaq->Treo700w>>PalmPre & TouchPad<<PC<-Amiga<-C64<-Vic20<-PET<Computers
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by rnld View Post
    It's not available anywhere else outside of Ebay and Craigslist and these sales are from people selling the extra units they bought.
    ...the keyword above is, they are SELLING them at that price, even if the devices are discontinued, without any future. People are happy to pay that price, and do not care about apps/support/ecosystem/whatever.
  16. #36  
    My Mom has a little POS Android tablet she paid $180 for at Barnes and Noble. I'm home on vacation visiting and I brought my TouchPad. I showed her my TouchPad and she likes it. She wanted to replace her cheap Android tablet but did not want to spend $600 on an iPad. I pulled up the Amazon website (on my TouchPad) and showed her the flash video on the Kindle Fire. She was not interested. I couldn't believe it. She told me she wanted the TouchPad. I told her the TouchPad was discontinued. She still wanted it. I was going to post here last night asking what should I do, let her get the TouchPad or try to convince her further into getting something else. Before I could do that my Dad handed me his credit card and told me to order the TouchPad. I tried to deter him but he told me it was what my Mom wanted. I ended up ordering a 32GB Touchpad from Amazon for $274, which included shipping.
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by k4ever View Post
    My Mom has a little POS Android tablet she paid $180 for at Barnes and Noble. I'm home on vacation visiting and I brought my TouchPad. I showed her my TouchPad and she likes it. She wanted to replace her cheap Android tablet but did not want to spend $600 on an iPad. I pulled up the Amazon website (on my TouchPad) and showed her the flash video on the Kindle Fire. She was not interested. I couldn't believe it. She told me she wanted the TouchPad. I told her the TouchPad was discontinued. She still wanted it. I was going to post here last night asking what should I do, let her get the TouchPad or try to convince her further into getting something else. Before I could do that my Dad handed me his credit card and told me to order the TouchPad. I tried to deter him but he told me it was what my Mom wanted. I ended up ordering a 32GB Touchpad from Amazon for $274, which included shipping.
    ...yep, but some would want you to believe that "it is JUST a nice UI", and as such it is unimportant...

    Althought, I must say, I think she might be equally pleased with the ICS, which starts to depend heavily on gestures/webOS-ish features/look alike... Matthias Duarte's influences start showing there...
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by rlopin View Post
    Well, that is certainly a valid argument based on your experience. As for me, I bought 6 touchpads for self, wife and 3 kids (ages 8, 8 and 10), plus 1 as a backup device. I got 4 x 32 GB and 2 x 16 GB. After rebates total cost per touchpad averaged $100. I immediately bought cases and sleeves for all. Not a single crack so far. So for roughly the price of a single iPad3 I got a tablet for each family member. This is the best value I have ever had.
    I completely agree with you. Their great advantage is that they are good quality and (now) cheap.
  19. #39  
    The first and only question I asked the sales was can Kindle fire support Multilanguage...and then I walk out
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