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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Plus, you can bet that the pre-release TouchPads all had internal logging turned on.
    How do you know that?

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  2. #62  
    Logging should be turned off for demonstration units. Its ruining user experience and damage impression. And what they have to log at demonstrations when all presenters are doing same routine with kungfu panda, email app, plain falling into water...?

    There's always some kind words for sloppiness like - logging is turned on, apps are not precompiled etc.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by chalx View Post
    There's always some kind words for sloppiness like - logging is turned on, apps are not precompiled etc.
    And unfortunately they are usually true.
  4. #64  
    The TouchPad is not released yet, and so the app catalog has not been turned on yet for them. I heard this from a reliable source. :-)
  5. #65  
    Very nice, I knew the touchpad would be refined for its true speed on all newer devices. I pre-ordered min on the 19th from Best Buy with little to no problem. Now its time to update my current apps and possibly start moving the PreFox over and optimize it.

    I am excited to finally get rid of my iFad.
    16 Candles, The Breakfast Club SB, Friday SB, App Catalog Fix, Palm Pre/Pixi - USB Modem, TMC Workaround, SCRIM Changing OTF

    The fastest way to install Preware on your WebOS device.
    Put your device in Developer mode.
    From your PC download the Preware installer from http://get.preware.org
    Run the Preware installer while the WebOS device is connected with the USB cable to your PC.
    Vualla Preware is installed.]
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by clevin View Post
    How do you know that?

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
    I didn't say "I know" any thing. I said you can bet on it. You might lose, but you can bet on it (but you'd probably win that bet).

    Of course, a number of folks on here have been beta testers for a number of different devices (and OS's, and software for that matter). I know from personal experience (testing dozens of pieces of software, operating systems, and devices) that when a system can have logging turned on, turning it on is part of the beta process.

    WebOS can have logging turned on.

    From there, it's deductive reasoning.
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    I didn't say "I know" any thing. I said you can bet on it. You might lose, but you can bet on it (but you'd probably win that bet).

    Of course, a number of folks on here have been beta testers for a number of different devices (and OS's, and software for that matter). I know from personal experience (testing dozens of pieces of software, operating systems, and devices) that when a system can have logging turned on, turning it on is part of the beta process.

    WebOS can have logging turned on.

    From there, it's deductive reasoning.
    It's one thing to log things when they beta testing it. It's another to intentional slow down the performance when they try to demonstrate to potential larger audience.

    Former is reasonable, latter is stupidity.

    And I got your anwser, you were guessing, albeit with an impression of "certainty".

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  8. #68  
    regarding lag, I cannot say that it's "faster" than android. In fact, navigating, animations, seems to be sub android (compared to the galaxy tab 10.1) But what WebOS can do that Android can only *DREAM* of is it's awesome multi-tasking.

    But this thread is about lag. Of course, You put it next to an iPad, the iPad will for sure seem faster. Not just opening and closing speed, but the animation, and how fast the screen can keep up with your fingers. Of course, this is nit picking, but it is what it is. I mean, who cares if you can zoom in and zoom out really quick on the iPad right? Who cares you can swipe 10 pictures in 1 second right?

    The only other OS I see doing this is Windows Phone 7, or their Metro UI. However, it still lacks the intuitive Multi-tasking that WebOS offers. Anyways, in terms of lag, WebOS still needs that Hardware Accelerated UI, otherwise it's just in the same boat as Android OS.
  9. #69  
    Um, WebOS 3.0 already has hardware accelerated UI.
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by clevin View Post
    ...
    And I got your anwser, you were guessing, albeit with an impression of "certainty".

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
    Actually, it sounds like you "got" nothing. There's a difference between a guess, and an educated guess.

    A guess would be something like, determining that HP isn't allowing 16gb devices in stores simply because the person guessing didn't know about any 2 weeks ahead of time.

    An educated guess would be someone that's actually beta tested devices in the past, some from Palm, as well as software from HP, making a guess based on past experience.

    But I can only wonder, if you knew I was guess, and I never said I "knew", why did you ask me how I knew. Why not ask me why I was guessing that way?
  11. #71  
    Lag Schmag!! Who are we kidding with some of the arguments on this thread (and soon to come from everywhere else)? The only TRUE way to see if it lags compared to the ipad and android tablets are to place the TouchPad, iPad, and Galaxy 10.1 (seems to be the best android tablet) in a head-to-head real world test. Each tablet is to have a confident user at the helm and must complete this test with the user that completes all of them first winning:
    1-Compose 3 separate emails, each with one of the following-one where you have to open and attach 1 link to a webpage, one where you link a youtube video, and one with an attached photo/video from the gallery
    2-Complete the first level of Angry Birds (assuming TouchPad will have it at lauch) or a similar game
    3-Update your twitter feed with "Done!!!" when you have finished

    This my friends answers the REAL question of which tablet lags!! I'm out!!
    Sincerely,

    Dwight Shrute
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by DwightShrute View Post
    Lag Schmag!! Who are we kidding with some of the arguments on this thread (and soon to come from everywhere else)? The only TRUE way to see if it lags compared to the ipad and android tablets are to place the TouchPad, iPad, and Galaxy 10.1 (seems to be the best android tablet) in a head-to-head real world test. Each tablet is to have a confident user at the helm and must complete this test with the user that completes all of them first winning:
    1-Compose 3 separate emails, each with one of the following-one where you have to open and attach 1 link to a webpage, one where you link a youtube video, and one with an attached photo/video from the gallery
    2-Complete the first level of Angry Birds (assuming TouchPad will have it at lauch) or a similar game
    3-Update your twitter feed with "Done!!!" when you have finished

    This my friends answers the REAL question of which tablet lags!! I'm out!!
    I'd be up for this challenge. I call doing it on the iPad 2.
  13. #73  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    I'd be up for this challenge. I call doing it on the iPad 2.
    Well considering the following "challenge" will prove webOS's superiority every time against superiors spec'd phones no less. I'd wager significantly that with the TPad being the most powerful device ever, (and ALSO more powerful than iP2) that this came challenge will prove webOS 3.0's superiority even further.

    Quote Originally Posted by Me
    Proof of webOS multitasking superiority over iOS can be seen in a little game I play with colleagues during lunch I call the "Super Task Challenge". It really ****es iPhone users off!

    The Rules:

    *You need two helpers that can text and email mobile, a Pre, and an iPhone (the contestants)

    The goal is for the contestants to start a game and finish the level while getting several "multitasking" requests from the helpers.

    1. Start the game and play the same level (Need for Speed, Asphalt5, Angry Birds what ever, as long as both have it)
    2. Helpers send both a text asking to email some information from the web.
    3. Contestants will open the text and get the information to look up.
    4. Google the information.
    5. Copy it into a new email to the helper and send
    6. Reply to the text stating the email is sent.
    7. Finish the level of the game.
    8. First one done wins.

    Pre has won 100% of probably 18 or 19 rematches and it amazes everyone at the table and really cheeses off the iUsers. It's great! I "sold" 3 Pre's to others who were very impressed with the Pre and still are.

  14. #74  
    I call it doing it on the TouchP...

    Arrghhh!!!! SCHRUUUUUUUUTE!!
  15. #75  
    I have the only test the matters to me below.

    1. Use the only tablet my work will allow on the network - Touch Pad
  16. #76  
    maybe people are perceiving "lag" in different categories. I'm talking about keeping up with how quickly your finger moves! (Pinching and zooming, navigating around a web page, swiping to change pictures, scrolling, etc.)

    this might even fall short on blackberry's playbook... Someone test out hulu! let's see if hulu got rid of compatibility compatibility!

    also, how is flash performance on touchpad? is it as good as the playbooks?
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by VCI_Cell View Post
    The lag characteristic of webOS is something that's always interested me. I've heard a lot of folks say it's a result of webOS not being written in compiled language, but then other folks come along and say there's no reason an interpreted-language-based OS can't be as buttery smooth as a compiled one, given enough optimization.

    Not sure who to believe.

    One thing seems true: no matter how much processing power you throw at webOS, some parts of it always seem laggy.
    The problem with webOS is that most of the apps written are in Javascript, which is a single-threaded and blocking scripting language.

    What does this mean? Let me give you a bit of background first.

    When a program is running on any OS, it uses what we call "threads" to do processing on. With native code (C++, Obj-C, etc), you can use more than one thread to do processing. This is very important because the updating of the UI is on its own thread, and if a developer does not use another thread, all processing and UI updating is done on the same thread. So, any processing you do "blocks" the UI from updating, so you get a perceived lag in the interface.

    Normally, the code we write runs very fast and the UI can update a few milliseconds later even on the same thread, which makes things feel very fluid and non-laggy. However, when you start doing complex processing on the same thread as the UI, the UI has to wait until the processing is complete in order to receive any updates/redraw. For example, in the webOS email client, when you click on an email and the app tries to get all of the details, it often hiccups a bit in the UI because it is doing processing on the same thread. This problem exists all over webOS, but there are ways to reduce and nearly eliminate the problem.

    One way is to use AJAX to do file I/O on the device. Because AJAX is inherently asynchronous, it does not block the UI thread to fetch data. This is how webOS can pull down data from a web site without pausing the entire device.

    Second, using the PDK or developing a hybrid app. Since the PDK is compiled, native code, you can spawn and create new threads that do not block the UI thread. You can have long running operations and still keep the UI nice and speedy. With most devices now capable of using hybrid apps, I really hope to see more of them.

    So yeah, webOS will be a little more "laggy" due to the inherit problem of using Javascript as its primary language, but as HTML standards improve and give us more tools, this can be eliminated. One of HTML 5's new features is "Web Workers," which let devs use background threads (non-UI threads) to do processing, which will greatly speed up and reduce the little bit of lag apparent in any Javascript-oriented application.
    Developer of:

    -------------------------------------
    Discuss my apps in my developer forum
  18. #78  
    I haven't read the previous pages of this thread but i wanted to chime in and say that today i played with a demo unit at a Walmart in Ohio.

    It was VERY fast and ran great. There was one point where something happened with the demonstration video thingy where it kept trying to take over the touchpad even though i was using it and this did cause it to lag severely to the point of me needing to restart it. but i think it was because of that stupid demonstration video that it happened.

    i connected up with freetether and bluetooth and my phone pair instantly and was taking and making phone calls right away. internet through my phone with freetether was fast and work just as i had hoped.
  19. #79  
    now hulu!
  20. #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kev1000000 View Post
    Second, using the PDK or developing a hybrid app. Since the PDK is compiled, native code, you can spawn and create new threads that do not block the UI thread. You can have long running operations and still keep the UI nice and speedy. With most devices now capable of using hybrid apps, I really hope to see more of them.
    Right. So why HP programers are not using this approach for programing all their, generic apps bundled with TouchPad or any other WebOS device? Why? Palm's reason was lack of time and promise that all apps within WebOS will be rewritten one day. Now HP is making same shortcuts using easier and faster approach.
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