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  1.    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by timeweb2 View Post
    This has been my mantra forever - not just about Flash but overall - if the Web features are truly up to par and nearly everything works then there is zero need for apps! They exist only to make up for the glaring incompatibilities of the browser. The more you need to install (and often buy) the more it shows your web side is not up to snuff.
    That's exactly the point I was really trying to make, you nailed it. Flash on the Touchpad may not be perfect, but it's getting pretty close. Also (possibly thanks to pressure because of the iPad's lack of Flash/the growth of HTML 5) Flash 10.3 is a LONG way ahead of where it used to be. Remember trying to watch Hulu on Flash 9? *shivers*. I can only see flash getting smoother if they want fo stick around, which I'm sure they do. All the better for us.
  2. #22  
    flash is severely underrated. Its also a bummer that HP couldnt get it running well on review units because it runs like a dream. I havent found a flash site yet that gets my touchpad to stutter. A lot of the website I frequent use flash to embed audio/video content.... Sites that would NEED an app on the ipad.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by timeweb2 View Post
    This has been my mantra forever - not just about Flash but overall - if the Web features are truly up to par and nearly everything works then there is zero need for apps!
    These comments usually come from individuals who use devices with little in the way of 3rd party apps.

    Show me a flashed based game that is as good as the best native games for iOS, Android, and WP7.

    Show me a flashed based IM or communicator app that can tap into the notifications system of every mobile device

    Show me a flashed based video editing app that is as good as iMovie, or Reeldirector

    Show me a flashed based Photo app that allows me to use all the onboard features of my phones camera

    I can sit here all day and do this. Flash doesn't replace anything but terrible games, battery killing video, and outdated websites.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    Really? Since you're trying to dispute what I'm saying here, please provide evidence to back it up.
    Flash Player: CPU Hog or Hot Tamale? It Depends.

    Keep in mind this was pre-stage-video optimizations. My day job more than qualifies me on the subject as well.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    These comments usually come from individuals who use devices with little in the way of 3rd party apps.

    Show me a flashed based game that is as good as the best native games for iOS, Android, and WP7.

    Show me a flashed based IM or communicator app that can tap into the notifications system of every mobile device

    Show me a flashed based video editing app that is as good as iMovie, or Reeldirector

    Show me a flashed based Photo app that allows me to use all the onboard features of my phones camera

    I can sit here all day and do this. Flash doesn't replace anything but terrible games, battery killing video, and outdated websites.
    Thanks, Steve. I wasn't aware of that.
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  6.    #26  
    I don't think we are really saying Flash is necessarily better than having a standalone app in all cases. I would love to have a great app for many things I use, and there are some great ones out there. That said, I am sure that for a lot of people, like me, the web Flash versions are quite functional and don't leave me frustrated and unable to do what I want, wishing for an app. Flash also saves me money on apps. Web versions are free, many apps are not. 0.99 cents may not be much, but over just 100 apps, that's $99, and honestly like others have said, many of those (not all) are less functional than their web counterparts.

    It's like on my PC, I choose to use Windows Security Essentials instead of paying for a better alternative. It may not be the best, but as many tech sites have stated, more than once, it IS good enough to make spending money on something else unnecessary for most people.

    I have faith it isn't going to matter eventually anyway, since apps will come. But in the meantime, having Flash is a great way to survive until then.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post
    Thanks, Steve. I wasn't aware of that.
    Dispute it if you can.
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by lukehale View Post
    It may not be the best, but as many tech sites have stated, more than once, it IS good enough to make spending money on something else unnecessary for most people.
    Golly, I hope this doesn't become HPs marketing motto. "Flash apps may not be the best, but it is good enough"
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Dispute it if you can.
    Ok.

    Let's talk about the millions of bussinesses that doesn't need/want to have the lastest technology in their websites, and currently uses flash for their frontpage, because it looks better than traditional HTML, and don't plan to change their webpages in the next 5/7/10 years because:

    a) there is no need to do it
    b) because of a) they're not going to spend money/time on it

    Or let's talk about website development companies that use flash (yeah, there is people using flash for development out there) to do their work.

    Or let's talk about all the companies/individuals that hire that companies to do their pages.

    Not everything in the world is Facebook, or Apple. There are companies that use the web as a resource/tool, not as their main revenue source, and that's a much larger # than those social networks/media sources the iPad owners put as example. Those companies are now with flash, and will stay with flash at least 5 years more.
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    lukehale likes this.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post
    Ok.

    Let's talk about the millions of bussinesses that doesn't need/want to have the lastest technology in their websites, and currently uses flash for their frontpage, because it looks better than traditional HTML, and don't plan to change their webpages in the next 5/7/10 years because:

    a) there is no need to do it
    b) because of a) they're not going to spend money/time on it

    Or let's talk about website development companies that use flash (yeah, there is people using flash for development out there) to do their work.

    Or let's talk about all the companies/individuals that hire that companies to do their pages.

    Not everything in the world is Facebook, or Apple. There are companies that use the web as a resource/tool, not as their main revenue source, and that's a much larger # than those social networks/media sources the iPad owners put as example. Those companies are now with flash, and will stay with flash at least 5 years more.
    I thought we were talking about the lack of need for native apps because flash based websites do just as good a job? You failed to dispute any of my examples that I gave where the flash experience cannot match a native app.

    I'm not saying flash doesn't have its place (though as a OSX and Linux user I can try to make this argument).
  11.    #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Golly, I hope this doesn't become HPs marketing motto. "Flash apps may not be the best, but it is good enough"
    Well I can definitely get behind that statement. No one wants to just have "good enough". But again, not the point of my last post. If you notice the last part of what i said, I want the same thing everyone else does. Lots of great apps. But having Flash defintely makes the transition a heck of a lot more bearable, and for most people who are happy with their Touchpads, dare we even say enjoyable?
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by lukehale View Post
    Well I can definitely get behind that statement. No one wants to just have "good enough". But again, not the point of my last post. If you notice the last part of what i said, I want the same thing everyone else does. Lots of great apps. But having Flash defintely makes the transition a heck of a lot more bearable, and for most people who are happy with their Touchpads, dare we even say enjoyable?
    Ok, I guess we can agree to disagree. I will take awesome native apps the use the all the onboard features of my device that the sdk allows.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    I thought we were talking about the lack of need for native apps because flash based websites do just as good a job? You failed to dispute any of my examples that I gave where the flash experience cannot match a native app.
    Each one of those websites should need a native app on iOS. Being able to visit those sites isn't a good job?
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  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by deCorvett View Post
    Each one of those websites should need a native app on iOS. Being able to visit those sites isn't a good job?
    sigh. scroll up. look at the examples I gave. Show me a flash app that can match.
  15.    #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Ok, I guess we can agree to disagree. I will take awesome native apps the use the all the onboard features of my device that the sdk allows.
    Not sure how we are disagreeing. . . We both want lots of great apps, so no disagreement there. I assume you mean we disagree about the interim value of Flash capability? Fair enough, i can accept that.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by lukehale View Post
    Not sure how we are disagreeing. . . We both want lots of great apps, so no disagreement there. I assume you mean we disagree about the interim value of Flash capability? Fair enough, i can accept that.
    This is the problem I have with Flash. I just dont think any flash app will be able to access the unique features of your TouchPad the way a native app can. Perhaps I'm wrong but I dont see how a flash app can use the great notification system of the Touchpad. Maybe I'm wrong but I dont think there are any flash apps that can use the TouchPad front facing camera. Etc.
  17.    #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    This is the problem I have with Flash. I just dont think any flash app will be able to access the unique features of you TouchPad the way a native app can. Perhaps I'm wrong but I dont see how a flash app can use the great notification system of the Touchpad. Maybe I'm wrong but I dont think there are any flash apps that can use the TouchPAd front facing camera. Etc.
    Perhaps not. But then again flash is an aplication/plugin, so if HP really wanted to I am sure they could give it more system integration, but I don't see it happening, at least not as long as the number of apps grows.

    As far as the camera, Flash has long had the ability to access your webcam on PCs, I see no reason it shouldn't be able to on the Touchpad.

    Again, Apps would be better, but that doesn't automatically render Flash useless or of no value.
  18.    #38  
    I may sound like some sort of crazy Flash lover, defintely not. I strongly hope such a thing doesn't exist, lol. But Flash integration on the Touchpad IS a differentiator, so why not treat it as such?
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    These comments usually come from individuals who use devices with little in the way of 3rd party apps.

    Show me a flashed based game that is as good as the best native games for iOS, Android, and WP7.

    Show me a flashed based IM or communicator app that can tap into the notifications system of every mobile device

    Show me a flashed based video editing app that is as good as iMovie, or Reeldirector

    Show me a flashed based Photo app that allows me to use all the onboard features of my phones camera

    I can sit here all day and do this. Flash doesn't replace anything but terrible games, battery killing video, and outdated websites.
    I didnt think the argument was ever that flash based apps could replace native ones such as those that you've stated. To my knowledge webOS doesnt even run flash "apps" The argument was that a majority of ios apps exist in app format because content providers had no other way of providing ios users their content. Webos can provide such content w/o an app.

    I dont need a cnn app, or a ny times app, or a comedy central app, or a hulu app, etc... There is a need for native apps, but not hundreds of thousands of them.
    Last edited by Mhunterjr; 07/06/2011 at 06:38 PM.
    lukehale likes this.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    sigh. scroll up. look at the examples I gave. Show me a flash app that can match.
    Flash is intended for web content, not local apps. Don't move the target of Flash (and this debate) just to get your statements valid, with examples evidently unreachable.

    If you want, show me an electrician that can paint better than Picasso. Maybe there are a couple of them, but they're exceptions, because they aren't intended to do it.
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