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  1.    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by toy4x4 View Post
    Absolutely have to disagree with this.

    You expect HP to man every BestBuy store because BestBuy hires part-time lumps? Where does it then stop? Walmart also? Target? AT&T?

    Now if you had made the suggestion that HP needs to open it's own HP Store like Apple and have competent staff there, then that would be a suggestion (that will never happen in mass)
    If HP wasn't interested in truly educating the people who would be selling the device, then it's their fault. And the store display models weren't even equipped with a fully functional version of WebOS, hence crippling a salesperson's ability to show off WebOS, even if they wanted to.
  2. #22  
    I'm wondering how the TouchPad is selling in the Philippines? If they are playing Manny's commercial, I'm thinking sales would be better than the general world public sales.
    Sent from my slowly diminishing intellect

    I'm just a soul who's intentions are good...oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood!

    libray likes this.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    I think Occam's Razor applies here. The simple answer could be people just don't want to pay hundreds of dollars for a tablet running a niche operating system, lacking in the apps they want to use, and is bulkier than the competition.
    I'd be more likely to buy that explanation if I was at all confident that, in the brick-and-mortar setting, people--including the reps, unfortunately-- were actually encouraged to check out the TP, hold in their hands, and informed about cards, stacks, phone calls via BT, Beats, Flash, Preware, . . .

    But I'm not. At all. And that's not an assignment of blame--it's a defense of the quality and innovation of webOS.
    Last edited by grappler; 08/17/2011 at 02:24 PM.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by grappler View Post
    I'd be more likely to buy that explanation if I was at all confident that, in the brick-and-mortar setting, people--including the reps, unfortunately-- were actually encouraged to check out the TP, hold in their hands, and informed about cards, stacks, phone calls via BT, Beats, Flash, Preware, . . .

    But I'm not. At all. And that's not an assignment of blame--it's a defense of the quality and innovation of webOS.
    You know, I can see that. The problem is I have a sneaking suspicion those are esoteric (and certainly complicated) features that, while differentiate webOS from the competition, aren't very meaningful to end users.
    chalx likes this.
  5. #25  
    Just posted a mirror image of your post in another thread, regarding sales and Best Buy. The sales floor is full of idiots, they are ignorant to 99% of what Best Buy sells. If they are an Apple ******, or PS2 ****** they can tell you every detail, and will direct you, guide you to the product so they can impress you with their knowledge. In 2 Best Buy stores here, I asked 3 associates where I could see an HP TouchPad, and they asked me what is that! Electronic/computer associates, not large appliance people. There has been a huge failure by HP to market the Touchpad and Webos. Watch the Apple ads on TV and compare them to HP's stupid I'll entertain you ad. You want to go buy an iPad2 after watching the kid learn his penmanship so smoothly on the iPad. This is the kind of advertising HP needs to be doing. Put the blame where it belongs, HP. If they don't learn and quickly about marketing and finishing a sale, the TouchPad is head for the Palm highway.

    Quote Originally Posted by YankBoy View Post
    People blamed poor Pre/Plus/2 sales on providers not pushing the device enough and not knowing enough about WebOS. Now people want to blame Best Buy for shooting down the TP. Have any of you been into a carrier store (VZW, Sprint, AT&T, etc) or a Best Buy lately? The people working there are NOT tech wizards. They don't hire electrical and computer engineers to work the sales floor at Best Buy. Go into Best Buy and ask someone about anything...cell phone, camera, flash drive, Dyson Air Multiplier...and you'll get a pretty vague, generic response. UNLESS they happen to own one of whatever it is you're asking about, then they'll tell you about theirs. Every time I have gone to buy ANY electronic (phone, laptop, whatever) I've learned more in my online research than the sales staff in the store knows. I've never, never, never, never had a salesperson be able to give me a thoughtful overview of all my options. There's really no reason they should be able to either. Unless it's your full-time job to keep up with mobile platforms or emerging computing technologies, it's pretty impossible to do. And this isn't a criticism of those workers. It's not their job to know the ins and outs of every operating system or technology. Many are just working part-time to make extra money or working their way through college. A friend of mine was hired at a Best Buy, having never sold an electronic device in his life, and in less than a week, he was selling $2,000 televisions to people. He didn't know the first thing, other than what any average Joe could find out online. If HP's plan was to put the fate of TP sales into the hands of the average worker at Best Buy, then that is HP's mistake. I'm not mad at some part-time employee at Best Buy for not knowing all the nitty gritty details of WebOS. When you factor on top of that the fact that the TP models on display were horribly crippled, all of the blame falls onto HP for this one.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    I think Occam's Razor applies here. The simple answer could be people just don't want to pay hundreds of dollars for a tablet running a niche operating system, lacking in the apps they want to use, and is bulkier than the competition.
    I think it's something different. People that don't own the device will come on and pretend there's no interest, then explain to those that do own it why there's no interest. Even the article that spawned all of this was written by a guy that who has made a career in writing about Apple products. Plus, he wrote the article with outrageous numbers (that just don't work, but that's a different topic) and absolutely no verification of the information.

    Instead of "Occam's Razor", how about we call it iPhan's Misdirection?
    If you type PreCentral on a TouchPad
    It changes to PreMenstrual
    That situation needs to be fixed!
    IGNTNUNLMTD and hrminer92 like this.
  7. #27  
    Do you think the TouchPad is selling well, hparsons? Do you have information that contradicts the Wall Street Journal's article?
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    It's not just Best Buy though. There's another report out that says HP sold 100 (one hundred!) TouchPads in the UK since launch.
    And both reports are completely unverified.

    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    At some point you have to take a step back and objectively consider why the TouchPad isn't selling. Were you surprised when the PlayBook flopped? Probably not, right? I mean, who wants to pay a few hundred bucks for a tablet running an operating system that nobody supports? Outside of webOS enthusiast communities, the TouchPad is the exact same thing.
    Except that there are multiple reports showing that it is selling. Of course, let's ignore those, and concentrate on spreading the negative. After all, that's what some folks are here for, right?
    If you type PreCentral on a TouchPad
    It changes to PreMenstrual
    That situation needs to be fixed!
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by YankBoy View Post
    If HP wasn't interested in truly educating the people who would be selling the device, then it's their fault. And the store display models weren't even equipped with a fully functional version of WebOS, hence crippling a salesperson's ability to show off WebOS, even if they wanted to.
    Try reading Tim Stiffler-Dean's most recent Tweets. Best Buy has been REFUSING employee training.

    They also do a crap job of maintaining the devices in-store.

    Best Buy sucks, and this debacle IS mostly their fault.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by wencyjr View Post
    yeah, it does sound a little much. how many best buys locations are there? 1,300 or so? that's like 200 units per store! sounds like bad inventory management. i'm not a business major but i thought JIT is the thing to do nowadays...

    when i called my costco, they said they were expecting 20 units.
    Here's my suspicion - there is likely some truth to the article (which would explain why there are no flat out denials by HP), but the bozo of a "writer" got details wrong. I doubt very seriously if Best Buy (or any single retailer for that matter) "took delivery" of 270,000 units. I suspect that's pretty close to the total that HP has produced so far.

    I suspect that there was a negotiated deal between HP and Best Buy to purchase that number during the next several months, and that deal is now what is in jeopardy, and now having to be managed by HP.

    Does it mean that sales are less than what HP would like? Yeah, most likely. Does that mean that there's justification for the doom and gloom pronounced by some, and/or that HP is about to (or should) drop webOS? I seriously doubt it. I suspect HP has a long term plan that they are committed to with webOS, and won't deviate from that plan unless there's a major disaster (and no, this ain't it). Yes, they'll do course corrections along the way, but I'm sure their long term goal is still in their sights.

    So, back to the more specific question at hand, are "less than desireable sales" of the TouchPad in general the fault of Best Buy? Nope.

    However, are poor sales at Best Buy the fault of Best Buy - Yes, most likely. I say that with confidence because one only needs to look at a small competitor to see a different result - Staples.

    Staples sold out, meaning they sold more than they anticipated. Best Buy did not, meaning they sold less than they anticipated. Why? Are Staples employees better trained (not in my experience). Are their displays better? Well, my limited experience varies, Best Buy has better displays, but the Staples I've seen seem to have their TouchPads better "kept" - they're working and look like the employees are interested. But, the one major thing I've seen different is price - Staples priced theirs to sell, and they did.
    If you type PreCentral on a TouchPad
    It changes to PreMenstrual
    That situation needs to be fixed!
    IGNTNUNLMTD and VCI_Cell like this.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    HP could definitely do a better job of defining what the TouchPad is and giving us a reason to buy it. I see the Pacman and Lea Michelle commercials a couple times a day but they don't show any functionality that can't be done on an iPad.
    I think you're a bit too focused on the iPad. There are enough people that haven't bought an iPad, that have shown zero interesting in an iPad, to make the TouchPad successful. There's no reason for HP to concentrate on iPads when selling their tablet.

    As a matter of fact, I think that type of selling, especially at this point in the TouchPad's existence, would be a fatal mistake. You don't match a new product/ecosystem head to head with an established one.
    If you type PreCentral on a TouchPad
    It changes to PreMenstrual
    That situation needs to be fixed!
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    You know, I can see that. The problem is I have a sneaking suspicion those are esoteric (and certainly complicated) features that, while differentiate webOS from the competition, aren't very meaningful to end users.
    Lots of things that seem esoteric in writing are revealed as completely cool when seen in a live user scenario.

    That's why Apple's ads are effective. They do an excellent job of showing what a device *does.*

    And it wouldn't be difficult to show what a TP does better than an iPad (and vice versa, if you needed to in a sales situation). Just hit a popular Flash site on both tablets--worth a thousand words.

    (LOL. I just had go stop typing to take a call from my Veer on the TouchPad. Case in point!)

    The other night I was reading a book on the TP Kindle app that makes frequent references to geography. Unfortunately the map in the Kindle version is too badly rendered and small to be of much use. Then I remembered I could just fire up Bing and stack it right behind Kindle and switch between them whenever I needed to. A pretty elegant experience, but better done or seen in person than read or heard about.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    I think you're a bit too focused on the iPad. There are enough people that haven't bought an iPad, that have shown zero interesting in an iPad, to make the TouchPad successful. There's no reason for HP to concentrate on iPads when selling their tablet.

    As a matter of fact, I think that type of selling, especially at this point in the TouchPad's existence, would be a fatal mistake. You don't match a new product/ecosystem head to head with an established one.
    In the end, the TouchPad is the same class of product as the iPad, selling in the same stores and frequently displayed side by side with the iPad at similar price points. If someone walks into a store wanting to buy a tablet that runs apps, browses the web, does a little bit of email, and enables things like video calling, the iPad is every bit as viable an option as the TouchPad. It's just too big of an elephant for HP to avoid.
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Except that there are multiple reports showing that it is selling.
    Link please.

    ---
    galaxy tab tapatalk
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    Do you think the TouchPad is selling well, hparsons? Do you have information that contradicts the Wall Street Journal's article?
    I think I said just the opposite. However, I've noticed that there's a tendency for those that are interested in other products to concentrate on the negative, and ignore the positive.

    The article about Best Buy is a perfect example. It mentioned the Woot offer, but totally ignored the fact that one could match the Woot offer at any brick and morter store, and beat it by $100 at Staples. It also ignored the very pertinent bit of data that Staples virtually sold out nation-wide.

    And yes, I see the exact same sort of nonsense being done here.

    iPhan Misdirection - I think I'm beginning to like that.
    If you type PreCentral on a TouchPad
    It changes to PreMenstrual
    That situation needs to be fixed!
    Rockbeast likes this.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by clevin View Post
    Link please.
    Do a quick Google search for Staples and "sold out".
    If you type PreCentral on a TouchPad
    It changes to PreMenstrual
    That situation needs to be fixed!
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Do a quick Google search for Staples and "sold out".
    Lol, we dont even know how many staple stocked touchpad, there is no numbers there, and thats your evidence of "multiple report of selling well"?

    By that standard, hp slate sold great! Even if it only sold 9000 in total.

    ---
    galaxy tab tapatalk
  18. #38  
    My local BB has the TP front and center on its own table as you enter the area for tablets. They are doing their best to get it out there. Problem is the ipad display is a few feet away with a nice big display and two ipads loaded with tons of games and Apps. People need to realize that the tablet market is the ipod market all over again.
  19. Hobbz's Avatar
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    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Do a quick Google search for Staples and "sold out".
    ummmm... Staples could be sold out because they didn't order very many and/or they had a huge sale on them.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    I think I said just the opposite. However, I've noticed that there's a tendency for those that are interested in other products to concentrate on the negative, and ignore the positive.

    The article about Best Buy is a perfect example. It mentioned the Woot offer, but totally ignored the fact that one could match the Woot offer at any brick and morter store, and beat it by $100 at Staples. It also ignored the very pertinent bit of data that Staples virtually sold out nation-wide.

    And yes, I see the exact same sort of nonsense being done here.

    iPhan Misdirection - I think I'm beginning to like that.
    Do we know how many units Staples sold? We have exact numbers from Woot. We have 2 sources from Best Buy that reported numbers in the same ballpark to the Wall Street Journal. It could just be "iPhan misdirection," though.

    I guess it's possible that Arik Hesseldahl is an iPhan intent on spreading Apple propaganda. I guess it's also possible that Derek Kesseler is secretly an iPhan who gleefully spreads the same story on the front page of PreCentral. Stephen DeWitt could actually be an iPhan who cut the price of the TouchPad after a month to create the perception that the product isn't selling. It might even be possible that Context doesn't actually track UK channel data and is actually a clandestine PRPRPR $firm$ $on$ $Apple$'$s$ $payroll$. $It$'$s$ $much$ $easier$ $to$ $blame$ $things$ $on$ &$quot$;$iPhan$ $misdirection$&$quot$; $than$ $to$ $considering$ $the$ $alternative$, $after$ $all$.
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