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  1. #161  
    Quote Originally Posted by muyoso View Post
    Alright, here are a BUNCH of videos I just recorded. The ones with the Android phone in them are pretty crappy due to having to record using a 3yo Windows Mobile phone, but you will get the point.

    Here is the first one. You can see that the webOS browser does NOT open faster than Miren on Android. It opens with the task manager open on Android so I cannot be accused of cheating, yes it is that quick. Then the Android phone demolishes the Touchpad at loading Engadget. Then the Android phone shows off the instant load back and forward features that Miren has. Nice not to have to reload the webpage everytime you want to hit the back button.


    Here is the second one. In this video we start out loading precentral.net and then go to loading politico.com. Touchpad loses both easily. Then I go ahead and show the awesome panorama feature that Miren has where you can swipe left to go forward and swipe right to go back, instantly of course. Who wants to load webpages twice?


    So IDK what k4ever is talking about, but its not based on anything I have come close to observing. The Touchpads browser is awful, and there is no reason it should be. I'll had much higher quality videos comparing the ipad and Touchpad doing similar loading tests in a few minutes below.
    What Android phone are you using? I can't watch the video now. The statement was based on an 800 MHz Android Phone and the default Browser, not Miren. I also used IE 9 on the laptop and not Google Chrome, which is much faster. I purposely did not use third party browsers because there is always an argument over whether or not an average user will use anything that is not default. If you are not going to use default stuff, then why complain about patching and overclocking?
  2. #162  
    Quote Originally Posted by muyoso View Post
    So you admit after fighting it for 9 pages that the touchpad browser stinks and now you are transitioning into "well most people don't care anyway"??

    BTW, here is a Touchpad vs iPad browser test I just ran with the sites you chose. Funny thing, the iPad downloads and renders the entire politico page before the Touchpad displays its first element.

    No. The TouchPad browser is just fine. I admitted that I wasted my time in doing a browser test period. The people who it will matter to don't care. Only I cared and I only did it to reply to a post that an old 800 MHz Android phone does not easily beat a TouchPad.
  3. #163  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    The browser on the touchpad is shocking, it loads slower than the browser on my cheap $90 800mhz phone and lack basic features - it is like a browser from 2008 not 2011. The advantages of flash would be great but I had to turn it off to get the BBC website to load...

    The experience makes me more thankful for apps not less.
    Here is the original post that I replied to for clarification. BTW, it was on page 7 and not page one, so no on wasted 9 pages on this.
    Last edited by k4ever; 09/18/2011 at 08:34 PM.
  4. #164  
    muyuso, I like the title to the link, but it is inaccurate. My TouchPad is in my hands right now. Cute!

    Edit: Commented on your iPad video..
    Last edited by k4ever; 09/18/2011 at 08:21 PM.
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by muyoso View Post
    Alright, here are a BUNCH of videos I just recorded. The ones with the Android phone in them are pretty crappy due to having to record using a 3yo Windows Mobile phone, but you will get the point.

    Here is the first one. You can see that the webOS browser does NOT open faster than Miren on Android. It opens with the task manager open on Android so I cannot be accused of cheating, yes it is that quick. Then the Android phone demolishes the Touchpad at loading Engadget. Then the Android phone shows off the instant load back and forward features that Miren has. Nice not to have to reload the webpage everytime you want to hit the back button.


    Here is the second one. In this video we start out loading precentral.net and then go to loading politico.com. Touchpad loses both easily. Then I go ahead and show the awesome panorama feature that Miren has where you can swipe left to go forward and swipe right to go back, instantly of course. Who wants to load webpages twice?


    So IDK what k4ever is talking about, but its not based on anything I have come close to observing. The Touchpads browser is awful, and there is no reason it should be. I'll had much higher quality videos comparing the ipad and Touchpad doing similar loading tests in a few minutes below.
    Finally got to look at your videos. Has nothing to do with my post or the one I replied to. Miren is not the default Android browser. Also, you did not list the specs for your phone, you did not say whether or not you cleared cache, and you did not say which modes you had set in the browsers. Do you have plugins always on or plugins on demand in Miren? Do you have JavaScript enabled or off? Is your phone running the default ROM, is it over-clocked, what version of Android are you running? Is your TouchPad running 3.0.2 or is it running 3.0.0? Are patches applied or not?

    I listed all of that information in my post. If you are going to rebut me, you need to do the same. You also need to stick to the original parameters of the reply. A video does not prove anything unless we have data to back it up.
  6. #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by k4ever View Post
    Finally got to look at your videos. Has nothing to do with my post or the one I replied to. Miren is not the default Android browser. Also, you did not list the specs for your phone, you did not say whether or not you cleared cache, and you did not say which modes you had set in the browsers. Do you have plugins always on or plugins on demand in Miren? Do you have JavaScript enabled or off? Is your phone running the default ROM, is it over-clocked, what version of Android are you running? Is your TouchPad running 3.0.2 or is it running 3.0.0? Are patches applied or not?

    I listed all of that information in my post. If you are going to rebut me, you need to do the same. You also need to stick to the original parameters of the reply. A video does not prove anything unless we have data to back it up.
    Doesn't make a difference that I am not using the default Android browser, I am using an option that is available for free on Android. Give me an option that is free on WebOS and I will test it against any browser on Android or iOS. Oh thats right, there are two browsers available and they are both essentially the exact same browser.

    Flash is set to ondemand for the Android phone, OFF for the Touchpad and the iPad has no flash.

    The phone is an Epic4g single core running at 1.2ghz. The ipad is single core and running at 800mhz. The Touchpad is dual core and running at 1.512Ghz.

    No cache was cleared on any device, because I haven't been to politico or precentral at all on any of the devices. For engadget there was no need to clear the cache because I have done 3 other videos comparing devices including clearing cache and it made no difference as the Touchpad still was outclassed.

    My android phone is not running a stock rom. Is running a Froyo 2.2.1 rom. The Touchpad has all performance patches applied and is running 3.0.2.

    Basically it comes down to I am not trying to cheat in the videos at all. You want me to make another one where I do EVERYTHING EXACTLY how you want it? Where I show all the patches and show the frequency and show everything? I don't really understand what difference it would make when a single core 800mhz ipad is literally DESTROYING it in loading webpages . . . . Shouldn't even a stock 1ghz dual core beat a single core 800mhz ipad?
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by muyoso View Post
    Doesn't make a difference that I am not using the default Android browser, I am using an option that is available for free on Android. Give me an option that is free on WebOS and I will test it against any browser on Android or iOS. Oh thats right, there are two browsers available and they are both essentially the exact same browser.

    Flash is set to ondemand for the Android phone, OFF for the Touchpad and the iPad has no flash.

    The phone is an Epic4g single core running at 1.2ghz. The ipad is single core and running at 800mhz. The Touchpad is dual core and running at 1.512Ghz.

    No cache was cleared on any device, because I haven't been to politico or precentral at all on any of the devices. For engadget there was no need to clear the cache because I have done 3 other videos comparing devices including clearing cache and it made no difference as the Touchpad still was outclassed.

    My android phone is not running a stock rom. Is running a Froyo 2.2.1 rom. The Touchpad has all performance patches applied and is running 3.0.2.

    Basically it comes down to I am not trying to cheat in the videos at all. You want me to make another one where I do EVERYTHING EXACTLY how you want it? Where I show all the patches and show the frequency and show everything? I don't really understand what difference it would make when a single core 800mhz ipad is literally DESTROYING it in loading webpages . . . . Shouldn't even a stock 1ghz dual core beat a single core 800mhz ipad?
    We are going to argue over this until the Sun explodes and the last remnants of life cease to exist on this planet (if we both live that long). My reply and test was based on a statement about a 800MHz Android phone beating the TouchPad. Default browser to default browser. You expanded it to everything under the Sun. You added a C, D, and E to an A and B conversation. Even when I and others said the browser was fast enough you continued to press. For what? To prove something we already knew?

    First off, yes stock does matter. Until you can get Miren on the TouchPad you will never know if the reason your phone loads pages faster is because of Miren or because of the hardware. Plus, most users won't take the time to download another browser and their first impressions will be with the default. Just like I throttled back my TouchPad to 1.2 because most users won't overclock.

    Next, the 800MHz iPad has a great advantage over the TouchPad when displaying some pages. There are websites optimized for it. If they see the iPad's browser I'D they will display a different page. Look at your Politico page in the video. The TouchPad and the iPad each display different content. Compare each of those pages to a desktop browser. Which one is closer to what you see on the desktop? Not the iPad. You are not seeing the "real Internet" on the iPad and you never will. You will see the real Internet on the TouchPad. That matters to me. Whether or not it matters to you, I don't know.

    Edit: Back to the topic at hand. I don't feel that web site replacements are real apps. If you can use the browser to view the content there should not be a need for an app. Also, looks like some of the major app makers are agreeing and moving their content back to the web, dropping support for the application (at least on iOS).
    Last edited by k4ever; 09/18/2011 at 09:51 PM.
  8. #168  
    k4ever. The ONLY thing that matters is that the Touchpad is the slowest device I own at browsing the web even though it is by FAR the fastest hardware I owned and by FAR the most overclocked. Also, the Touchpad's browser has the fewest features while browsing which make it a painful experience.

    Also, the difference in the webpages for politico is that the iPad browser not only loaded ALL of the content, but ALSO loaded ads, while the Touchpad blocked the loading of ads and only loaded the content. Even so, the iPad STILL loads the entire page before the Touchpad could load a single pixel of content. Thats pathetic.
  9. #169  
    I just don't know how anyone can objectively say "the TouchPad's browser is fine" unless it's the only mobile browser they've ever used.

    I typed up a list of problems with it a few weeks back and, yeah, it's probably the worst mobile browser I've used to date.
  10. #170  
    Quote Originally Posted by muyoso View Post
    k4ever. The ONLY thing that matters is that the Touchpad is the slowest device I own at browsing the web even though it is by FAR the fastest hardware I owned and by FAR the most overclocked. Also, the Touchpad's browser has the fewest features while browsing which make it a painful experience.

    Also, the difference in the webpages for politico is that the iPad browser not only loaded ALL of the content, but ALSO loaded ads, while the Touchpad blocked the loading of ads and only loaded the content. Even so, the iPad STILL loads the entire page before the Touchpad could load a single pixel of content. Thats pathetic.
    I'm arguing with your perceptions and your aspects so I will lose just like you are loosing arguing with mine. I don't find the experience painful or annoying in the least. Yes the browser has few features, but that has no dampened my browser experience at all because those features don't matter to me. Tabbed browsing did matter to me because the browser cards get confusing so I got the advanced browser. I use the TouchPad's for browsing more than I use any other device by far. The only thing that bugs me is the refocusing when a new tab is opened. I find it a pleasure to use over my Android and iOS devices because I can easily switch back and forth between browsing and other tasks.

    I find it pathetic that I need an app to view something that has Flash content on it for a device that cost the same as a laptop. I also find it pathetic that I can't easily switch back and forth between running apps on a device that claims to be easy to use. All because the engineers decided that battery life was more important than functionality. I would buy a TouchPad before a netbook and a netbook before an iPad. (BTW I bought an Android tablet first, but it would come before the netbook if I had to do it over again).

    Once again the speed only matters to you and me. However since I can live with it being a tad bit slower (than the iPad) so I can see everything the web has to offer, I guess that leaves just you. Good night!
  11. #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by k4ever View Post
    I'm arguing with your perceptions and your aspects so I will lose just like you are loosing arguing with mine. I don't find the experience painful or annoying in the least. Yes the browser has few features, but that has no dampened my browser experience at all because those features don't matter to me. Tabbed browsing did matter to me because the browser cards get confusing so I got the advanced browser. I use the TouchPad's for browsing more than I use any other device by far. The only thing that bugs me is the refocusing when a new tab is opened. I find it a pleasure to use over my Android and iOS devices because I can easily switch back and forth between browsing and other tasks.

    I find it pathetic that I need an app to view something that has Flash content on it for a device that cost the same as a laptop. I also find it pathetic that I can't easily switch back and forth between running apps on a device that claims to be easy to use. All because the engineers decided that battery life was more important than functionality. I would buy a TouchPad before a netbook and a netbook before an iPad. (BTW I bought an Android tablet first, but it would come before the netbook if I had to do it over again).

    Once again the speed only matters to you and me. However since I can live with it being a tad bit slower (than the iPad) so I can see everything the web has to offer, I guess that leaves just you. Good night!
    OK, so you are conceding now that the Touchpad browser is slow. And you are conceding that the Touchpad's browser is basically featureless.

    What I find kind of funny is that you go from saying turn javascript off and flash off to make the Touchpad's browser faster in one post to now complaining about the iPad not playing flash unless you run a new app. Believe me, I don't like iOS at all, but for browsing it is miles ahead of WebOS, even if I was completely unable to play flash.

    Web Browsing should be a fairly simple thing. And the faster hardware you have generally the faster your browser should render pages given the same network speeds. All of my devices fit into this mold of slower processors rendering slower, except the Touchpad.
    Last edited by muyoso; 09/18/2011 at 11:12 PM.
  12. #172  
    I've actually been running Flash-free on my notebook for the past few months and I don't think I'm missing out on anything interesting.
  13. #173  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinsin07 View Post
    You are not joe public. You are PreCenetral poster Steep. You are part of joe public. There are 6.96 billion joe publics. Joe public is a collective. You're just a grain of sand in that number.


    Well then speaking as grain of sand number four million seven hundred and thirty six thousand two hundred and twent eight! I don't give a stuff about speed tests as long as it works :P
  14. #174  
    Quote Originally Posted by deihmos View Post
    Problem is we are not talking about micro here. For eg the tp will take over 10 seconds to launch the pdf app and quickoffice. Overclocking reducing the load time slightly but the average consumer isn't doing that . Other platforms launch these apps launch almost instantly.

    The quality of the apps is also questionable and don't talk about the prices.
    Seriously, what are you going to do with the 9.5 seconds you reckon you might save using another device?
  15. cgk
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    #175  
    Quote Originally Posted by Steep View Post
    Seriously, what are you going to do with the 9.5 seconds you reckon you might save using another device?
    Read a PDF magazine that is in focus?
  16. #176  
    Wow, you guys read what you want to to read and probably hear what you want to hear. I never said the TouchPad was faster than the iPad in browsing. In fact the iPad wasn't even part of the test so there is nothing to concede to. Chalx wrote that his/her cheap 800 MHz Android phone was faster and I replied to that. I asked you, muyosu to do a test with javascript of, because that has been ID as a bug with the TouchPad and out of curiosity to see if it would catch up to the iPad with it off. Once again it was you, not me that brought the iPad into this so why should I concede to something I never agreed to get into? Flash and multitasking matter to me which is why I don't have an iPad and it ranks very low on the devices I buy. You say you don't like iOS yet you are quick to defend it even if it wasn't even brought up in the conversation? And web browsing depends on more than just hardware. Software (ie the Browser, plug-ins, etc) and network speeds also play a major factor. You know this ready because you chose to use Miren vs the default browser on Android and if you are smart you have a good wifi router on a good ISP. I bet you use Chrome or Firefox instead of IE 9 also. Chill out and quit trying to get people to admit to stuff YOU brought up in a conversation that did not include your device.
  17. cgk
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    #177  
    Chalx wrote that his/her cheap 800 MHz Android phone was faster and I replied to that.
    Em no that was me.
  18. #178  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Em no that was me.
    That's right, I apologize.
  19. #179  
    Quote Originally Posted by HansTWN View Post
    For the giant ipod they call the iPad apps are indeed everything. After all, iOS is nothing but an app launcher. The Touchpad (especially with Ubuntu) is more like a computer, you can always find a way to work around it. Case in point -- no Zinio app, no Newspaperdirect --- but I can make them both work in Ubuntu. Yes, "finding a work-around" is not what most people want. But with Apple products, if the powers that be have decided that something shouldn't work, then there is no way to make it work --- or at least you need major surgery to to it.

    Would I love to have more apps? Yes, of course. But not website apps. Website apps usually offer a lot less than the full website versions. And if someone offered me an Ipad2 in exchange for my Touchpad (and I wasn't allowed to sell the iPad!) I would not want it. WebOS is so much more enjoyable to use than the iPad. Apple has created a dumbed down and locked down OS for technophobes. Just turning WiFi on and off takes 6 clicks. Slow and inefficient -- the only point is to make it as simple as possible. A brilliant decision from a marketing point of view since those technophobes are a vast untapped market.

    In general I avoid apps whenever I can -- most of them are just a way of locking you into a system or to make up for lacking functionality.

    So if somebody is into gaming, then forget the Touchpad. Browsing on the Touchpad is far superior to the Ipad2, though.
    ALL OSes are 'app launchers' (software launchers). Otherwise it's just a dumb piece of hardware with no functionality. Your browser is an 'app', so is everything else. And in fact, apps add functionality, not reduce it, as most flash websites arent' designed for touchscreen interface or to maximize the real estate of a smaller screen. You use apps just like everyone else. You just happened to be satisfied with adding nothing to your tablet experience other than the browser app.
    sinsin07 likes this.
  20. #180  
    Quote Originally Posted by snorri788 View Post
    The iPad is a status symbol. People buy them because other people have them and they want to keep up with the joneses. I know quite a few people that bought them and said "I wanted one, but I don't know why".

    I agree that the iPad wouldn't be so successful without content (apps). However, the number of apps on a platform doesn't mean much. It's all very well touting hundreds of thousands of apps but consider.

    You can't have ALL of them on your device at the same time
    Some are rubbish
    Most you would never use

    Touchpad has the essentials and nothing more. I don't need thousands of games, and I don't want to have to look for decent apps in a crowd of fart soundboards and sex guides. Plus there are so many websites that have mobile versions which negates the need for an app. And the touchpad has flash, so I don't need to have BBC iPlayer and other streaming apps, because I can just go straight to the site.
    TouchPad doesn't even have the essentials and what it does have are often times very buggy beta releases or quick ports from the phone apps that translate to the bigger screen for crap.
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